Blood Test Results... need advice.

[theperfectdrug187]

Stats:

25 years
185 lbs
10 years experience in the gym, 2 years cycling AAS.
14% bf, clean diet

Alright guys, I just got my blood test results back from the doc, and everything looks good (liver, thyroid, lipids, cholesterol, RBC) but my test is very low... 160. I just finished a 12 week cycle the first week in April which consisted of Test P, Tren, win. I had to cut the tren out after a few weeks because it stirred up gyno, so I replaced the tren and win with Primo.

Post cyle:
10 Days HCG 500iu/day
Dermacrine sust 30 days
Post Cycle 30 days
Unleashed 30 days
Nolvadex 2 weeks (to get rid of existing gyno)

I followed a pretty strict pct schedule, but it just didn't seem to do the trick. I need some recommendations on what I need to do to get my test levels back to normal. Thanks bros.

 

[links1979]

I'd like to hear an answer to this too. From what I've researched seems like you have done too long of a cycle for your pct. Those are some pretty serious anabolics and most people here recommend a much longer pct on nolva or clomid. But I don't know anything first hand. Just what I read

 

[10001110101]

tried and true pct:

this is what medical professionals use, sides are probably not fun.

Clomid - 50mg/day
Nolva - 20mg/day
HCG (i don't remember dosage but it was on order of 1000 iu/wk)

this protocol returned all subjects from a 20 wk study of testosterone enanthate in healthy young males to eugonadal status in an average of 45 days.

for many people, FULL recovery is longer and more difficult than most will admit.

i got this from anabolics '06 (llewelyn)

 

[theperfectdrug187]

Bump for more ideas

 

[Nelson Montana]

tried and true pct:

this is what medical professionals use, sides are probably not fun.

Clomid - 50mg/day
Nolva - 20mg/day
HCG (i don't remember dosage but it was on order of 1000 iu/wk)

this protocol returned all subjects from a 20 wk study of testosterone enanthate in healthy young males to eugonadal status in an average of 45 days.

for many people, FULL recovery is longer and more difficult than most will admit.

i got this from anabolics '06 (llewelyn)

This is somewhat misleading. (Not the post, but the results).

Where blood tests taken BEFORE and after? Was the HCG used throughout? If so, the elevation would be from THAT.

What are they considering eugonadal? Someone could have started with a T of 900 and ended up with a T of 250 and technically, that's eugonadal.

Did T levels remain eugonadal after cessation of drugs or did they drop back down?

This is the problem with so much of this testing. There are holes everywhere.


I'd like to know more of the posters history. What were the dosages and how long has it been since the last cycle. If he's prone to gyno why wasn't adex used throughout? How's the libido? What was your estrogen level?

All the drugs and all the supps in the world won't elevate a HPTA that is too compromised to recover. If it's been a month since you've been off, all you can do is continue the process. Some people recover slower than others.

I'm sure some people will recommend clomid or say that that's the reason you're suppressed but this happens with people who take clomid too. If you took clomid people would recommend using Nolva and obviously that didn't help either. You certainly took enough HCG. I'm suspecting estro was and is high due to the gyno. Prolactin may also be an issue with the tren, even this long afterward.

You may be at the very nadir of your recovery and you may be fine in a few more weeks. But I'd still want to know a little more info.

 

[theperfectdrug187]

Thanks for the reply Nelson. Here's a run down of my background:

I did not take a blood test pre-cycle, but I felt fine. Eugonadale was considered 250, I came back 160.

I haven't picked the results up yet, just talked to the doc over the phone and he didn't give me an estrogen level. He said the test level was the only concern.

This was my 4th cycle... after what I believe was a full recovery from an 8 week Test (500/week) Tren (300/week) that I ran last fall. I followed that with a 4 week pct, and 8 week recovery before starting this cycle early Spring. It went as follows:

1-12 100 mg Test P eod
1-3 75 mg Tren A eod
1-6 50mg/day win
4-12 100 mg Primo eod
6-12 HCG 500iu/week
6 days hcg 500iu ed following last shot

I was taking small doses of t3 throught the cycle, as well as L-dex and Dostinex from the beginning until the gyno started flaring up, then I switched to Letro. I was also taking doses of Post Cycle throughout including PCT. As of now, 2 weeks out of PCT and 6 weeks out of cycle, the gyno lumps have mostly subsided, but still fairly puffy. My libido is not so great, but I can get hard when needed, unless a condom is involved, in which case I throw a cialis in the mix.

I'm considering following another 4-6 week pct program, and then getting blood tested again. That's where I need you bros help. Thanks again for the reply Nelson.

 

[biggernu]

your test was 160 mg/dl? do you have any libido at all? Before my first cycle i was at 333 mg/dl and i had a low libidio, now before my second cycle started, and use of unleased and proper pct my test was 495 mg/dl. I would most defineatly thought the hcg would have kick your test production back up for sure.

 

[Nelson Montana]

your test was 160 mg/dl? do you have any libido at all? Before my first cycle i was at 333 mg/dl and i had a low libidio, now before my second cycle started, and use of unleased and proper pct my test was 495 mg/dl. I would most defineatly thought the hcg would have kick your test production back up for sure.

Yeah, the HCG and UNLEASHED almost always insures adequate T and libido but you never know. (Actually that may why you can still get hard). There are so many factors at play here and once levels go TOO low, there's no cure other than time. I'd suggest to continue with the supps, take a long break and have another blood test in a couple of months. And stay away from the tren! Good luck bro.

 

[biggernu]

Yeah, the HCG and UNLEASHED almost always insures adequate T and libido but you never know. (Actually that may why you can still get hard). There are so many factors at play here and once levels go TOO low, there's no cure other than time. I'd suggest to continue with the supps, take a long break and have another blood test in a couple of months. And stay away from the tren! Good luck bro.

im serious man i took the unleashed and i notice a huge difference in libido. i wish i had a job so i could buy more of it, im down to 6 pills.

 

[theperfectdrug187]

Yeah, I already plan on staying clear of the tren. I'm thinkin of continuing post cycle and Unleashed for a few months, and I just put in an order for the Testosterone Recovery stack from PP. I'll let you know how it goes. I have my Test/Primo/Anavar stack ready to go once I fully recover... so I'll be chompin at the bit for the next few months.

Should I do another hcg program?

 

[links1979]

bump?

 

[nickster#1]

Regardless of what kind of PCT you did. You just finished your cycle less that 2 months ago, and it is going to take a little more time than that for your natty test to come back within normal range. And nelson is right in the fact that clomid and nolva is essential to a speedier recovery and medical proffesionals agree. I always did my PCT with clomid and nolva, and if my cycle was more than 15 weeks, and my testes were noticably smaller than normal, then I would do HCG at 250iu eod for 10 to 14 days, and that always brought the boys back to size. But you still have some time to go before your natty test levels come back to within range. You did a 12 week cycle of test, tren and winny, so you shut yourself down pretty hard. Get some clomid at least and run it for 3 weeks with some nolvadex. I would hit the clomid on day 1 hard with 200mg, and then 50mg a day after that and nolva at 20 to 25 mg a day for several weeks.
Good luck bro and remember, time on = time off. Give it some more time and you will get their.
peace

Stats:

25 years
185 lbs
10 years experience in the gym, 2 years cycling AAS.
14% bf, clean diet

Alright guys, I just got my blood test results back from the doc, and everything looks good (liver, thyroid, lipids, cholesterol, RBC) but my test is very low... 160. I just finished a 12 week cycle the first week in April which consisted of Test P, Tren, win. I had to cut the tren out after a few weeks because it stirred up gyno, so I replaced the tren and win with Primo.

Post cyle:
10 Days HCG 500iu/day
Dermacrine sust 30 days
Post Cycle 30 days
Unleashed 30 days
Nolvadex 2 weeks (to get rid of existing gyno)

I followed a pretty strict pct schedule, but it just didn't seem to do the trick. I need some recommendations on what I need to do to get my test levels back to normal. Thanks bros.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Regardless of what kind of PCT you did. You just finished your cycle less that 2 months ago, and it is going to take a little more time than that for your natty test to come back within normal range. And nelson is right in the fact that clomid and nolva is essential to a speedier recovery and medical proffesionals agree. I always did my PCT with clomid and nolva, and if my cycle was more than 15 weeks, and my testes were noticably smaller than normal, then I would do HCG at 250iu eod for 10 to 14 days, and that always brought the boys back to size. But you still have some time to go before your natty test levels come back to within range. You did a 12 week cycle of test, tren and winny, so you shut yourself down pretty hard. Get some clomid at least and run it for 3 weeks with some nolvadex. I would hit the clomid on day 1 hard with 200mg, and then 50mg a day after that and nolva at 20 to 25 mg a day for several weeks.
Good luck bro and remember, time on = time off. Give it some more time and you will get their.
peace

A little misunderstanding. I didn't say clomid and/or Nolva was necessary, in fact I think more often than not is it isn't, but an anti aromatase is. He used Nolva and it didn't help.

200 mgs of Clomid can make some people feel so shitty they'll be suicidal. Way too much -- even if it works for you.

The problem, I believe was too many suppressive compounds without sufficient time between cycles.

And time on = time off has no validity whatsoever. 2 months is barely enough time to stabilize no less recover to the point where another cycle won't suppress you more.

This guy needs to take a LONG break and keep a close watch on things from here on in.

 

[theperfectdrug187]

I'll be staying off for quite some time Nelson. I'm going to steer clear of the nolva and clomid for the time being, even though I have both on hand. My question is... would it hurt to run another 10 days of HCG? I'm expecting my Testosterone Recovery stack from PP here in the next few days, and am religiously taking Post Cycle and Unleashed.

 

[Nelson Montana]

I'll be staying off for quite some time Nelson. I'm going to steer clear of the nolva and clomid for the time being, even though I have both on hand. My question is... would it hurt to run another 10 days of HCG? I'm expecting my Testosterone Recovery stack from PP here in the next few days, and am religiously taking Post Cycle and Unleashed.

If your testicles are still atrophied, yes, if not, no. At any rate, I think 10 days would be overkill. Too much HCG can be suppressive and then you'll be starting all over again from square one.

Give it time. Take the supps. You'll come around. It sucks in the meantime but worrying just makes it worse. You should be fine in a few more weeks. Feel better bro.

 

[theperfectdrug187]

Thanks again Nelson, and I hope this thread helped other bros as well as me.

 

[nickster#1]

My bad, I meant what 100111010101 said in regards to using clomid. This guys PCT was not sufficient enough for the length of cycle, 12 weeks, and the combination of compounds. Sorry Nelson, I thought it was you who suggested clomid and nolva. Anyways, 1 day of 200mg clomid, day 1, and 50mg there after along with nolvadex at 20 to 25mg a day for several weeks is what this poor fella needs to get things going again. This is standard PCT and always brought me back to speedy recovery. Main problem is too many compounds, poor PCT, and NOT enough time off too be worrying about natty test levels. As I said before in other threads, HCG is not necassary unless cycle is 15 weeks or longer and/or testes are atrophied, then HCG at 250iu eod for 10 days.
Time on = time off. Then think about getting your bloodwork done if you did a proper PCT.
just my .002

A little misunderstanding. I didn't say clomid and/or Nolva was necessary, in fact I think more often than not is it isn't, but an anti aromatase is. He used Nolva and it didn't help.

200 mgs of Clomid can make some people feel so shitty they'll be suicidal. Way too much -- even if it works for you.

The problem, I believe was too many suppressive compounds without sufficient time between cycles.

And time on = time off has no validity whatsoever. 2 months is barely enough time to stabilize no less recover to the point where another cycle won't suppress you more.

This guy needs to take a LONG break and keep a close watch on things from here on in.

 

[TexasTurkey1001]

If your testicles are still atrophied, yes, if not, no. At any rate, I think 10 days would be overkill. Too much HCG can be suppressive and then you'll be starting all over again from square one.

Give it time. Take the supps. You'll come around. It sucks in the meantime but worrying just makes it worse. You should be fine in a few more weeks. Feel better bro.

I was thinking this may have been the problem from the start..... I believe with HCG less is better. LH is a lot different than Test. as far as hormones go. I wish I had a good study to back my opinion.




-

 

[theperfectdrug187]

To clarify... I was only on tren for the 1st 3 weeks, then went to just test and primo for the remaining 9, and at very moderate doses. Not that it changes anything, but I would never run tren or winstrol for that long of period.