Advice for my nephew:

[spatts]

Tonight, my 15 year old nephew told me he's been lifting weights, and his goal is to get "cut up." He has weights at home and his mom tells me he's been working out EVERY night for hours...AFTER hours of baseball practice. Now, he's probably got enough testosterone floating around his body to handle alot of work without overtraining, not to mention he's been playing sports year round since he was a tot. We're not talking about a "beginner" here when it comes to conditioning.

He mentioned wanting a 6 pack, and I told him that was mostly about diet. We all have 6 packs...even our grandma has a 6 pack...there's just more on top of some 6 packs than others.

He also asked about creatine, and I think that's a great idea for him.

He also mentioned working out every day this summer (with weights).

Now, I went into the whole spiel about how creatine works, and that muscles grow while you're recovering (not in the gym), that working a muscle again before it's healed is counter productive, etc.

...but let's face it. There might never come a day when my family understands the caliber of people I train with, write diets for, write training splits for, advise on a daily basis. My nephew will probably never believe that I know the exact diet and training principals of pro BBers, PLers, fitness/figure competitors, etc...and have even trained with many.

So, in lieu of my credibility, I was hoping some of you could pass on your training advice to my nephew, and I will copy this thread to him. Perhaps if he sees these principals are common knowledge among those "in-the-know" he will be less inclined to think "more is better." I love him dearly, and he's one hell of a ball player. I don't want him to hurt himself because he wants to look hot at the pool. He can get the look he wants and still excel in the gym and on the field, but he has to go about it a different way.

Thank in advance.

 

[jeremys]

well the plus here is that i'm his same age, and i'm sure we have the same issues, etc, so he could maybe relate to me and my training?

i dont know what to say besides agree with what you said

 

[spatts]

Jeremy, you are a perfect example. Would you mind telling him about your size and strength gains and your training split?

My nephew also said "I don't want to be strong I want to be cut." I tried to explain to him that strength LEADS to size.

Any details you can offer would be great. Also, if you have an experience with working around school sports with your training, and supplements you've tired, that would be great.

 

[jeremys]

ok, here's what i can come up with for now;

i started as a pretty fat kid. i did high reps with low weight and ran a lot while dropping my food intake drastically. i lost weight, but my bodyfat only decreased slightly. then i discovered this board and read a lot about the new ideas of training and diet and people were debunking old myths. i was a bit skeptical because i had been hearing the myths from everybody for quite a while.

reluctantly, i started eating more (healthy and wholesome) foods, and cut my cardio down to just a couple times per week. my lifting changed from light weight/high reps to a basic strength routine. if i recall, it was a 3x8 or something similar. my body took off. i gained muscle and lost fat. my total weight stayed about the same but my body composition was much better.

i stayed consistent with my training. it was year-round, until football/wrestling started. i already had decent size and all the cardio while eating whatever i wanted actually helped me get cut.
strength training = muscle. muscle+good diet+a little cardio=ripped

i know that around here, almost nobody takes lifting seriously and it really hurts them. again, strength gains are key, and also practicing your sport. little fluff routines like that in 'flex' magazine could be fun and full of promise, but they really will get you little in the way of results

as far as supplements go, real good food was the greatest thing i used. i did use creatine once and just started eating a shitload of food and just blew up and bodyfat only raised slightly. again, later, during the wrestling season, i lost a bit of fat and a little muscle, but i was ripped without really trying

anything else i should touch on?

 

[spatts]

That's exactly what I'm looking for, Jeremys. Thanks.

 

[BigBadBootyDaddy29]

He sounds like most 15 yr olds......The enthusiasm is good too......I agree with heverything you said too Spatts.....Recovery, sleep, eating, they all play as big a role in gaining muscle as training does.....At 15, your body is like a natural anabolic steroid factory, and if the kid isn't hard gainer, he will grow even if he grossly overtrains, but his gains can be better and come faster if he listens to you.......I was an athlete my whole life and started lifting seriously in 8th grade, I had good advice, I went to high school at a football factory, the head coach's son was a strength coach at a Division 1 college, we were taught to do things right from day one.......my advice to him would be to plan a program, and not mindlessly burn his body out in the gym everyday......I would recommend a lot of olympic lifting and pure strength training, with higher rep bodybuilding stuff for visual effect as assistance......and he needs to know that nutrition and sleep are an equal part of the process......I know you told him all this, but I am just adding in, hopefully you can get it to sink in for him......whats his height and weight by the way??

 

[gettinlarger]

I'm young, and fairly new to this ...

Tell him that he should keep his workouts good and intense. He can't just go in, do bench press and curls, and leave like he owned the place. He should build some muscle with a nice training program, maybe DC or 5x5, or maybe you can help him with what you are familiar with, spatts. Maybe a WSB variation or something. Strength will lead to size. Muscular growth will lead to the fact that he can shed fat more quickly.

He wants to get "cut," right? He needs to eat. It is misleading. Many people think that in order to lose weight, they have to stop eating completely. He will deplete himself of nutrients, and wind up losing muscle first. Get him on a good diet.

Tell him that it's not going to be easy. Well, it can be easy, if he is serious about it. This stuff takes lots of hard work and dedication. Discipline.

Good luck spatts.

 

[AnimalMass1]

My nephew also said "I don't want to be strong I want to be cut."

Somebody needs to bitch slap the kid quick. His aunt benches 300lbs and could kick his ass! Send him to us (DG21, KG18, AnimalMass, and Genemachine) for a night - we'll kick his scrawny ass all night long, and then he'll know why it's cool to be strong.

Also, send him pictures of our girls. They are all supermodel hot (you know Spatts, you've met em) - and not a one of us has a 6 pack.

AnimalMass

 

[spatts]

Dammit, AM, you're ruining my thread.

...but you're SO right.

 

[The Red Dragon]

That's hilarious Animal true though A strong guy can kick a scrawny cut guys ass.

I'm 17, pretty close to his age.

I don't have a lot of experience but I've read through a lot of scientific studies, articles and forum posts regarding building.

IE

Working out for too much and too long = cortisol release, after 45min-1hour the amount of catabolic hormone matches the amount of anabolic hormones circulating in the blood stream causing a loss of muscle mass.

Compound movements, lower reps and heavier weights (85%-90% one rep max range) stimulates the release of testosterone where 8-10 reps with 1 minute intervals release growth hormone. You should get into the endocrinology with him . Growth hormone and testosterone augment fat metabolism (Helping him getting cut). Overtraining will reduce testosterone levels dramatically and raise cortisol levels in the blood.

Dieting, very important, you can tell him that I didn't eat very much before I started building and how I bloated up quickly
(I ate 2 meals a day - very slow metabolism)...so eating less is actually bad for ya. I have always regreted my past eating habits since I'll have to work very hard to negate it's effect.

Sleep, in March I had insomnia problems, I was still lifting and I actually lost mass. In April I was healthier, got more sleep and such and my weight went up 8 lbs at least. Sleep also affected the amount I can lift and my stamina during every workout.

Consistancy and dedication, without those I wouldn't be here and I wouldn't be making any progress at all. Lifting is very demanding work, and will only benefit you if you are consistant. Plus more muscular gains = more motivation

And its easier to get cut while you have more muscle mass. It's better looking huge and cut than puny and cut . Also more muscle mass = faster metabolism = more fat utilization.

Hmm perhaps showing him pictures of those who have trained with you/peopel you have aided .

 

[The Red Dragon]

And tell him that girls go for strong/huge guys since they're in a better position to protect them (more security). An example being taller men getting more chicks than shorter guys. Not only that, but being huge can also instill fear in others gaining more respect and more compliance from others. Plus brute raw strength will carry into sports, harder swings, faster running, longer range and speed on throws etc.

 

[guldukat]

And tell him that girls go for strong/huge guys since they're in a better position to protect them (more security). An example being taller men getting more chicks than shorter guys. Not only that, but being huge can also instill fear in others gaining more respect and more compliance from others. Plus brute raw strength will carry into sports, harder swings, faster running, longer range and speed on throws etc.

I might take exception to the "girls go for the huge guys for security" bit, w/ respects Red.

In my experience, this is rarely true. I was the most muscular guy at my high school, but that alone didn't attract squat. Since only a handful of guys actually even lifted seriously, it actually set me apart as odd. (This was only 8-10 years ago...what can I say? Small school.)

I don't think women are out to be protected by someone who can physically do so. If a few are, that's still too shaky a generalization to repeat to an impressionable youngster.

I'd say most women appreciate a guy that carries himself with some confidence, who gaves the illusion of being able to take care of himself or those he cares about, though not necessarily with actual strength. I've seen this play out thousands of times before...the introverted, quiet guy with huge arms has fewer intimate relationships than the outgoing, very talkative scrawny dude.

I'd stick strictly to truthful things with the nephew and keep it extremely straight-forward. I'd also tell him, LISTEN TO YOUR AUNT FOR GOD'S SAKE!!!!!

 

[SofaGeorge]

Spatts, if I was your 15 year old nephew - I'd listen to you.

Write him a split and take him in to train with Hannibal and the rest of your wrecking crew.

While there - pull a couple deads for him.

The kid will think his aunt is some kind of god.

 

[gettinlarger]

Spatts, if I was your 15 year old nephew - I'd listen to you.

Write him a split and take him in to train with Hannibal and the rest of your wrecking crew.

While there - pull a couple deads for him.

The kid will think his aunt is some kind of god.

"Goddess."

I think the best advice anyone can give the kid is ... listen to spatts.

 

[Lee]

Why not just support him in what he wants to do and do everything you can to help? Maybe he'll get the desire to grow after he sees some gains. I know once I started seeing gains I got addicted to lifting. Just let him start out slow with some simple stuff, then as he progresses teach him more and more.

 

[spatts]

Perhaps I didn't clarify, but he's been lifting for a while on his own **VERY SERIOUSLY*** like for hours a day...and he is seeing gains. No one's pushing anything. He's spending 8-10 hours a week in the gym, when 4-5 would be more productive. He's probably going to see gains, but he's also a pitcher and trains with the ball team everyday. He's likely to injure himself if he keeps up this more-is-better mentality.

If anything, he's pushing HIMSELF too hard.

 

[Lee]

then tell him to back off a tad and he'll get the results he wants faster. but then again, its very hard for someone his age to overtrain.

 

[spatts]

Right, I'm not as concerned with the overtraining aspect as I am injury prevention. You have to understand our family. Most of the boys are athletes...and not just the college level. My brother bought an old Bally's Health Club and turned it into a baseball training facility for youth, and created a league. Both of this nephew's older brothers are on full rides for baseball at their universities, and one passed up the majors to go to college for 2 years first. He will probably take his option as a junior. He was the number one ranked high school pitcher in the country 2 years ago, at 18 years of age, 6'4", 220 pounds and a southpaw pitching in the 90's. His brother, about the same, only right handed. Now the 3rd brother, the one this thread is about, is following in their footsteps and is hoping to be, and rumored to be, even better than his brothers. These kids are dedicated and play for the love of the game, but also understand skill, weight training, speed, supplementation, etc...

My concern is that if he's down in that gym benching high and wide for rep after rep....and going heavy....what's that going to do to his elbow? And how will that effect his pitch? My brother is just now letting him start to throw curves now and then, and I don't want to see him on the disabled list just because no one stepped up and told him that a simple form/split change would've been better.

...really, I just want lifetime tix to his games.

 

[gettinlarger]

He's a pitcher, and I'm sure he's heard this before from coaches, etc, but make sure you have him understand that he'll need to work his rotator cuffs to prevent injury. Especially with lifting heavy.

 

[spatts]

EXACTLY! Another reason I don't want him downstairs doing stupid stuff to tear up his shoulders for a couple hours a day. Thanks, gettinlarger.