Baking Prop/NPP to make it less painful?

[WannaBeBig72]

Anyone have any experience doing this? I'm injecting 2cc's EOD and it's really putting a hurting on my body. I like the results so far. But the pain!! I'm not sure how I'm going to workout my legs they're so freaking sore...

 

[bigtravis]

Anyone have any experience doing this? I'm injecting 2cc's EOD and it's really putting a hurting on my body. I like the results so far. But the pain!! I'm not sure how I'm going to workout my legs they're so freaking sore...

200mgs. in one spot?

 

[sparetire]

i've been there and done that. The only way you can reduce the pain is mix it with something else. Since I didn't have any sterile oil available and had about 5 ccs of eq and 10 ccs of injectible prohormones (pretty much as strong as the oil itself! lol), I just mixed everything in one bottle, baked it at 250 for 15 minutes and injected

 

[WannaBeBig72]

i've been there and done that. The only way you can reduce the pain is mix it with something else. Since I didn't have any sterile oil available and had about 5 ccs of eq and 10 ccs of injectible prohormones (pretty much as strong as the oil itself! lol), I just mixed everything in one bottle, baked it at 250 for 15 minutes and injected

Yeah 200mgs in one inject. How do you bake it? Just stick the vial in the oven with the rubber stopper on?

 

[Ulter]

What you're trying to do is evaporate some of the solvent. So you need to put an 18 gauge in the vial top to vent it and put it in the oven for 20 min at 200 deg. Let it cool and do it again. Then try it. Once the oil cools of course.

 

[WannaBeBig72]

What you're trying to do is evaporate some of the solvent. So you need to put an 18 gauge in the vial top to vent it and put it in the oven for 20 min at 200 deg. Let it cool and do it again. Then try it. Once the oil cools of course.

So leave the rubber stopper on the vial? I don't have an 18 gauge needle...Can I use something bigger?

I know this is a stupid question but I'm supposed to take off the syringe as well (just want to make absolutely sure, you know dealing with injects and all).

I just got back from doing legs (wasn't sure if I could). Oddly enough squats and deadlifts are a hell of alot easier then walking and sitting...Weird...

 

[Ulter]

No you don't leave the syringe on it. Just leave the pin in to vent the vial. You can use a larger gauge needle, but I have never seen one.

BTW if you don't have any 18's what do you use to draw the oil up with?

 

[WannaBeBig72]

No you don't leave the syringe on it. Just leave the pin in to vent the vial. You can use a larger gauge needle, but I have never seen one.

BTW if you don't have any 18's what do you use to draw the oil up with?

Thanks Ulter K to you. I've got about 7 more weeks of injections but hopefully this fixes the problem.

I'm kind of ingornant about needles I guess (much more knowledgeable about AAS), this is my 3rd cycle and my friend just told me what needles to order. I think they're 21 or 22 gauge (I just assumed that 21 was a bigger needle then 18).

Can I ask you one more question...
When they say a needle is 20G x 1.5 what do they mean exactly?
What does the 20 and the 1.5 mean? Is 20 the length of the needle and 1.5 the width or is it the other way around?

Again I'm sorry for being stupid. And thanks alot for all the help. I can't wait to have no pain in my ass and legs.

 

[buckwheat1]

Thanks Ulter K to you. I've got about 7 more weeks of injections but hopefully this fixes the problem.

I'm kind of ingornant about needles I guess (much more knowledgeable about AAS), this is my 3rd cycle and my friend just told me what needles to order. I think they're 21 or 22 gauge (I just assumed that 21 was a bigger needle then 18).

Can I ask you one more question...
When they say a needle is 20G x 1.5 what do they mean exactly?
What does the 20 and the 1.5 mean? Is 20 the length of the needle and 1.5 the width or is it the other way around?

Again I'm sorry for being stupid. And thanks alot for all the help. I can't wait to have no pain in my ass and legs.

The 20G is the gauge. The larger the number the smaller the diameter of the width of the needle. The 1.5 means it is 1.5 inches long.

 

[hammercurls]

i use 18g to draw and 25g to shoot.

do what ulter said, im doing that tonight myself

 

[WannaBeBig72]

i use 18g to draw and 25g to shoot.

do what ulter said, im doing that tonight myself

the prop is 10ML and the NPP is 50ML. should I bake them the same time? damn i feel like i'm making cookies or something..lol

 

[Ulter]

I doubt the NPP is the cause of the pain. You should shoot them seperately and find out.

 

[used2juice]

Bro I seriously wouldn't consider baking em, if anything you are probably only gonna make it worse. There is likely not much ba in either of those vials. So if you bake some of it off, then you are increasing the likely hood that the hormone will crystallize IN you. And that is a pain you NEVER wanna feel.

 

[flyingjer]

yeah that i what i thought too, i thought that prop pain was caused by the ba evaporating and the hormone crystalizing

Bro I seriously wouldn't consider baking em, if anything you are probably only gonna make it worse. There is likely not much ba in either of those vials. So if you bake some of it off, then you are increasing the likely hood that the hormone will crystallize IN you. And that is a pain you NEVER wanna feel.

 

[WannaBeBig72]

Bro I seriously wouldn't consider baking em, if anything you are probably only gonna make it worse. There is likely not much ba in either of those vials. So if you bake some of it off, then you are increasing the likely hood that the hormone will crystallize IN you. And that is a pain you NEVER wanna feel.

Jesus I don't know who to believe now. You and Ulter are both knowledgeable guys. I wish Ulter would chime in regarding this...

I already baked them for 20 minutes at 200 degrees...

 

[Mike LI]

I'm doing the same cycle. It does hurt but I've felt worse

 

[madogz1n2]

Just split up the injections....Massage the site for about 10min. after, and take a hot shower or bath....Then keep stretching later in the day...It will still hurt, but not nearly as bad....something just doesn't seem to add up with bakin your fukin oils/

 

[Ulter]

You guys are confusing real prop with UG prop. UG labs make up for the fact that they do not own a clean room to manufacture in by adding too much BA to their AS. Since he's using NPP and real labs don't make NPP I am guessing his problem is BA related. 200 deg for 20 min won't damage the AS unless it's enanthate and even that is unlikely.

 

[Ulter]

Also, try shooting the NPP and prop seperately so you can see which one it is or if it's both.

 

[hammercurls]

i have the same NPP as him and its crippling id im careless with the shot. here's the remedy for blunting the pain.

1. focus
2. run syringe under hot water
3. inject sloooooow.

of course baking will help

 

[WannaBeBig72]

Also, try shooting the NPP and prop seperately so you can see which one it is or if it's both.

Both from a "reputable" UG lab Ulter. I baked both at 200 for 20 minutes. My next inject is Friday I'm going to shoot seperately and hope for no pain.

 

[Ulter]

Bro UG is UG. I use UG all the time, that wasn't an indictment. They just don't make their AS in a "clean room". Google clean room

 

[used2juice]

You guys are confusing real prop with UG prop. UG labs make up for the fact that they do not own a clean room to manufacture in by adding too much BA to their AS. Since he's using NPP and real labs don't make NPP I am guessing his problem is BA related. 200 deg for 20 min won't damage the AS unless it's enanthate and even that is unlikely.

Yeah but you're confusing ug's with people who have no clue what they are doing.

If your prop and npp have less than 3% ba in it (which they do, I believe only 2%), then baking it will only evaporate the means by which the hormone is suspended. It will then crystallize in your body and that can be EXTREMELY painful.

You are correct, baking at 200 degrees will not damage the hormone at all though.

Best thing you can do is run the loaded syringe under hot water for 30 seconds prior to injection. DO NOT obviously douse the needle in water, just the plastic barrell.

 

[hammercurls]

i did a calf shot with NPP and it worked out great with my protocal. a little sore but i bearly feel it

 

[Ulter]

Yeah but you're confusing ug's with people who have no clue what they are doing.
If your prop and npp have less than 3% ba in it (which they do, I believe only 2%), then baking it will only evaporate the means by which the hormone is suspended. It will then crystallize in your body and that can be EXTREMELY painful.
You are correct, baking at 200 degrees will not damage the hormone at all though.
Best thing you can do is run the loaded syringe under hot water for 30 seconds prior to injection. DO NOT obviously douse the needle in water, just the plastic barrell.

LOL! Bro 3% is a dream. Most UG gear is closer to 10 than 3 when it hurts that bad. The baking only evaporates a small amount but usually enough. Sometimes you have to do it twice.

 

[WannaBeBig72]

LOL! Bro 3% is a dream. Most UG gear is closer to 10 than 3 when it hurts that bad. The baking only evaporates a small amount but usually enough. Sometimes you have to do it twice.

Yeah I baked it twice at 200 for 20 minutes. I'll let everyone know how it goes on Friday.

In regards to running it under hot water. I know alot of people recommend that but I find it hard to believe that this will have much of an impact. I mean you're body's temp is 98.6 and injecting 2ML at whatever temp I would think the oil is going to get to 98.6 fairly quickly (if it's hotter or cooler). I just don't see how injecting something that's 70 degrees or so is going to make your leg hurt for a week.

Thanks everyone for their imput. Happy Thanksgiving all!!

 

[WannaBeBig72]

Yeah I baked it twice at 200 for 20 minutes. I'll let everyone know how it goes on Friday.

In regards to running it under hot water. I know alot of people recommend that but I find it hard to believe that this will have much of an impact. I mean you're body's temp is 98.6 and injecting 2ML at whatever temp I would think the oil is going to get to 98.6 fairly quickly (if it's hotter or cooler). I just don't see how injecting something that's 70 degrees or so is going to make your leg hurt for a week.

Thanks everyone for their imput. Happy Thanksgiving all!!

I fucked up one time for 20 minutes the other time for 26. Both at 200. I hope I didn't damage my gear at all...

 

[Ulter]

Should be ok. But yeah, you should have tried it first before rebaking it.

 

[azul]

LOL! Bro 3% is a dream. Most UG gear is closer to 10 than 3 when it hurts that bad. The baking only evaporates a small amount but usually enough. Sometimes you have to do it twice.

Very true, alas. I've used plenty of prop that was supposed to be 2-3% BA, and it still hurt like hell. Prop at 2% BA will just hurt a bit...

 

[used2juice]

LOL! Bro 3% is a dream. Most UG gear is closer to 10 than 3 when it hurts that bad. The baking only evaporates a small amount but usually enough. Sometimes you have to do it twice.

Without throwing out too much, I have made a pretty vast amount of crap for...people...and I can say I have never used more than 2% ba on any of my stuff. I know the ug I go with only uses 1-2% ba on their products, and they have some pretty high concentration and painless stuff.

Then again, I can't speak for other people or other ug's. But 10% seems like an awful lot of ba...even ug's a couple years ago were only using 5% ba on their goods...

I guess now I feel lucky for finding a halfway intelligent ug lab.

 

[Ulter]

Last summer 3 UG labs (none of which are in business today) had gear that was 7% or higher when they were making ridiculously high concentrations of test products and high concentration NPP. There are reports of test at 10%, although I didn't do those but I trust those who did.
Even Tokkyo 400 was over 5% when they first released it.

 

[basskiller]

Bro I seriously wouldn't consider baking em, if anything you are probably only gonna make it worse. There is likely not much ba in either of those vials. So if you bake some of it off, then you are increasing the likely hood that the hormone will crystallize IN you. And that is a pain you NEVER wanna feel.

This is very true,, You may wind up with a vial of crashed gear also.

 

[used2juice]

Last summer 3 UG labs (none of which are in business today) had gear that was 7% or higher when they were making ridiculously high concentrations of test products and high concentration NPP. There are reports of test at 10%, although I didn't do those but I trust those who did.
Even Tokkyo 400 was over 5% when they first released it.

See, I think that says it all...no longer in business. I guess just like everything else, we have to discern our terms. I think any GOOD ug lab likely doesn't use much ba at all in their batches. I also don't consider mex stuff as ug (even though they do fit the profile). Mex gear IS very high in ba though, you are correct.

But if I remember, this guy is using AP and CL stuff, and I know for a fact CL's stuff is either 1 or 2% ba. And I imagine AP is right around there too. So in this case, baking that stuff is gonna eliminate what little is holding these hormones in solution.

basskiller is correct, now it may crystallize IN the person or IN the vial. It COULD still be okay. But in the future, DON'T BAKE YOUR GEAR. If you feel you have to, then you shouldn't be using that product.

 

[hammercurls]

half a cc is a tolerable amount to inject of NPP , 1 full cc cripples me. so im stuck doing 50mg ed. however im doing 50 mg eod and let me tell im quite pleased so far

 

[Ulter]

See, I think that says it all...no longer in business. I guess just like everything else, we have to discern our terms. I think any GOOD ug lab likely doesn't use much ba at all in their batches. I also don't consider mex stuff as ug (even though they do fit the profile). Mex gear IS very high in ba though, you are correct.

But if I remember, this guy is using AP and CL stuff, and I know for a fact CL's stuff is either 1 or 2% ba. And I imagine AP is right around there too. So in this case, baking that stuff is gonna eliminate what little is holding these hormones in solution.

basskiller is correct, now it may crystallize IN the person or IN the vial. It COULD still be okay. But in the future, DON'T BAKE YOUR GEAR. If you feel you have to, then you shouldn't be using that product.

He baked it. Twice. It didn't fall out of the solution, or so he said. I've been doing this for the 5 years and have never had the gear fall out of the solution except once with enanathate. Enanthate can melt in your hand though. Since I know well over a hundred people who use this method successfully I'm pretty convinced it's effective. Iron God posted it here on Elite in the summer of 2000 and most of us have used it since. BTW one of the 3 went out of business because they were busted and another simply retired young and wealthy. Don't know about the third.

 

[WannaBeBig72]

He baked it. Twice. It didn't fall out of the solution, or so he said. I've been doing this for the 5 years and have never had the gear fall out of the solution except once with enanathate. Enanthate can melt in your hand though. Since I know well over a hundred people who use this method successfully I'm pretty convinced it's effective. Iron God posted it here on Elite in the summer of 2000 and most of us have used it since. BTW one of the 3 went out of business because they were busted and another simply retired young and wealthy. Don't know about the third.

It defenitely didn't fall out of the solution. It was as clear as day after the 2nd bake (I took a good look at it under the light Ulter after reading your post). I guess we'll find out about the BA soon enough. I'm going to inject Friday. However, I'm going to inject half of it (in case I baked off too much of the BA) and 12 hours apart and in seperate locations (to determine wether it was the CL Prop or the AP NPP). Will let everyone know on Friday what the result is.

Hammercurls has already baked and injected the NPP (same NPP as me), so if Used2Juice is correct regarding the BA, Hammercurls should be on the way to the ER right about now...

Of course Hammer I hope this isn't the case...


Nothing better then intelligent objective discussions like this on Elite (I wish all were this way)...

 

[used2juice]

Well obviously it's not a for sure thing. The prop can possibly stay in solution, so could the npp. Or one could crash in the vial, or another could crystallize in your body. Or maybe nothing will happen because not enough solvent baked off.

All I'm saying is that by doing it, that's increasing the chances of this occurring. Just like injecting dirty gear. You can have several injections and not get an abcess. Doesn't mean your gear isn't dirty, just means an abcess didn't occur.

What's done is done. Hopefully nothing crashes in you and hings get less painful. But, in the future, baking gear that isn't mexican or IP may not be the best solution. 100mg/ml prop can hurt, that is life. It likely has nothing to do with the ba.

 

[basskiller]

WannaBeBig72, I was thinking about your post when I ran across this from an old friend that went by the way-side.. but his work still is merritted


What makes shots hurt?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

High Mg per ML Steroids, What you need to know –

1. Most hormones have a pretty low solubility in oil.
2. The primary ways to increase solubility are to
A) add solvent (BA or EA).
B) Add an ester to the hormone. The longer the ester the more hormone will fit in the oil at a certain mg per ml ratio. Conversely, the weight of the ester is also factored in the total mg per ml ratio, so while you can fit more hormone in, you are getting less actual hormone than the mg amount implies. Here are some examples:

Ester actual mg/100mg dose
test no ester 100
tren acetate 87
test prop 83
test enanth 72
test cyp 70
test undecan 63
nand phenyl 67
nand deca 64

This means that if your test cyp says 200 mgs per ml you get an actual 140 mgs of test. The rest of the weight is the weight of the ester. If that sounds like a bad deal you need to understand that test no ester is VERY insoluble in oil without going to very high mg per ml solvent concentrations.

This brings up the next point; PAIN!

Why do some shots hurt? There are two primary reasons. One, the solvent ratio is too high. Anything over about 10% starts to hurt. BA and EA are VERY inflammatory to the tissues. That’s why you want ONLY enough to help your oil hold more gear but not so much that it causes inflammation.

The second reason is that the gear crystallizes in the depot. This is precisely why water-based suspensions feel like hammer blows. The water is absorbed FAST, leaving the gear to crystallize in the tissues = PAIN. Even gear in oil can do this, here is how it works. If you use a low ester weight attached to your gear and make the mg per ml ratio SIGNIFICANTLY higher than the oil will hold on it's own, what happens is the body absorbs the solvent faster than the oil/gear and the gear falls out of the solution and crystallizes in the depot and WHAM, it hurts like hell. An optimum solution has just enough solvent to get more gear into solution than you could otherwise, but not so much that what I just stated happens. When the ratios are correct the gear holds in the solution UNTIL the whole depot is absorbed and very little or no pain is felt. Just to end this misconception once and for all IT IS NOT THE VOLUME OF THE OIL THAT CAUSES THE PAIN, IT IS ONE OF THE CONDITIONS STATED ABOVE. You can shoot 5 cc's of sterile oil and never know you took a shot. It IS NOT HOW MUCH OIL YOU SHOOT! So why does everyone search for super high mg per ml ratio gear like it's the damn holy grail???

What is too high? Well the length of the ester is really what determines that but most of us here know the gear that hurts and know we know why. All tests over 250 mgs per ml hurt, and actually most of the 250 mg tests hurt too. SOOOO many people want there tren at 150-200 mgs per ml. Tren acetate should be at about what?? 75 mgs per ml. That is why all the kits are designed this way. Do you really think it's cheaper for the kit producers to add MORE oil to their kits instead of less? One other quick note. Oil is used
because it SLOWS absorption. THIS IS PRECISELY WHAT YOU WANT IN A STEROID SHOT! Less oil does not promote the steady state hormone levels achieved with more oil.

Originally posted by Doom

 

[hammercurls]

good post basskiller

 

[flyingjer]

yeah, that is indirectly what i said earlier

 

[flyingjer]

oh yeah, and this is a litte of subject, but a guy on another board, can't remember which, shot a whole cc of BB into him to see if the claims that BB is painful were true.

The 100% 1ml shot of BB did not cause any pain at all, therefore, using this to thin the oil out, and also to help hold in solution and depot is a good idea, BB gets absorbed slower than BA, so it is a definite good additive.

Flingjer

 

[WannaBeBig72]

I shot half a cc (I chose half because I was a little scared that I had made either one more painful by baking off too much BA) of the Prop and NPP yesterday in 2 seperate locations. By the night both were a little sore (although the Prop location was a little more sore). I would say that baking helped with the pain a bit. I shot the other cc last night and am a little sore from it today (no where near as sore as I was before the baking).

 

[Maxx Out]

What you're trying to do is evaporate some of the solvent. So you need to put an 18 gauge in the vial top to vent it and put it in the oven for 20 min at 200 deg. Let it cool and do it again. Then try it. Once the oil cools of course.

This works well for me! Good luck!