6oxo as an AI during cycle ?

[lakelandrb20]

ive heard alot of things about people just using 6oxo as an AI during their cycles if they are not really prone to gyno symptoms during your cycle. what do you think ?

 

[52_21_30]

I think 6-oxo is garbage. Use a real AI (aromasin, AIFM, arimidex, etc) or nothing at all. You can use the money you save on 6-oxo to buy the people who told you that matching bra's. They're going to need them.

 

[Cutt29]

agree with 52, use a real AI

 

[Magick69]

I read few threads about it and all used it for a PCT after gear use with tribulus etc.. and they said it was working you need to follow the protocol of PA written on ergopahrm web. It has been also tested at uni

I will let u know because i will use after my cycle of anavar is finished, i herad many stuff about nolva and clomid toxicity

 

[lakelandrb20]

i am going to use arimidex with my cycle but was just curious about the rumors

 

[Ulter]

It's a shame that people will try to make a buck on something like that. PCT is serious medical protocol. Modern cycling has evolved into the same. The drugs that are used for cycling and PCT are drugs that have clinical research done by drug companies to make sure the work. Schering tested Proviron, Pfizer tested Aromasin, Clomid by Aventis, etc. Even AIFM's ingredient was tested by drug companies back in the 70's. All of these are drugs each with dozens of studies done on them showing what they do. So what why would you risk using a supplement for something as serious as steroid use?

 

[Primordial Performance]

It's a shame that people will try to make a buck on something like that. PCT is serious medical protocol. Modern cycling has evolved into the same. The drugs that are used for cycling and PCT are drugs that have clinical research done by drug companies to make sure the work. Schering tested Proviron, Pfizer tested Aromasin, Clomid by Aventis, etc. Even AIFM's ingredient was tested by drug companies back in the 70's. All of these are drugs each with dozens of studies done on them showing what they do. So what why would you risk using a supplement for something as serious as steroid use?

Ulter,

Its also a shame that bodybuilders have to rely on toxic drugs for PCT. Most all drugs used today in “modern” PCT protocols were drugs developed for breast cancer patients’ over 30 years ago. There is certainly nothing modern about 6-oxo, hcg, clomid, nolva, ect, and just cause something has been practiced for years does not make it optimal.

I’ve delt with hundreds of men who have followed the “tried and true” PCT protocols, only to wind up in an endocrinologist’s office 6 months later, or on the juice again for lack of returning testosterone levels. Even the most up to date medical practices used for hypogonadal men entail a constant balancing act, shooting up another shot, taking another pill, drawing more blood for another analysis, then doing it all over again ect, ect.

IMO, the bodybuilding community is long overdue for a safer and more effective PCT, and lets just say, we’ve got our fingers crossed.

Whats even more of a shame is someone who attempts to squash a fresh idea for fear of losing a buck… but I digress.

-Pp

 

[Cutt29]

Ulter,

Its also a shame that bodybuilders have to rely on toxic drugs for PCT. Most all drugs used today in “modern” PCT protocols were drugs developed for breast cancer patients’ over 30 years ago. There is certainly nothing modern about 6-oxo, hcg, clomid, nolva, ect, and just cause something has been practiced for years does not make it optimal.

I’ve delt with hundreds of men who have followed the “tried and true” PCT protocols, only to wind up in an endocrinologist’s office 6 months later, or on the juice again for lack of returning testosterone levels. Even the most up to date medical practices used for hypogonadal men entail a constant balancing act, shooting up another shot, taking another pill, drawing more blood for another analysis, then doing it all over again ect, ect.

IMO, the bodybuilding community is long overdue for a safer and more effective PCT, and lets just say, we’ve got our fingers crossed.

Whats even more of a shame is someone who attempts to squash a fresh idea for fear of losing a buck… but I digress.

-Pp

you are proposing that your lotion will be a stand alone for PCT????? keep your fingers crossed

 

[Primordial Performance]

you are proposing that your lotion will be a stand alone for PCT????? keep your fingers crossed

Your lotion, my lotion, whatever.

I just prefer that PCT protocols not be ran by dictatorship, that’s all.


-Pp

 

[Cutt29]

Your lotion, my lotion, whatever.

I just prefer that PCT protocols not be ran by dictatorship, that’s all.


-Pp

my lotion??
dictatorship or medically established protocols?

 

[Ulter]

Ulter,

Its also a shame that bodybuilders have to rely on toxic drugs for PCT. Most all drugs used today in “modern” PCT protocols were drugs developed for breast cancer patients’ over 30 years ago.

Toxic drugs for PCT? That's pretty funny. Please tell me which drug used for PCT is more toxic than the drugs used for the cycles themselves. And what difference does it make what a drug is developed for? Hundreds of drugs are patented for one use and another is found later. That's called progress.

I’ve delt with hundreds of men who have followed the “tried and true” PCT protocols, only to wind up in an endocrinologist’s office 6 months later, or on the juice again for lack of returning testosterone levels. Even the most up to date medical practices used for hypogonadal men entail a constant balancing act, shooting up another shot, taking another pill, drawing more blood for another analysis, then doing it all over again ect, ect.

I'm sorry to hear that you know so many men like that. I don't. I have over 50,000 posts across many steroid discussion boards. Last year I answered an average of 131 emails about steroids a day. Spare me all the talk about YOUR experience in this field. Of the thousands that I have helped on this board alone none fit the description you've written there.
You keep talking as though something is broken; modern PCT. It's not. Of the thousands of men on Elite since 1995 there aren't more than a handful of posts by men who wound up in an endo's office crashed and unable to recover.
If that post is the idea you've contrived to convince people of the need for your product it's going to fail you. Because you're selling a story that is drama and fiction. And we all know better. You should just let the marketplace decide and stop trying to create this illusion that modern PCT doesn't work.

Whats even more of a shame is someone who attempts to squash a fresh idea for fear of losing a buck… but I digress.

That's hilarious. I can't do anything worse than what you're doing yourself to sink your product. You just keep masturbating that ego by telling yourself I fear you.

 

[Primordial Performance]

I'm sorry to hear that you know so many men like that. I don't. I have over 50,000 posts across many steroid discussion boards. Last year I answered an average of 131 emails about steroids a day. Spare me all the talk about YOUR experience in this field. Of the thousands that I have helped on this board alone none fit the description you've written there.
You keep talking as though something is broken; modern PCT. It's not. Of the thousands of men on Elite since 1995 there aren't more than a handful of posts by men who wound up in an endo's office crashed and unable to recover.
If that post is the idea you've contrived to convince people of the need for your product it's going to fail you. Because you're selling a story that is drama and fiction. And we all know better. You should just let the marketplace decide and stop trying to create this illusion that modern PCT doesn't work.

Ulter,

Drama and fiction eh? Tell that to the guys who cant get it up, or whom have a non-existent sex drive. Just because you lack experience with this kind of AAS user doesn’t mean they do not exist. Perhaps they don’t come to you for advice for fear of having AF products shoved down their throat.

There is no need to gloat in your number of posts or emails. I have plenty of AAS experience, as do many bros on this board. This is a public forum for people to gather and share information. I have my opinions, and you have yours. Modern PCT works for many, but not for everyone…. and that is real life.

-Pp

 

[Ulter]

I’ve delt with hundreds of men who have followed the “tried and true” PCT protocols, only to wind up in an endocrinologist’s office 6 months later, or on the juice again for lack of returning testosterone levels.

Yes, this is both drama and fiction.

Perhaps they don’t come to you for advice for fear of having AF products shoved down their throat.

You're clueless.

 

[52_21_30]

This is probably neither here nor there but I have spent a great deal of my research for my PhD alongside many endocrinologists who are salaried by drug companies (of course those which I can not name) to run clinical trials, but who also have their own practices. One of which has a practice that is largely devoted to hypogonadism. He treats everyone from hypogonadal teens to middle aged men and of course the older crowd. We've had many frank discussions off the record as my major (and really only) concern of prolonged AAS use is sterility. Now this is one account from one endo, but he told me that in 17 years of treating many, many steroid users (and abusers), he had only seen 2 cases of sterility and only a handful of cases with prolonged sexual dysfunction. Again, he is an expert in this field and who knows how long the men suffered before they came to him. But I only mention this because while he can not advertise this, he really is a PCT guru. That's what he does. He creates cocktails of certain doses of drugs (the classics, HCG, clomiphene, and his favorite AI is aromasin) to help men recover.

So my contention is that if these drugs are good enough for a Mass General trained endocrinologist who does this for a living, they are good enough for little old me. I think the reason why many men claim PCT has "failed" them is because they were not doing it properly, or perhaps using liquid products with low bioavailability.

 

[Dr. JK]

I think 6-oxo is garbage. Use a real AI (aromasin, AIFM, arimidex, etc) or nothing at all. You can use the money you save on 6-oxo to buy the people who told you that matching bra's. They're going to need them.

Could not have said it better

 

[Dr. JK]

The PCT drugs we use may not be modern, BUT what is the alternative?

Therefore, unless someone can tell me differtent, these drugs (HCG, Clomid, AIFM, Proviron, Arimidex, Nolvadex) are the best drugs avaialble making them the best chioce with tons of hitstorical data to prove their significance.

If PCT is not done right you will not recover properly (personal experience)
If done properly I think there is high probability (>95%) that most men will recover and regain sexual stimulation/function....

 

[Cutt29]

or perhaps using liquid products with low bioavailability.

how do liquid products have low bioavalibilty? every liquid product i have used has worked great

 

[GymIntensity]

Ulter,

Drama and fiction eh? Tell that to the guys who cant get it up, or whom have a non-existent sex drive. Just because you lack experience with this kind of AAS user doesn’t mean they do not exist. Perhaps they don’t come to you for advice for fear of having AF products shoved down their throat.

There is no need to gloat in your number of posts or emails. I have plenty of AAS experience, as do many bros on this board. This is a public forum for people to gather and share information. I have my opinions, and you have yours. Modern PCT works for many, but not for everyone…. and that is real life.

-Pp

Yeah, and I have my opinion. You are an idiot. Everytime you post it makes ME feel dumb. Nice marketing skills.

 

[lifthard2005]

i am going to use arimidex with my cycle but was just curious about the rumors

bro, dont waste $ on adex, aromasin works better and is cheaper....adex is overrated IMO