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Help with my first cycle please....

I think I figured out what I'm going to do. How does this look?

wks 1-10 Test Cyp 400mg/wk
wks 1-10 A-dex as needed to ward off water retention

PCT (2 weeks after last injection)
Nolva 40/20/20/20
Clomid 50/50/50/50

Now, I was thinking about adding T3 in there somewhere to get a good amount of fat loss going. Where in this cycle would I do this and what dosages? How would it look with the T3? And......how dangerous is adding the T3?

Thanks

Bro, you are to all overe the place, K.I.S.S

Needto gave you some great advice all i could do is back him up, the monsterdrol/superdrol (i used superdrol) same stuff works great when on a diet just what you are looking for keep good strength add a few pounds of lean muscle while it drys and hardends, but of course 80% of this is all gonna be diet regardless of what you take...

-20mgs ed week 1
-30mgs ed week 2-4

pct with sustan 4weeeks
 
You need to understand that steroids will add mass with increase in diet.

Dieting while on steroids to loose fat will only help you keep the muscle you already have.

There is no sence in using steroids to loose body fat and gain muscle in my opinion. This can be done but you are better off doing a cycle, getting big and then dieting down afterwards.

You are wasting your money trying to get big and lean at the same time.

Eating enough cals. The right amount or protein and clean cals will grow muscle. Doing this well on steroids will grow more muscle. Steroids also simulate fat loss in many different ways. Yes you can lose bodyfat and gain muscle well using steroids. Hell you can do it with out them but well on them it will happen even faster.

All androgenic steroids bind to the AR receptor at different levels, not only in muscles but fat cells too. When steroids bind to the AR receptor in the fat cells stronger they cause more subcutaneous fat loss.

Some steroids have a dramatic effect on fat lose in a number of ways. For now we will look at just one. Proviron.

1.Proviron strongly suppresses the forming of estrogen. Estrogen
causes fat storage. Hence why woman have more bf% then men.
2. Proviron has a High affinity to the Ar in fat cells. Androgen receptors are found in fat cells as well as muscle cells, and while they act on the AR in muscle cells to promote growth, they also act directly on the AR in fat cells to affect fat burning. The stronger the androgen binds to the A.R, the higher the lipolytic (fat burning) effect on adipose (fat)tissue. And if you add, for example, testosterone to the mix, it increases the number of AR's in muscle and fat
3. Proviron like almost all steroids steroids Decreases the levels of an enzyme called lipasel. This forms lipids in fat cells and may be upregulated by how strongly a steroid attaches to a AR receptor in the fat cells(of course Proviron being one of the best as its attaches to Ar's at a higher rate then almost all aas).

4. Proverion like all steroids upregulate the glucocortisoid receptor. By blocking this receptor they control coristol and is this is how people on steroids can workout more often, without as much worry about overtraining. Controlling cortisol should lead to fat loss because cortisol promotes fat gain and muscle loss. When you prevent cortisol from attaching to the glucocorticoid receptor, you lower lipasel. This is the same enzyme we mentioned earlier, that helps form lipid.


The Androgen Receptor

There are many mechanisms behind the ability of androgens to reduce body fat. However, one key determinant of the amount of adipose tissue reduced is that particular androgen's ability to bind to the AR.

I need to mention that most androgens interact with both AR and GR (Glucocorticoid Receptors). We'll touch on that later. For now, let me explain why it matters how well an androgen binds to the AR in terms of reducing adipose tissue. Most of you know that ARs are present in tissue such as muscle. This is one of the mechanisms behind their ability to induce muscular hypertrophy. Now what does this have to do with body fat? Simple, AR's are present in adipose tissue as well. (1)

What does this mean? Well, it's been shown that the higher the density of ARs, the more that lipid uptake is inhibited. (2) It's also been shown that androgens that bind avidly to the AR cause an increase or upregulation of AR in adipocytes. (1) I think the greater the androgen binds to the AR, the more upregulation of AR in adipocytes occurs. This would lead to a significant reduction in subcutaneous adipose tissue. (3)

Notice that I specifically mentioned subcutaneous adipose tissue (fat right beneath the skin) and not visceral adipose tissue (fat around the internal organs). Why did I bother to differentiate between the two? Simple. For the most part, we bodybuilders are concerned only with subcutaneous adipose tissue. Visceral fat doesn't have much of an effect on a person's appearance. For that reason, we're only concerning ourselves with subcutaneous adipose tissue.

Now, what other mechanisms of action can account for the effects seen with those steroids that bind tightly to the AR? Well, those that bind tightly to the AR will decrease LPL (Lipoprotein Lipase), which is an enzyme that causes lipid accumulation. (4) They may also decrease Acetyl-CoA Carboxylase and Fatty Acid Synthetase.(5)

Another interesting note is that androgens have been shown to increase adenyl cylclase as well. This is the enzyme which is responsible for the conversion of cytoplasmic ATP into cyclic AMP. Increasing its concentrations is a good thing, in other words.

1. Dieudonne MN, et al. "Androgen receptors in human preadipocytes and adipocytes: regional specifities and regulation by sex steroids." Am J Physiol 1998 Jun;274(6 Pt 1): C1645-52

2. Sjogren J, et al. "Androgen binding hormone to adipose tissue in rats." Biochim Biophys Acta 1995 May 11;1244(1):117-20

3. De Pergola G, et al. "Up-regulation of androgen receptor binding in male rat fat pad adipose precursor cells exposed to testosterone: study in a whole cell assay system." J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol 1990 Nov 30;37(4):553-8

4. Xu X, et al. "The effects of androgens on the regulation of lipolysis in adipose precursor cells." Endocrinology 1990 Feb;126(2):1229-34

5. Burch L, et al. "Effect of anabolic steroids on lipogenic and lipolytic enzymes in sheep tissues." Horm Metab Res 1982 Jan;14(1):52-3

6. Pedersen SB, et al. "Characterization of regional and gender differences in glucocorticoid receptors and lipoprotein lipase activity in human adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1994 Jun;78(6):1354-9

7. Ottosson M, et al. "The effects of cortisol on the regulation of lipoprotein lipase activity in human adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1994 Sep;79(3):820-5

8. Samra JS, et al. "Effects of physiological hypercortisolemia on the regulation of lipolysis in subcutaneous adipose tissue." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1998 Feb;83(2):626-31

9. Mayer M, Rosen F. "Interaction of anabolic steroids with glucocorticoid receptor sites in rat muscle cytosol." Am J Physiol 1975 Nov;229(5):1381-6

10. Ottosson M, et al. "Blockade of the glucocorticoid receptor with RU 486: effects in vitro and in vivo on human adipose tissue lipoprotein lipase activity." Obes Res 1995 May;3(3):233-40

11. Kerr JE, et al. "Androgens modulate glucocorticoid receptor mRNA, but not mineralcorticoid receptor mRNA levels, in the rat hippocampus." J Neuroendocrinol 1996 Jun;8(6):439-47

12. Steinsapir J, Muldoon TG. "Role of microsomal receptors in steroid hormone action." Steroids 1991 Feb;56(2):66-71

13. Boada LD, et al. "Identification of a specific binding site for the anabolic steroid stanozolol in male rat liver microsomes." J Pharmacol Exp Their 1996 Dec;279(3):1123-9

14. McCann JP, et al. "Subcellular distribution and glycosylation patterns of adrogen receptor from sheep omental adipose tissue." J Endocrinol 2001 Jun;169(3):587-93

15. Danhaive PA, Rousseau GG. "Binding of glucocorticoid antagonists to androgen and glucocorticoid hormone receptors in rat skeletal muscle." J Steroid Biochem 1986 Feb;24(2):481-7

16. Danhaive PA, Rousseau GG. "Evidence for sex-dependent anabolic response to androgenic steroids mediated by muscle glucocorticoid receptors in the rat." J Steroid Biochem 1988 Jun;29(6):575-81

17. Lovejoy JC, et al. "Oral anabolic steroid treatment, but not parental androgen treatment, decreases abdominal fat in obese, older men." Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 1995 Sep;19(9):614-24

18. Sheffield-Moore M, et al. "Oxandrolone administration stimulates net muscle protein synthesis in young men." J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1999 Aug;84(8):2705-11

19. Xu X, et al. "Postreceptor events involved in the up-regulation of beta-adrenergic receptor mediated lipolysis by testosterone in rat white adipocytes." Endocrinology 1993 April;132(4):1651-7

20. De Pergola G. "The adipose tissue metabolism: role of testosterone and dehydroepiandrosterone." Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 2000 Jun;24 Suppl 2:S59-63

21. Marin P, et al. "Assimilation and mobilization of triglycerides in subcutaneous abdominal and femoral adipose tissue in vivo in men: effects of androgens." J Clin Endrocrinol Metab 1995 Jan;80(1):239-43

22. Thiblin I, et al. "Increased dopaminergic and 5-hydroxytyrptaminergic activities in male rat brain following long-term treatment with anabolic/androgenic steroids." Br J Pharmacol 1999 Mar;126(6):1301-6

23. Samanin R, Garattini S. "Neurochemical mechanism of action of anorectic drugs." Pharmacol Toxicol 1993 Aug;73(2):63-8

24. Maxwell G, et al. "The effect of dopamine upon oxidative metabolism of brown fat adipocytes." Eur J Pharmacol 1985 Oct 22;116(3):293-7

25. Sandyk R. "Dopamine and insulin interact to modulate in vitro glucose transport in rat adipocytes." Int J Neurosci 1988 Nov;43(1-2):9-14

26. Lee TL, et al. "Activation of beta 3-adrenoreceptors by exogenous dopamine to lower glucose uptake into rat adipocytes." J Auton Nerv Syst 1998 Dec 11;74(2-3):86-90

27. Maxwell GM, et al. "Thermogenesis and the effect of injected catecholamines on the oxygen consumption of cafeteria-fed rats." Clin Exp Pharmacol Physiol 1988 May;15(5):391-400

28. Nakagawa M, et al. "The effects of dopamine infusion on the postoperative energy expenditure, metabolism, and catecholamine levels of patients after esophagectomy." Surg Today 1994;24(8):688-93

29. Pernet A, et al. "The metabolic effects of dopamine in man." Eur J Clin Pharmacol 1984;26(1):23-8

30. Zhang Y, et al. "Bromocriptine/SKF38393 treatment ameliorates dyslipidemia in ob/ob mice." Metabolism 1999 Aug;48(8):1033-40


So well no steroid should be labeled as a (fat burner) like say clen or albuteral They do Have a dramatic effect on fat lose in many ways. Any way you slice the cake it still boils down to diet and training but this thing about steroids having no effect on fat is not true.
 
you do realize that superdrol is a wet compound that includes sides such as water retention and bloat yes?

so is test... whats the point?
...eat clean time your carbs drink tons of water and i was ripped in 4 weeks for spring... wet, bloat, non of this occurred used it many times in years past...

now dbol, i turn into a ballon... but then again eating to lose or gain dose alot of things too..
 
ok man, i didn't mean to come off as snobby or anything. there's just so much shit to choose from it's like a candy store haha

right now, i'm thinking about this:

t-bol 50mg ed
winny 40mg ed
proviron 50mg ed

pct would be nolva
 
ok man, i didn't mean to come off as snobby or anything. there's just so much shit to choose from it's like a candy store haha

right now, i'm thinking about this:

t-bol 50mg ed
winny 40mg ed
proviron 50mg ed

pct would be nolva

Yeah you are right many, there are many things to choose from, the reson i posted in this thread was because my stats are close to yours im 5,11 and 190lbs(about half way throgh test cycle) and have used superdrol to do just what your original question asked.. lose fat gain muscel and at the time i was 178@10% and at the end of 4 weeks i was 180@7%

but my diet, cardio and training were in check as well. iv never used the combo you have listed above, seems like alot of orals for one cycle, but im sure someone who have used these can tell you how they liked them, good luck bro
 
I'm dropping the Winny.....no need for it.

I will be taking Liv52 and NAC throughout.

I heard this would be ok to run without a test base, as shutdown from t-bol isn't 100% and recovery is relatively easy. I should be ok, yes?
 
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