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9-11

Steroid_Virgin

New member
Was no ones fault but a handful of extremist muslim arabs... people who blame the president (matt & 2 thick) and our government, might as well start with blaming the jews... after all they are the root cause of most strife in the middle east. Im tired of the US taking all the blows for isreal.. let them fight the arabs and get it over with... we dont need em anyhow.
 
You have to be shitting me. Israel is the "root cause of most strife in the middle east?" The ay-rabs use bombs made of nails, bolts & rat poison and send their children to detonate them among civilians.

War is a bitch. Too bad only the so-called 'palestinians' get to fight it like a war. If the US was being attacked daily (as the Israelis are) I would like to see the calls of restraint then. Hell, we whacked an entire wedding with an AC-130, didn't take out a single Al-Queda or Taliban combatant. Were we wrong? No. Mistakes happen. Imagine if israel does the same thing?

The Israelis also offered the 'palestinians' more than 90% of what they claimed they wanted. The 'palestinians' spit in their faces, not even putting up a counter-proposal. Israel is the "root cause of most strife in the middle east?" You're talking out your ass.

I do, however, fully agree with your first sentence. 9-11 was solely the fault of the ay-rabs...
 
Spiral Traveller said:
You have to be shitting me. Israel is the "root cause of most strife in the middle east?" The ay-rabs use bombs made of nails, bolts & rat poison and send their children to detonate them among civilians.

War is a bitch. Too bad only the so-called 'palestinians' get to fight it like a war. If the US was being attacked daily (as the Israelis are) I would like to see the calls of restraint then. Hell, we whacked an entire wedding with an AC-130, didn't take out a single Al-Queda or Taliban combatant. Were we wrong? No. Mistakes happen. Imagine if israel does the same thing?

The Israelis also offered the 'palestinians' more than 90% of what they claimed they wanted. The 'palestinians' spit in their faces, not even putting up a counter-proposal. Israel is the "root cause of most strife in the middle east?" You're talking out your ass.

I do, however, fully agree with your first sentence. 9-11 was solely the fault of the ay-rabs...

hahahahahahaaaaaa

yeah right!!!
 
SV,

Whatever. I don't blame the President for the events. I have been somewhat critical of the way he handled the military action in Afghanistan, and some of his motivations for installing Karzai as the new "head" of Afghanistan.

I am also critical of some of the post 9/11 "security" measures.


9/11 was the work of terrorists. I'd never say anything different.


The Middle East situation is pretty touchy. But it was the Arab Nations that have invaded Israel repeatedly, beginning immedaitely after its inception in 1948. In 1967 they invaded again, and Israel, having previously been invaded by them already, decided to occupy lands.

The US occupied Berlin after WW2, so did the Soviets. No one said shit. Now, it has to be bad, right? Whatever - the Arab countries were the aggressors in 1967, and they lost. Now they want a "do-over" and history doesn't work that way.


D-baller,

How can you worship a Jew yet condemn their beliefs and actions?
 
MattTheSkywalker said:
SV,

Whatever. I don't blame the President for the events. I have been somewhat critical of the way he handled the military action in Afghanistan, and some of his motivations for installing Karzai as the new "head" of Afghanistan.

I am also critical of some of the post 9/11 "security" measures.


9/11 was the work of terrorists. I'd never say anything different.


The Middle East situation is pretty touchy. But it was the Arab Nations that have invaded Israel repeatedly, beginning immedaitely after its inception in 1948. In 1967 they invaded again, and Israel, having previously been invaded by them already, decided to occupy lands.

The US occupied Berlin after WW2, so did the Soviets. No one said shit. Now, it has to be bad, right? Whatever - the Arab countries were the aggressors in 1967, and they lost. Now they want a "do-over" and history doesn't work that way.

Well said!
 
MattTheSkywalker said:
SV,

Whatever. I don't blame the President for the events. I have been somewhat critical of the way he handled the military action in Afghanistan, and some of his motivations for installing Karzai as the new "head" of Afghanistan.

I am also critical of some of the post 9/11 "security" measures.


9/11 was the work of terrorists. I'd never say anything different.


The Middle East situation is pretty touchy. But it was the Arab Nations that have invaded Israel repeatedly, beginning immedaitely after its inception in 1948. In 1967 they invaded again, and Israel, having previously been invaded by them already, decided to occupy lands.

The US occupied Berlin after WW2, so did the Soviets. No one said shit. Now, it has to be bad, right? Whatever - the Arab countries were the aggressors in 1967, and they lost. Now they want a "do-over" and history doesn't work that way.


D-baller,

How can you worship a Jew yet condemn their beliefs and actions?

I do not worship a Jew.
 
dballer said:


I do not worship a Jew.

Sorry. I thought you were Christian, and believed in the divinity of Jesus.
 
Steroid_Virgin said:
Was no ones fault but a handful of extremist muslim arabs... people who blame the president (matt & 2 thick) and our government, might as well start with blaming the jews... after all they are the root cause of most strife in the middle east. Im tired of the US taking all the blows for isreal.. let them fight the arabs and get it over with... we dont need em anyhow.

Wrong wrong wrong!


The imiigration policies of this country and the non-enforcement had a hand, as did the complacency of the American people, our weakened millitary, and a huge filure on the part of our intelligence community.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


Sorry. I thought you were Christian, and believed in the divinity of Jesus.

WOW!!! You figured it all out!!!
I have been misled!!
 
dballer said:


WOW!!! You figured it all out!!!
I have been misled!!

Well, Jesus was Jewish. A rabbi, even, if you believe the Bible.

Given the tone of your posts about Israel, that is an odd choice of deity.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


Well, Jesus was Jewish. A rabbi, even, if you believe the Bible.

Given the tone of your posts about Israel, that is an odd choice of deity.

Making up your own facts again Matt? Well, at least I see you took the advice I left for you in PM.. Glad to see that.. please refer me to any passage in the bible that says Jesus was a rabbi...
 
Steroid_Virgin said:


Making up your own facts again Matt? Well, at least I see you took the advice I left for you in PM.. Glad to see that.. please refer me to any passage in the bible that says Jesus was a rabbi...

There are numerous times in the Bible where the disciples refer to him as "teacher". Teacher is the English translation of "rabbi".
 
The US government is like a *Jewish* mother.


She just never knows when to keep her nose out of other people's business.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


There are numerous times in the Bible where the disciples refer to him as "teacher". Teacher is the English translation of "rabbi".

I was looking for this the otherday... can you point me to one passage??
 
dballer said:


I was looking for this the otherday... can you point me to one passage??

No offense, but I guess you didn't look too hard.


Matthew 19:16 Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, "Teacher , what good thing must I do to get eternal life?"


Matthew 22:35-37
35One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36"Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul



There are literally dozens in the gospels. What might also provide you some insight is to develop an underastanding of the relationships of teh Pharisees and Sadduccees with Roman officials.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


No offense, but I guess you didn't look too hard.


Matthew 19:16 Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, "Teacher , what good thing must I do to get eternal life?"


Matthew 22:35-37
35One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36"Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul



There are literally dozens in the gospels. What might also provide you some insight is to develop an underastanding of the relationships of teh Pharisees and Sadduccees with Roman officials.

I am sorry.. I guess I could not read too well .. my Bible does not use the word Rabbi.
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


There are numerous times in the Bible where the disciples refer to him as "teacher". Teacher is the English translation of "rabbi".

insegnante = teacher in Italian

Lehrer = teacher in German

profesor = teacher in Spanish


I guess you could have used any word for rabbi huh?
 
a rabbi and teacher are two entirely different things... lets look at your logic skywalker...

The jewish translation of rabbi is teacher, therfore all teachers are rabbis..

good one matt.
 
Steroid_Virgin said:
a rabbi and teacher are two entirely different things... lets look at your logic skywalker...

The jewish translation of rabbi is teacher, therfore all teachers are rabbis..

good one matt.

Rabbi----> teacher of Jewish laws and customs. A math teacher at a high school is not by definition a rabbi. I can't believe that was a stumbling block for you.

Jesus was a rabbi. Deal with it.
 
dballer said:


insegnante = teacher in Italian

Lehrer = teacher in German

profesor = teacher in Spanish


I guess you could have used any word for rabbi huh?

I am not exactly sure what you are saying here.

A rabbi is a teacher of Jewsih laws and customs. Look at the passages. Jesus was being asked about Jewish law and customs.
 
rabbi's can teach, that doesnt make a teacher a rabbi... jesus taught, he wasn't a "rabbi".. show me in the bible where it says jesus was a rabbi.. that was your statement..
 
MattTheSkywalker said:


I am not exactly sure what you are saying here.

A rabbi is a teacher of Jewsih laws and customs. Look at the passages. Jesus was being asked about Jewish law and customs.

I just looked those up... they do not use the word rabbi.

rabbi might mean teacher.. but teacher does not mean rabbi.. correct?
 
BO-CEPHUS said:
John 3:2

King James Version


also may want to check this one:


Matthew 26:25

Then Judas, the one who would betray him, said, "Surely not I, Rabbi?"
Jesus answered, "Yes, it is you."
 
Mark 10:51
"What do you want me to do for you?" Jesus asked him. The blind man said, "Rabbi, I want to see."

Mark 11:21
Peter remembered and said to Jesus, "Rabbi, look! The fig tree you cursed has withered!"


John 1:49
Then Nathanael declared, "Rabbi, you are the Son of God; you are the King of Israel."


John 4:31
Meanwhile his disciples urged him, "Rabbi, eat something."




John 9:2
His disciples asked him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?"
 
You are taking the word rabbi in its translation today, and super imposing it on a translation of words spoken 1000's of years ago. Why dont you ask your little jewish friends about this but The term "rabbi" is derived from the Hebrew word rav, which in biblical Hebrew meant: much, many, numerous, great.. Even some millitary officers were called rabbi... .. so because people have been quoted using the word rabbi, does not mean that he was a rabbi (in the modern sense of the word) i.e. jewish priest. He was way too radical even at the time to be considered a true rabbi..

Now Im sure Jews like to consider Jesus as a rabbi.. who would not want to claim such a wonderful being as thier own.. especially the jews...

Oh yeah happy yom kipper matt... why do you keep denying you are a jew?
 
choke on this skywalker....

To allege that "Jesus was a Jew" in the sense that during His lifetime Jesus professed and practiced the form of religious worship known and practiced under the modern name of "Judaism" is false and fiction of the most blasphemous nature. If to be a so- called or self-styled "Jew" then or now the practice of "Judaism" was a requirement then Jesus certainly was not a so-called "Jew". Jesus abhorred and denounced the form of religious worship practiced in Judea in His lifetime and which is known and practiced today under its new name "Judaism". That religious belief was then known as "Pharisiasm". The Christian clergy learned that in their theological seminary days but they have never made any attempt to make that clear to Christians.


The celebrated Rabbi Louis Finkelstein in his great classic quoted from above traces the origin of the form of religious worship practiced today under the present name "Judaism", to its origin as "Pharisaism" in Judea in the time of Jesus. Rabbi Louis Finkelstein confirms what the eminent Rabbi Adolph Moses states in his great classic Yahvism, and Other Discourses, in collaboration with the celebrated Rabbi H.G. Enlow, published in 1903 by the Louisville Section of the Council of Jewish Women, in which Rabbi Adolph Moses, on page 1, states:
"Among the innumerable misfortunes which have befallen...the most fatal in its consequences is the name Judaism...Worse still, the Jews themselves, who have gradually come to call their religion Judaism...Yet, neither in biblical nor post-biblical, neither in talmudic, nor in much later times, is the term Judaism ever heard...the Bible speaks of the religion...as "Torah Yahve", the instruction, or the moral law revealed by Yahve...in other places...as ÔYirath YahveÕ, the fear and reverence of Yahve. These and other appellations CONTINUED FOR MANY AGES TO STAND FOR THE RELIGION...To distinguish it from Christianity and Islam, the Jewish philosophers sometimes designate it as the faith or belief of the Jews...IT WAS FLAVIUS JOSEPHUS, WRITING FOR THE INSTRUCTION OF GREEKS AND ROMANS, WHO COINED THE TERM JUDAISM, in order to pit it against Hellenism...by Hellenism was understood the civilization, comprising language, poetry, religion, art, science, manners, customs, institutions, which...had spread from Greece, its original home, over vast regions of Europe, Asia and Africa...The Christians eagerly seized upon the name...the Jews themselves, who intensely detested the traitor Josephus, refrained from reading his works...HENCE THE TERM JUDAISM COINED BY JOSEPHUS REMAINED ABSOLUTELY UN- KNOWN TO THEM...IT WAS ONLY IN COMPARATIVELY RECENT TIMES, AFTER THE JEWS BECAME FAMILIAR WITH MODERN CHRISTIAN LITERATURE, THAT THEY BEGAN TO NAME THEIR RELIGION JUDAISM." (emphasis supplied).
This statement by the worldÕs two leading authorities on this subject clearly establishes beyond any question or any doubt that so-called "Judaism" was not the name of any form of religious worship practiced in Judea in the time of Jesus. The Flavius Josephus referred to in the above quotation lived in the 1st century. It was he who coined the word "Judaism" in the 1st century explicitly for the purpose recited clearly above. Religious worship known and practiced today under the name of "Judaism" by so- called or self-styled "Jews" throughout the world was known and practiced in Judea in the time of Jesus under the name "Pharisaism" according to Rabbi Louis Finkelstein, head of the Jewish Theological Seminary of America, and all the other most competent and qualified recognized authorities on the subject.

http://www.melvig.org/facts/judaism.html
 
During His lifetime, no persons were described as "Jews" anywhere. That fact is supported by theology, history and science. When Jesus was in Judea, it was not the "homeland" of the ancestors of those who today style themselves "Jews". Their ancestors never set a foot in Judea. They existed at that time in Asia, their "homeland", and were known as Khazars. In none of the manuscripts of the original Old or New Testament was Jesus described or referred to as a "Jew". The term originated in the late eighteenth century as an abbreviation of the term Judean and refers to a resident of Judea without regard to race or religion, just as the term "Texan" signifies a person living in Texas.

In spite of the powerful propaganda effort of the so-called "Jews", they have been unable to prove in recorded history that there is one record, prior to that period, of a race religion or nationality, referred to as "Jew". The religious sect in Judea, in the time of Jesus, to which self-styled "Jews" today refer to as "Jews", were known as "Pharisees". "Judaism" today and "Pharisaism" in the time of Jesus are the same.

Jesus abhorred and denounced "Pharisaism"; hence the words, "Woe unto you Scribes and Pharisees, Hypocrites, Ye Serpents, Ye Generation of Vipers".

http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/jesusjew.htm
 
Steroid_Virgin said:
You are taking the word rabbi in its translation today, and super imposing it on a translation of words spoken 1000's of years ago. Why dont you ask your little jewish friends about this but The term "rabbi" is derived from the Hebrew word rav, which in biblical Hebrew meant: much, many, numerous, great.. Even some millitary officers were called rabbi... .. so because people have been quoted using the word rabbi, does not mean that he was a rabbi (in the modern sense of the word) i.e. jewish priest. He was way too radical even at the time to be considered a true rabbi..

Now Im sure Jews like to consider Jesus as a rabbi.. who would not want to claim such a wonderful being as thier own.. especially the jews...

Oh yeah happy yom kipper matt... why do you keep denying you are a jew?


The etymology of the word rabbi is not especially relevant. Can we agree that 'rabbi' means 'informed or influential man in teh Jewish community'?

You make some good points about the radical-ness of Jesus at the time. Go on with that. Read some history about Jews, and their inter-relationship with the Roman empire, and how Jews were dividied into several different factions, which is rare in their history. It is interesting and informative literature, and it will help you to understand Jesus better. He was definintely a rabbi.

The phrase 'jewish priest' is a little bit misleading. There are not a lot of rituals in Judaism (as there are in Catholicism) that require priestly activites.

Jews consider Jesus an interesting historical figure who stood up to Rome. They don't have to 'claim' him - there is no doubt he was Jewish. The jewish religion would not allow for a man to be holy. (Another reason that 'jewish priest' is bad phrasing) God alone is holy to Jews.

You make a few snotty remarks about Jews. Why is that?

Yom Kippur is not a happy day. It is a day of atonement for Jews - no food or drink for 24 hours. Wishing someone a happy Yom Kippur is of-base. However, Rosh Hashanah, the jewsih new year, just passed. That is more festive. A jew would have appreciated a 'happy new year' last week.

Finally, I am not Jewish. I wouldn;t be ashmed of it though. I'm just informed about it. Why belittle that? Religions can be fun to read about.
 
Steroid_Virgin said:
During His lifetime, no persons were described as "Jews" anywhere. The term originated in the late eighteenth century

In spite of the powerful propaganda effort of the so-called "Jews", they have been unable to prove in recorded history that there is one record, prior to that period, of a race religion or nationality, referred to as "Jew".


Well, there is just one problem with your post. The word 'jew' appears all over the Old testament. So is this link true, or is the Old Testament true? Which do you believe?


Ezra 6:7
Do not interfere with the work on this temple of God. Let the governor of the Jews and the Jewish elders rebuild this house of God on its site.


Ezra 6:8
Moreover, I hereby decree what you are to do for these elders of the Jews in the construction of this house of God: The expenses of these men are to be fully paid out of the royal treasury, from the revenues of Trans-Euphrates, so that the work will not stop.


Esther 8:1
That same day King Xerxes gave Queen Esther the estate of Haman, the enemy of the Jews. And Mordecai came into the presence of the king, for Esther had told how he was related to her
 

The celebrated Rabbi Louis Finkelstein in his great classic quoted from above traces the origin of the form of religious worship practiced today under the present name "Judaism", to its origin as "Pharisaism" in Judea in the time of Jesus.

Is the author really saying the modern day Judaism traces back to Pharisaism at the time of Jesus? Then who was Moses? Where did the 10 commandments come from? How do you explain Matthew 22:35-37, in which Jesus is asked about the commandments, if Judaism/Pharisaism started in the time of Jesus, as your author states?

Why would Jesus be asked about something as old as the commandments, if the belief system now known as Judaism didn't exist?

Matthew 22:35-37
35One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question:
36"Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" 37Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul





...the Jews themselves, who intensely detested the traitor Josephus, refrained from reading his works..

OK - here we have the author of your first link referring to 'jews' 1700 years ago, in the time of the writings of Flavius Josephus (according to your link). The other link you posted says that the word 'jew' can't to bein the 18th century. Why wouldn't this author use the word 'khazar' or 'pharisee', if his intent was to be historically accurate?

Why were his disciples calling him rabbi? why is the old testament filled with the word 'jew'?


It looks like you did a quick Internet search, as opposed to research.
 
you never talk about the New Testament... that is the most important part.
 
dballer said:
you never talk about the New Testament... that is the most important part.

I mentioend several links where 'teacher' or 'rabbi' was used in the NT.

Steroid Virgin's post was best addressed using the OT since he was addressing the history of the Jewish population, most accurately addressed in the NT.


The hsotry of Saul and Paul is some really interesting stuff too. What an influential guy!
 
dballer said:
I like Lot... and Job.

You like your job a lot?

:)

have a good weekend bro!! I am outta here.
 
No man.. I do not like it alot.

I sit at a desk all day long talking about shit I cannot change with someone who has the same power!!

I am outta here too.
see ya Monday.
 
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