1st cycle, keepable mass

[kov951]

I planning my first cycle, my goal is for a good amount of keepable mass with minimal bloat. I know alot of people advocate using test as base for all cycles but I'd rather not do that. For one I'd like to avoid extreme bloat, I'd also like to wait to try test until I see if I can make good gains without it. My stats, I'm 25, 225lbs. 5'11", fairly lean, arms 18, squat 405x8, deadlift 405x10, bench 315x6. My diet is very solid IMO, and my training is intense and consistent. With all that being said this is what I have planned so far, pending any advice to modify it.

Weeks 1-12 EQ 500mg/week
Weeks 1-4 Dbol 30mg/day
Weeks 10-14 Winny (oral) 50mg/day
Weeks 1-14 Arimidex 0.5mg/day

PCT I was thinking HCG and nolva, but im also considering some HCG half way through, what do you think?

I'm also thinking about an injectable to take during weeks 5-10. All i could think of was tren but im worried about libido problems and heavy shutdown.

So does anyone have any advice. I'm honestly looking to put on about 20lbs., 15 keepable. I eat at least 350grams protein/day and usually around 5000 calories. I'v always been a small kid but over the years i've managed to bring myself up and now im looking to take the next step. Any advice, comments, ideas etc. are greatly appreciated.

 

[mcr]

It looks pretty good bro, but I personally think you should use test instead (or a small dose in addition). You've got adex in there, which should keep you dry.

 

[kov951]

I've just read so many cycle logs where despite taking even 1mg adex/day they still bloated like hell. With the dbol i could stand being bloated for 4 weeks, but I don't know about 12 weeks.

 

[got2getripped]

bloating also has a lot to do with the dosage of the test or dbol. Try a lower dose.

 

[gregory]

I think that for your first cycle you are doing the equivalent of shooting a cannon at a fly. Your dosage and stack is totally unecessary for a newbie. You should slowly gain experience in your cycles. Your early cycles should be about 6-8 weeks max and utilise SINGLE compounds, you then know which AS gives you what kind of result, see my point? This will be invaluable information for your future. If you made a cycle of the dball for 6 weeks and .25 mg Arimidex EOD to allow some slight bloat you would gain 15-20 lbs, so what's the point of using more at this stage. Then Wait 8 weeks and do a light Winny and light EQ cycle for 6-8 weeks and you'll gain like a weed, again taking note on how you feel and respond to those 2 compounds. You'll gain muscle easily so take your time and stretch your gear out, you'll be glad you did, trust a vet dude.

 

[slat1]

I think that for your first cycle you are doing the equivalent of shooting a cannon at a fly. Your dosage and stack is totally unecessary for a newbie. You should slowly gain experience in your cycles. Your early cycles should be about 6-8 weeks max and utilise SINGLE compounds, you then know which AS gives you what kind of result, see my point? This will be invaluable information for your future. If you made a cycle of the dball for 6 weeks and .25 mg Arimidex EOD to allow some slight bloat you would gain 15-20 lbs, so what's the point of using more at this stage. Then Wait 8 weeks and do a light Winny and light EQ cycle for 6-8 weeks and you'll gain like a weed, again taking note on how you feel and respond to those 2 compounds. You'll gain muscle easily so take your time and stretch your gear out, you'll be glad you did, trust a vet dude.

I totally agree with Gregory! You will have no idea how your body responds to any of those items you listed. Its basic science my man. Start simple. Then after viewing the results you make a small change to try and get closer to the goal. You don't add in a bunch of compounds because there will be no way to verify what worked and what didn't!
I would run test at 250mgs a week. Doesn't sound like much but I went from 200 to 220! No bloat at all either! Eight or ten weeks.
I would run HCG during. You will never regret it. Clomid after.
Good Luck

 

[Swoolen_Puppy]

I totally agree with Gregory! You will have no idea how your body responds to any of those items you listed. Its basic science my man. Start simple. Then after viewing the results you make a small change to try and get closer to the goal. You don't add in a bunch of compounds because there will be no way to verify what worked and what didn't!
I would run test at 250mgs a week. Doesn't sound like much but I went from 200 to 220! No bloat at all either! Eight or ten weeks.
I would run HCG during. You will never regret it. Clomid after.
Good Luck

Yup, I agree with as well. Run the test @200 or 250mgs/wk for 8wks and the d-bol @25mg/ed for weeks1-4.Train hard,eat solid and you will be very pleased. These guys arent bullshitting. people dont really understand how much they gain from 250mgs of test! My lil brother is on d-bol@25mgs/wk weeks 1-4 and 200mgs/wk of cyp and he is looking pretty damn good And he has no bloat
S_P

 

[kov951]

I think its smart to use the least number of substances and the smallest dose to get the job done, but I still want to get the job done, and done right. I suppose its down to 2 choices then. Either test, or EQ and or dbol. I definatly dont want to use dbol and test together just yet. If i had the choice between 250mg/test for 12 weeks, and 500mg/EQ for 12 weeks with or without a few weeks of dbol in the beginning, which should I choose, keeping in mind that I want relatively slow steady gains that arent going to disappear post cycle, and the absolute least bloat possible. Thanks for the replys so far.

 

[wootoom]

you should use some Liver protectants also