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bulking routine

lee b

New member
i have been training for about 3 years without much gains. i weigh 165 but i hav a bit of fat on my abs and chest. i have decided i am going to bulk and try and pack on some serious muscle. this will be my first proper bulking cycle so i would like a bit of help please.
Could one of you guys give me an example weights routine, for eaxample wat kinda split to use,wat kind of reps etc?
Thanks.
 
These two have been used very successfully on this forum and around the world in one form or another over the past 30 years. You'll find variations in use anywhere from novice to elite athletes (obviously the protocol will vary significantly but the base layout is similar). It will make you brutally strong in a hypertrophy range so if you eat enough to support growth (i.e. caloric excess is present), you will get much bigger without worrying about it. Even on sub maintenance diets this has seen some fair success at body recomposition even at lower bodyfat levels (like go2failure who started at 10%, is down 2 pounds at week 7ish, all measurements are up, strength through the roof - obviously a good bit of muscle at the expense of fat but this is really hard to pull off at low body fat levels).

Basic (recommended): http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4497774&postcount=15
Periodized (probably more advanced than you need given your experience and could result in less gains): http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4764723&postcount=381
Main THread: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=375215

Something very critical to understand about diet: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4866519&postcount=465

Oh, and if you think you need a lot of bullshit isolation work or have to have a BBeresque split - you don't. Check out the pics in this thread and Dave's comments later on his training (page 3): http://www.midwestbarbell.com/totalelite/index.php?showtopic=1110

I also particularly liked this very sarcastic post:
What a lot of strength athletes don't understand is that bodybuilding is totally different. A whole different type of hypertophy that requires vastly different exotic training methods that rarely get results and generally require anabolics to break 200lbs. Let me tell you all that building significant muscle mass on a Yoda-esque program using exotic rep schemes on cables and machines, days of dedicated biceps training, with an overbearing focus on trace mineral balance and insufficient caloric intake makes it really hard to put on muscle. These guys have to have it all together to show any appreciable gains.

Guys that eat and are able to rely on basic programs to increase their weights in squats, pulls, and presses doing basic exercises that strengthen the body and force it to adapt with increased muscle have it easy. They will never know what it's like to fight through moronic inefficiency to needlessly differentiate your training and alleviate worry that when you eventually do start gaining weight someday, it will be in perfect symmetry and proportion - all at 2lbs a year.
 
Check out the 5x5 threads here, it really is a solid routine. Also, you need to educate YOURSELF, there is a lot of information out there on training. Everybody, now matter if they're a beginner or an elite athlete can always stand to learn something new, you'll never know it all, but read everything you can on training, good and bad, and get to the point where you can recognize crap when you see it, recognize a marketing scheme when you see it, recognize when something is good, and recognize that something looks good, but you can modify it for yourself so that you get the most benifit from it. Get to know your own body.

How tall are you? Even if you of average or below average height, 165 is light. After 3 years of training with what you called little results, I'd imagine you have a handle on what DOESN'T work.

I am going to suggest something most don't want to hear. There is no secret program or one best way. Things get harder as you get more advanced. Muscle must be earned through hard, gut-busing work. there is no easy, cute way to go about it.

I suggest you focus on full barbell squats. Do the full range of motion, ass to the floor. Build your routine around these. For the first 3-6 months, I would suggest you do these 3 times a week, without a change. You'll be considered a beginner since you said you haven't seen a lot of gains in your training. Honestly, you can squat Mon-Wed-Fri and add weight every session for 3-6 months at your stage and see progress. Once you stagnate, try a heavy-light-medium system. Once that gets stale and you stop progressing, do front squats on the light day. When that stagnates, do 5x5 on the heavy day, front squats on the light day, and 5x8 squats on the medium day. there are ways to keep your body responding. But, in the beginning, it takes a while to stagnate.

Try something like this.....

Monday:

Squat (5x5)
Flat bench (5x5)
Barbell Row (5x5)

Wed

Squat (5x5)
Dips (4 sets to failure)
Chins (4 sets to failure)

Fri

Squat (5x5)
Overhead Press (5x5)
Deadlift (5x5)

Do some weighted ab work after every workout. After a month or two, you can come in Sat and do some biceps work if you want. Don't get too fancy at first. Basic, heavy, hard work earns you muscle. The key is progressive resistance. Adding weight each workout makes you big. Doing all sorts of crazy exercises and drop, blitz, bomb, shock sets get you sore and thats about it.

Diet needs to be on, and so does sleep. Eat. Eat 4 solid meals a day, plus 2-3 shakes. Thats 6-7 meals per day. You should consume 1 gallon of milk per day. If you're a teenager, drink whole milk, if you're a little older and want to keep an eye on your lipid profile, drink skim. This is simple because it is not a complicated, magical formula. It is hard however. I guarantee you, if you do it and do it right, you'll make more gains in 3 months than you have your whole life.
 
Madcow must have been posting at the same time I was, I didn't see his post until I was done.......but he's right. Basics, man, basics. They work. People didn't develop new shit because it works better, they developed it because it sells better than hard work.
 
biggt - you have a really good grasp on training (which tends to be very rare on a BBing board). I've really enjoyed reading your posts. Definitely stick around. The more people who know what they are talking about, the less likely the truth is to get diluted by the "try my superset ass-squeeze routine for gains" morons. BTW - do you post anywhere else or have I run into you before somewhere? Your user name looks familiar but I can't place it.
 
Hey, MadCow....I registered at Irontrybe recently too. I do a lot of reading and researching, if I am registered on other boards over the years I probably only have a few posts, because I can't remember them off hand. I serf a lot o jesse Marunde's board and on Midwest Barbell and on Iron Godz.....there are a lot of big time lifters on there, and a lot of pro's.....always a learning experience and very motivational. There must be a lot of Big T names because I had a hell of a time registering. I tried Big T with who know's how many numbers, then I finally decided to play with the spelling.

I like the boards here because they move fast and are current, so thought I'd start posting.
 
so your saying to build muscle 5x5 is the way to go, i always thought that 3x8 was best. then again i havent much noticable gains so i must be wrong
 
Not exactly- 5x5 is a great rep range but the point of their advice is that you do THOSE exercises and focus on improving them without a bunch of bs isolation crap that magazines and most gym rats espouse.
 
do u keep the same weight for the 5 sets or do u start off lighter and work my way up to the heaviest weight?
 
The Midwest board is great. Slow sometimes but I've always enjoyed reading Pendlay's info on GoHeavy or whereever. Matt and I have also met up on boards over the years. Matt has been doing some nice interviews over at www.readthecore.com with Glenn and Mark Rippetoe. I'll have to check out some of the others some time. Good to have you here.
 
Here's my advice-
Spend a week or two getting your squat right. This may be tough as most gyms have very few members who squat at all, let alone correctly. I like this page for learning exercises:
http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/videos/video_index.htm

Check out the backsquat link. That's how deep you should go. Read this too:
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=332299
Once you feel good about squatting, try the single factor 5x5 (which is quite similar to what biggt posted above. Here's a link:
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4497774&postcount=15
Read up on those links and you'll have a real good idea of what you need to do. Also check out the 5x5 monster thread- all the links I posted are contained in it plus about 30 more, but these will be most suitable for you right now IMO.
 
Thanks, man. I like the speed of the board a lot. Yeah, the people at WFW really have something special over there. I enjoyed those interviews a lot.

Lee b,

5x5 is just a good rep range to build strength and muscle. Like Guiness said, it is all about progressive resistance. Don't get caught up with pumps and burns and useless crap. The fastest way to get big is to keep dding weight to the bar from orkout to workout. If you add 10lbs a week to your 5 rep squat, thats 100lbs in 10 weeks. For a total beginner that is VERY realistic. Your body will adapt to the added weight with new size as long as you're feeding it what it needs to respond. if you don't eat, your efforts will be wasted. Again, read Guiness' links, and get your form right. Never choose weight over form and do half assed reps......you'll pay in the long-run by much wasted time.

To get technical, Bill Starr and Tommy Suggs originally developed the program and had felt 4-6 sets of 4-6 reps was 'ideal'. They were teaching high school coaches and athletes, and thought that 5 x 5 was a nice way to package it and keep it as simple as possible for teaching and learning purposes. For beginners, it seems to work best, the less BS to confuse things, the better. This is what has been proven over time to yield size and strength gains for countless athletes. Starr and Suggs tested this routine out on all types of athletes from average high school football players to pro athletes that were genetic freaks, it worked for everyone. No BS, no magic, just real world results.

As for your question......either appoach works. At first I, personally, would pyramid.....say your 5 rep max on a squat is 205 x 5...then do something like....

95x warm up
135x5-155x5-185x5-195x5-205x5....you should be able to bump up the last 3 sets each session for a LONG time.....once that stalls......then do a straight 5 x 5. read through the articles madcow posted and see which you prefer to start with, then post up and you'll get plenty of good advice I'm sure. once more, there is no magical way to do it best, the basic template works, it has been proven in the real world.....you can pyramid or do straight sets......keep doing it and don't worry about switching until you stagnate......and at your stage, you won't stagnate for a long time.
 
So I'm sure next month's Rippetoe interview will cover this more in depth as it's supposed to be him and Glenn covering programing for novice, int, advanced, but this is the basic squat template and progression they use when training someone new and taking them for the first 1-2 years until a periodized program becomes necessary for optimal gains. Notice that they don't change things until they stop working - and they are basically adding workload and managing recovery/fatigue to drive progress (this is how programming is supposed to be done and is handled everywhere else on the planet - not some Flex bodypart split with days of the week bullshit). This was shamelessly copied from Midwest BTW. Also, lee b, start with the pyramids at the beginning. You'll be amazed what this kind of program will do for you.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4658227&postcount=235
 
Holy shit you 2 guys are awesome. I wish when I was younger I had access to this kind of resource.

(You're awesome too Guinness :p )
 
Jim Ouini said:
Holy shit you 2 guys are awesome. I wish when I was younger I had access to this kind of resource.

(You're awesome too Guinness :p )
This thread makes me feel like I'm playing H.O.R.S.E. with Michael Jordan and Larry Bird :beer:
 
I will say this is the first thread I've ever seen where someone asks a basic question and is given very solid, legitimate, and non-conflicting informaiton (not that it's necessary that we all do 5x5 or some such but increasing capacity systematically in the big lifts that drive 95% of your progress). When I started training in the 1980s something like this would have saved me a decade. But at the time all we had was Weider mags, the juice laden Pros on their high rep no-squat or dead machine based workouts, and no internet.

Of course, I imagine some numb-nut will come along and post his 'Super Special Ass Blaster' routine. Or more likely, if they read the thread first there will be a "Check your PM" message which will then present the case for the 'Super Special Ass Blaster' routine which incorporates all those special techniques known only to a few outside the pro ranks or to those who have read Arnold's Encyc backward with their special decoder ring.

Don't fall for this crap Lee B, there is a reason why the anabolic board is packed with 160lbs plateaued guys with "perfect diet and training" trying to get up to speed on drugs and unknowingly buy their way out of learning to train properly. BBing is in a very said state and has insulated itself from proper training (which has remained fairly constant in athletics and olympic weightlifting depsite this fact and made some good progress at the top levels) by relying on copious amounts of drugs and decent nutrition. This has been swept under the carpet by the Weider promotional machine to make BBing into a "sport". This has been to the detriment of many people who have worked hard but not had access to basic information that will get them the results they want (which are generally very realistic). Think about the 3 years you've spent not making gains, now think about everyone else who has done the same thing. All in the name of trying to legitimize BBing and pandering to the supplement companies, equipment manufacturers, and commercial gyms. Frankly I can not help but be staggered by the effect it has had on our youth and the proliferation of drug use among people who are just looking for some basic progress as a result.

-end of rant. back to work.
 
Well - pick up any issue of Muscle & Fitness or Flex, browse through the random training posts on the anabolic forum. Alternatively you can go the decoder ring route. I believe Weider has partnered with Wheaties to distribute said ring at the bottom of the cereal boxes. Obviously this is an effort to provide for carbing up before the beginning the Super Special Ass Blaster Program. Very scientific on their part.
 
Figured I could find it in Flex ;)

Seriously though, lee b not to hi jack your thread. You've come across a gold mine, it's really great info to take back to the gym.
 
Check this month's M&F -could this be the 'Super Special Ass Blaster'?

On the cover it says 'Still Skinny? Get 30% more muscle pg 108' (something about eccentric training, haven't read it yet but it does say it'll 'absolutely shock your muscle into growth')
 
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