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1st CYCLE - Veterans, enlighten me...

Vega007

New member
Hello To All! I am a newbie as you all may guess, but I have spent countless hours reading these boards over the past few weeks and have decided to join the family, I am looking forward to reading your replies... with that said... I need some insight on my "cycle-in-the-making". I have only done a transdermal fina-H cycle before about a year ago, which was a bit out there for a first-timer I know and I got shredded and pumps out of this world, but I need to get a taste of some real blood.

I am 21; 5'11", 180lbs, approx. 11-15%bf, solid build, but I am looking to step up to the next level. I train 5 days a week, high-intensity low reps (6-10) one bp per day, and carefully plan my diet. I just hooked up with a really good source, can get just about anything except EQ, however being a major in the health field and knowing a good bit about AS's and their implications, I need some advice in order to attain my goals, both safely and permanently from the pros. I hear alot about Sustenon/test based cycles and I understand that a test is the base of any good cycle, but I am torn with which path I should follow, and still I continue to hear mixed opinions with regards to whether or not one should pursue cycle long durations of Proviron and/or Nolvadex (due to potential hinderance of gains) or use Arimidex instead, whether or not HCG is necessary if Clomid is to be used, etc.

Initially I was going to go with Primo (depot), but although mild, I have heard horror stories of hair loss (along with Masteron). My goal is to gain 15lbs of permanent lean muscle, not the bloated "sauce" look that comes and goes and lets everyone laugh at you post cycele, but sizable mass/strength that won't disappear and won't put me in bankruptcy.

Should I go with a classic 500mgSust/400mgDeca/30mgDBol(kickstart initial 4 weeks)/Clomid cycle or being that it is my first true cycle, do you think I could save some cash and potential sides and stick with a more novice duo stack such as a sust/winny, deca/winny, sust/deca, etc. cycle and still reach my goals, stick the gains, and not burn my pocket? I would personally like to avoid "deca dick", sever acne, testicular atrophy, high H20 retention, etc. as we all would, but I need some serious input. My receptors have never really been touched, so anything is going to work, I just know the 1st time should be the hardest receptor hitting cycle of all...

I know this is lengthy and I apologize for that, but I continue to read excellent info posted by the likes of M18, Stew, TxLonghorn, etc. and am wishing that one or all of you might be nice enough to extend some veteran knowledge toward my direction. It took a while, but these boards are family and that's cool as hell. I'm hoping to hear some of your good advice.

Thanks in advance to all...

Peace.
VEGA PLEASE HELP FELLAz!
 
Okay, that was a lot for one post, so I may miss some questions. If so, just ask them again.

Hmmm, arimidex/liquidex can't be beat. Always take it over nolva and proviron. That is if you can afford it.

Masteron, I have looked for masteron and can't find any real shit. So, be careful.

No water retention, but no 'deca' or whatever dick. Well, the best thing is to take test at 250mg/week. That should give you minimal sides (water, etc.) and keep everything up and running.

Deca will give you a bloat. Dbol will unless you take some liquidex.

Winny won't.

Hmmm, maybe a test/winny stack, and one more. Well, all I can think of is deca. But that would definitely be a good stack. Maybe deca at 400mg/week, or even 300mg/week. One problem with deca is how often it is faked, so be careful on that, too.

Little money, low water/sides, no eq....yep, that looks about it.
 
txlonghorn pretty much sumed it up. just wanted to say welome to the board and feel free to email me if you have any questions.
 
first of all----WELCOME you won't find a better place TX has made some good points. My preference would be to add d-bol to jump start that Test/winny cycle thats about it...my 2cts worth. RADAR
 
Good info Tx
Bigwhitedude, There is no need to pyramid like that, the Sust with taper down itself because of the diffrent esters. He will also need Clomid for post cycle.

M18
 
bigwhitedude said:
sorry your wrong...

piramiding is used as means of a counter=balance .......... every bodybuilder from the 80's to the 90's knows this ....

in other words your bodys fooled in to thinking nothing has happened thus your testosterone levels stay the same ,,,, example you stress your mom she begins to get angry then shes yelling then she begins to calms back down as you give her some candy dude.!

god help us do i have to spell it all out for you guys! thinkkkkkkkkkk thinkkkkkkkk thinkkkkkkk about it!

where you been?

taper.? the hcg will secure that the gains keep coming on to proportion........

aaaa your firgure it out smart guy... i been doing this since the 80's......

917aa3e.jpg

That's funny, I've met quite a few pro body builders and I know a couple guys personally, and none of them pyramid. Where have you been? Time to catch up to the 90's. Do you think any of today's pro' s follow your shitty idea of what a cycle should be? I think not.
 
every bodybuilder from the 80's to the 90's knows this ....

yes and weve learned since then that it is better generally to have a steady amount - nobody pyramids anymore - u gotta renew those out of date, old library book where u are getting this info.

BTW: the effort in your long and well meaning post was appreciated - its just that Mustang is right.
 
Gracias

To all who posted their responses - thank you all amply. I need to just calculate dosages so I can figure price checks and what not. What kind of gains can I expect from a Sust/Winny/Dbol and post clomid cycle? Will these gains be retained? I have been advised to take 250mg/wk of Sust instead of the ever-so-commonly-suggested 500mg dose to avoid excessive water retention. Any takes on this? Gyno and that puffy look just don't do it for me, but strength and lean mass are key. Can anyone take a ballpark estimate of price range for such a cycle? Holla when you guys get the chance & thanks again... if I can help with anything let me know!

Peace.

VEGA
 
agree with big, pyramiding is the way to go, it's been using for years and it has worked. Possibly lots of bros who wonder when will Test kick in in because they have started at full dose instead of pyramiding
 
You've already got alot of good info and cycles! Here's what I would go with:

Bulking Cycle
Sust 500mg/week 1-8
EQ 400mg/week 1-10
D-bol 30mg/ED 1-4

Cutting
Sust 500mg/week 1-10
Winny 50-100mg/ED 1-6
Anavar 40mg/ED 7-10(12)
Creatine throughout!

As I said before, you have gotten alot of good info, I just want to add my advice in there. The good thing about this board is that you get alot of help from alot of people. But when it comes down to it...You gotta make the choice!

Take everyone's advice and then research it on your own and decide what you think will be best for your goals and fears!

See ya later bro, and welcome!
B-10

P.S. This was a very good first post, well thought out and constructed! You should see some of the bullshit newbies right on there first post! It gets rediculous!

Happy Growing!
 
I wish I could do my first cycle again. I made the mistake of doing a mild cycles the first two and my gains were solid but not what I expected.

I took over three years off after the second cycle. This time I front loaded and upped the dosage, and am happy with the results.

Propinate is great to start and end with. TestoprimD is a very inexpensive 50mg of prop with 200 mg of enanthate.

This is what I would do:

Day 1 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300 (one injection)
Day 3 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 5 1cc TestoprimD
Day 8 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 11 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 14 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 17 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 20 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 23 1cc TestoprimD 1cc Nora 300
Day 27 1cc Nora 300
Day 34 2cc Nora 300
Day 41 2cc Nora 300

Day 1 - 21 20-30mg of dbol a day
Day 28 - 48 50 mg of oral winstol or 1 amp eod
Day 54 - 62 2000iu of hcg eod
Day 66-42 100mg clomid
Day 42-28 50mg clomid

This might be too many injections for a first cycle, but you would love the results. You can substitute Sustanon for TesoprimD and Equipoise for Deca.

Cost
9 TestoprimD @ around $ 54
2 Nora 300 @ around $200
120 dbod $ 60
20 50mg blue winny's $ 20
21 Clomid $ 20
2 5000iu hcg $ 40

Total cost around $400

e-mail me if you have any questions.

Stay safe
 
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