Adding creatine to cycle

[pushing_fe]

I will be starting my first cycle ever in a few days. I have been doing a lot of research and have gotten mixed information on wether using creatine at the same time would be beneficial or not.

I know that creatine will increase water retention, and Fina does not promote water retention. Are there any positives/negatives to using the two together.

I also have the oppurtunity to add HGH to my cycle as well, but since this is my first cycle I am a little weary on doing a stack and hell that stuff is expensive!

By the way this is my first post, whoopy f****** doo!


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pushing_fe

-Don't hate the player, hate the game!

 

[Silent Method]

I don't think you'd have any problem mixing the two. You may consider starting the creatine near the end of the cycle and continue through recovery. Creatine will help keep your strength up as well as help protect against muscle atrophy and waisting.

 

[pushing_fe]

Yeah that's probably a good idea. I haven't used creatine in several months, and I have actualy made decent gains with it in the past. Since this is my first cycle I am curious to see what kind of gains that I will see on the Fina, without the question of how of this is from creatine. However, I really don't think that will be an issue from what I understand.

 

[Silent Method]

Let us know how the cycle goes. Looking forward to using fina but I need to learn how to inject a few more spots first!

 

[pushing_fe]

Will do.

I am going to be doing Fina... 75 MG every other day for 6-7 weeks. Clomid afterwards.

Currently I am 5'11 195. Hopefully I'll get up to around 210. We'll see.

 

[HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex]

Hey fellas.Just dug up an interesting read out of one of my old Ironman mags.The following excerpts are providided by the notorious Michael Gundill(a.k.a. Dharkam)....Although creatine does have testosterone-like effects,it doesn't act as a steroid hormone.Instead,it's a mediator of some of the androgens' anabolic effects.In fact,steroid users get far more out of their cycles if they take in massive amounts of creatine along with the drugs.Androgens are among the hormones that can force the entry of creatine into muscle cells.While there's a clear relationship between muscle strength gains and increases in muscle creatine stores,unfortunately,the relationship is not as obvious when it comes to increases in muscle mass.Animal-based studies have shown that the muscles of untrained rats take up as much creatine as the muscles of trained rats,but the ANABOLIC effects of creatine are only obvious in trained rats.Therefore,training increases the muscles sensitivity to the anabolic actions of creatine.(Although it's not related to this article,the study also demonstrated that the anabolic effects of creatine are DIRECT,and not mediated by waterretention.In fact,in the 1970s American and Russian studies pointed out a DIRECT anabolic effect of creatine on muscle cells.)Testosterone increases the muscles'sensitivity to the anabolic properties of creatine in addition to enhancing the creatine buildup in muscle fibers.It's also obvious that part of the strength gains people experience while on steroids are mediated by an increase in muscle creatine stores.An interesting discovery A/S users have made is that they should dramatically increase their creatine intake during a cycle to boost the potency of the steroids.Thanks to creatine,people can build more muscle mass with fewer drugs.Anecdotal evidence from A/S users points out that it takes at least 10-15 grams(maintenance)of creatine a day to visibly enhance the the anabolic potency of a steroid stack.There are probably good reasons for the increased creatine requirement when androgen levels are high.As mentioned above,steroids increase the muscle uptake of creatine,and if the muscles are ready to accept more creatine,why not give it to them?I also think that even though steroids enhance creatine synthesis,they may increase creatine degradation as well-so more creatine is used up every day.That could be due to an increase in muscle creatine turnover and also the fact that an elevated muscle protein synthesis rate will likely consume creatine at a faster rate.Other reasons for a higher creatine requirement may be indirect.Because the muscles of drug users are stronger and receive more training,they may waste greater amounts of creatine during training.Once inside the muscle,creatine provides not only an anabolic effect,but also a rapidly mobilized source of fuel.Muscle protein synthesis is a process that wastes great amounts of energy.Anabolism is an ATP-dependent process,which means that it's essential for protein synthesis.If the cellular level of ATP is reduced even a little,IT STOPS ANABOLISM.So even if you can increase the testosterone content of your muscles,nothing will happen if your ATP level is low.Creatine supports anabolism by providing energy to the muscle...Well fellas,it looks like it might be a good idea to stock up on creatine when you're grabbing your protein powder for those bulking cycles,hehheh....Huck

 

[bigwillster]

Great post Fina.

 

[Silent Method]

Good post. On the other hand I wonder what effect using creatine durring the cycle has on your natural creatine production, rates of production, capacity for production, capacity for storage? I have a nagging feeling that full blown creatine supplementation durring the cycle may have negate some of the positive developments (such as increased natural creatine synthesis and capacity) one might achive without the supplementation.

Maybe this could be the basis for an experiment in grad school. I'm going to start writing my grant proposal now.

 

[HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex]

SM-Actually all those mechanisms will gradually desensitize over time,irregardless of whether you're on gear or not.Mitochondrial uptake and adaptation down-regulates after a certain period with creatine use.That is why it is always best ran in a cycle pattern(on for a certain period,off for a certain period).

 

[Silent Method]

SM-Actually all those mechanisms will gradually desensitize over time,irregardless of whether you're on gear or not.Mitochondrial uptake and adaptation down-regulates after a certain period with creatine use.That is why it is always best ran in a cycle pattern(on for a certain period,off for a certain period).

Huck, not sure were on the same page. Regarding my mention of "natural creatine production, rates of production, capacity for production, capacity for storage, rates of storage, etc" I'm talking about actual "permanent" physical adaptation. You can readily test this in athletes. Certain types of training facilitate physical adaptations manifest as increased rates of creatine production and storage that are more or less permanent. However, as you said, these mechanisms "will gradually desensitize over time."