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Apöllo
Guest
As yesterday was Easter and we're all filled with the idea of His resurrection I can't help but feel that the world really needs Jesus right now. I'm so sad.
sconoscuito
Banned
hmm thats weird cause I saw him last night
Atomic Punk
New member
I have been trying to find Christ lately. Saw "The Passion" of course. The problem I have with what is known about what Christ supposedly did, is this: The first Gospel(Mark) was written 35 years after Christs death. Mark didn't know Christ, and neither did any of the other three Gospel writers. So what were their writings based on? Also, it is funny how, as the Gospels progress into John(the final writings), how it is THERE where we find it being written about Pilate NOT WANTING to put Christ to death, but did so to apize The Jewish High Priests, and an Jewish angry mob. This directly contradicts other writings about Pilate, which describe the man as absolutely ruthless. Slaughtering thousands of Jews for offenses that even the Romans in Rome thought to not be worthy of such punishment. In fact, Pilate was summarily RELIEVED of his rule for being such a ruthless bloodthirsty ruler-even by Roman standards of the time. Historians have stated that the last thing Pilate would ever care about was apizing any mob. He could have cared less what they thought. He also would have NEVER let Barabus(who was being held for Treason against the Roman Govt. & Murder)-go for ANY prisoner for any reason, as treason was probably considered the most offensive crime, as it challenged the Roman rule directly. Barabus would have been cruicified for sure. NEVER let go. It is highly probable in that case, that Barabus was a writers embelishment.
So why the embelishment? Well, as the Gospel writings get older, the Christian faith is simultaniously growing. As Jews who chose to worship Christ, are being more consistently ostricized from ones who followed the Jewish faith, you see the contemp that the Christians had towards them for said ostricizing translated into the Gospels in the form of Christs killers BECOMING the Jewish Priests, & the mob, and not Pilate himself.
So many contradictions. I want to believe, but there's simply no way I can overlook something like that. I almost hate myself for being so synical.
So why the embelishment? Well, as the Gospel writings get older, the Christian faith is simultaniously growing. As Jews who chose to worship Christ, are being more consistently ostricized from ones who followed the Jewish faith, you see the contemp that the Christians had towards them for said ostricizing translated into the Gospels in the form of Christs killers BECOMING the Jewish Priests, & the mob, and not Pilate himself.
So many contradictions. I want to believe, but there's simply no way I can overlook something like that. I almost hate myself for being so synical.
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A
Apöllo
Guest
Good post Atomic.
Lift Chief
New member
Atomic Punk said:
Interesting if true... i'll have to try and look that up, about Pilate.
Burning_Inside
Elite Mentor
I refuse to acknowledge anything or anyone in history unless it's been officially recorded, and th bible isn't nowhere near official, and no historians around that time in the general area of where Jesus supposedly roamed have any records of anything to do with him.
bodytemple75
New member
I guess here is a way to look at it....
If you were in heaven which is suppossed to be a "paradise" why go to Earth? The first thing you would want to do anyway is get a car so you don't have to use those darn sandals and kill your feet walking everywhere. Standing four hours on end, on that darn "Dept Of Motor-Vehicles" line,..." I could see even him talking his name in vain!"
(laughs...just some innocent humor)
Yet on a more serious note....
(Note)...It's definately not funny what happened to the man "Jesus" if he actually did exist. Whether he was "godly" or had magical powers, is to be yet seen/proved or disproved. But, since one thing is for sure, everyone is in agreement he was a good man, and helped people. If any of the accounts told about his life, and the way he died were true and accurate, he certainly deserves to be in a paradise now. It was truly horrible what they did to that man. Not that he is any better or different to any other innocent person who recieves the same form of treatment. That would still be horrible. "Arguably,"...Nobody, man or other, deserves to die so horribly, especially when they devote their lives to trying to help people, and do good. We can only hope right now, if he is in fact, an entity that is eternal, and did/ does exist,... his love, understanding, and forgiveness far exceed our own.
If you were in heaven which is suppossed to be a "paradise" why go to Earth? The first thing you would want to do anyway is get a car so you don't have to use those darn sandals and kill your feet walking everywhere. Standing four hours on end, on that darn "Dept Of Motor-Vehicles" line,..." I could see even him talking his name in vain!"
(laughs...just some innocent humor)
Yet on a more serious note....
(Note)...It's definately not funny what happened to the man "Jesus" if he actually did exist. Whether he was "godly" or had magical powers, is to be yet seen/proved or disproved. But, since one thing is for sure, everyone is in agreement he was a good man, and helped people. If any of the accounts told about his life, and the way he died were true and accurate, he certainly deserves to be in a paradise now. It was truly horrible what they did to that man. Not that he is any better or different to any other innocent person who recieves the same form of treatment. That would still be horrible. "Arguably,"...Nobody, man or other, deserves to die so horribly, especially when they devote their lives to trying to help people, and do good. We can only hope right now, if he is in fact, an entity that is eternal, and did/ does exist,... his love, understanding, and forgiveness far exceed our own.
Atomic Punk
New member
bodytemple75 said:
I believe he did exist. There are accounts of him in other texts. The Jewish religion(also not "official" either as Burning said) acknowledges him, and there is also a Roman account of him as well, although I forget the exact writers name. All he said though, is that Pilate had Christ(he referred to him as Jesus the Nazarean though--not Christ) executed for some crime. It also though, was written about 100 years after his death. That account though, is of no religious signifigance--simply an acknowledgment of the man. I'll try to find the exact writers name, and maybe find a link as well if I can. The man did exist. What he stood for, who he was, and what he said is a matter of Faith.
Either way, as I was telling my Grandmother at Dinner today, it is a great story-true or not. Alot of other Gods(including Jesus old man) were vicious, vengefull Gods, where Christ was portrayed as a God of peace, love, & forgiveness. Nothing wrong with wanting to believe in a man who stood for those things, and was willing to die for them as well. If he was in fact only a man, he still is to be admired. Some people simply need more than "believe it because that's the right thing to do" though to be convinced. And there's nothing wrong with that either.
IF YOU DOUBT JESUS CHRIST TO BE THE SON OF GOD, AND ARE HONEST ENOUGH TO ADMIT IT--ARE YOU WORSE OR BETTER THAN THE PERSON WHO SAYS THEY BELIEVE, BUT REALLY DOUBT???? According to the 10 Commandments, THOSE PEOPLE are the ones sinning, not the ones who want more info, in order to make their own call on the matter. I never saw anything in the 10 Commandments about trying to aquire as much FACTUAL knowledge as possible to draw your own conclusion. There is that little part about lying though, right???
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Robert Jan
New member
People seem to forget the whole story has no historical value at all
Burning_Inside said:
look at it this way.
if im wrong, i lived a lie
if youre wrong, you rot in hell.
you take and put both an internal and external evidence test to the bible, and it will pass with flying colours.
anyone can quote the levitican laws against something in the new testament and say thats an inaccuracy.
anyone can argue that the bible is inherently inaccurate, full of lies, and completely circular.
anyone can say that there is no historical proof of Jesus existance by saying "my sources are better than yours''
ive still not seen anyone show me where the bible has been changed in the last 1700 years.
if nelson montana had written something around the time of the bible, it probably wouldnt have gotten into the canonization either. yes maybe the council at carthage was marred by some scandal. im sure if something like a historical/biblical jesus had not existed there wouldnt have been such a great unity in manuscripts between now and then.
maybe ron wyatt isnt for real with some stuff he said he ''discovered'' (im scared shitless if he is, thats just spooky)
the fact remains, if even scholars who argue against jesus being who he said he was in the bible believe he existed and provide information from other sources citing his existance, why is it that in addition to being a liar, Jesus didnt exist? hmm...
Robert Jan
New member
juicedpigtails said:look at it this way.
if im wrong, i lived a lie
if youre wrong, you rot in hell.
nice way of thinking until you realise there are like 300 religions, many of which make more or equal sense to christianity.
Realise that Jesus is just the nr 345234 Messiah to be born from a holy virgin
Us apes have been walking upright for millions of years, and Weve only had christianity be big for like 1000 years.
in other words, only 1/2000th of the time of humans there has even been christianity.
Its just a fucking fad and it ll die out like anything else. In fact I think it will die out soon.
Moderate_THIS
New member
Elijah/Jesus is back. In fact, he's a regular poster on EF
milo hobgoblin
New member
Mel Gibson, Kyle
Mel Gibson
Mel Gibson
jonny jacked
New member
Burning_Inside said:
Actually you are dead wrong. One of the only historians around Jesus' parts did write about him. His name was Josephus.
Josephus was very important Jewish historian of the first century. In his writings he referrers to both james, brother of Jesus, and Jesus himself.
Some of you need to remember. Jesus was not walking around in Rome; he was in a small town in the middle of nowhere. There were no libraries where he was, no journalist, and what, a few historians at best. And for their writings to survive until now is remarkable, since as I said, there was no library to put them in. they would have had to have been passed on by hand from generation to generation. The fact that some of Josephus' writings made in 2000 years is a testament in itself.
so burning inside, since I have proved to you that the life of Jesus has been recorded in something other than the bible, does this mean you will now acknowledge him? i also sense by the tone in your writing that you feel people who believe in Jesus are idiots for doing so because as you put it , there was not historical evidence. but, since you now know there is, imagine how I view someone like you - who talks out their ass and is DEAD WRONG
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big_bad_buff
New member
HAHAHAHAHAHAAH
Don’t live your whole life brain washed and uneducated bro. The mind is a terrible thing to waste
Don’t live your whole life brain washed and uneducated bro. The mind is a terrible thing to waste
Robert Jan said:nice way of thinking until you realise there are like 300 religions, many of which make more or equal sense to christianity.
Realise that Jesus is just the nr 345234 Messiah to be born from a holy virgin
Us apes have been walking upright for millions of years, and Weve only had christianity be big for like 1000 years.
in other words, only 1/2000th of the time of humans there has even been christianity.
Its just a fucking fad and it ll die out like anything else. In fact I think it will die out soon.
Atomic Punk
New member
jonny jacked said:
EXCELLENT post brother. Josephus doesn't acknowledge him as the Son of God though/ It is an account of the mans existence though. It is a historical fact, that for whatever resson some here won't accept. It does show somewhat of a lack of research on their part, to put it politely.
Got a question for you though pal: Was James older or younger than Jesus? Just curious.
c-sharp minor
Well-known member
It looks to me as if he is already here.
http://phone.people.yahoo.com/py/ps...ity=&State=&searchFor=Telephone&Search=Search
http://phone.people.yahoo.com/py/ps...ity=&State=&searchFor=Telephone&Search=Search
Moderate_THIS
New member
c-sharp minor said:
No, I didn't see any Jesus H. Christ
Can any of the Christian's refute the evidence that disprove's a world-wide flood?
Not only is their NOT enough water on this earth to flood everything, but at the time of the bible, the earth was considered flat, so their was no way of gauging if the entire earth was flooded or not...as a matter of fact, China has historical evidence of their existance dating back to that time period, and their was no "historical" flood recorded in the document's... among other proof... Let me guess, God put the Chinese here to to play a funny joke on us and test our faith...along with the dinosaur bones...ah-ha, that's it...
Now, their might have been a big flood, back in the day...but you've got to understand that it was considere'd normal for people to blame the unexplainable on a spook/spirit or god... It made it more effective to transfer knowledge from generation to generation. The only problem with this, was their where people willing to abuse this "phenomonenon" and twist people's mind's so they could/can control them...
Pretty much every thing in the bible, in one way or another, has been disproven (flood, flat earth, jesus, sun revolving around the earth, etc, etc, etc...)...except for the invisible man in the sky, wich is impossible to disprove... But, I'm not going to hold my breath for a "jesus" to come back any time soon... and I'm not going to worship a god that support's slavery, murdering your own family, horrible attrocities that make Hitler look look like an "Ok type of guy", etc...
To each their own, until they try to force it on me....
Not only is their NOT enough water on this earth to flood everything, but at the time of the bible, the earth was considered flat, so their was no way of gauging if the entire earth was flooded or not...as a matter of fact, China has historical evidence of their existance dating back to that time period, and their was no "historical" flood recorded in the document's... among other proof... Let me guess, God put the Chinese here to to play a funny joke on us and test our faith...along with the dinosaur bones...ah-ha, that's it...
Now, their might have been a big flood, back in the day...but you've got to understand that it was considere'd normal for people to blame the unexplainable on a spook/spirit or god... It made it more effective to transfer knowledge from generation to generation. The only problem with this, was their where people willing to abuse this "phenomonenon" and twist people's mind's so they could/can control them...
Pretty much every thing in the bible, in one way or another, has been disproven (flood, flat earth, jesus, sun revolving around the earth, etc, etc, etc...)...except for the invisible man in the sky, wich is impossible to disprove... But, I'm not going to hold my breath for a "jesus" to come back any time soon... and I'm not going to worship a god that support's slavery, murdering your own family, horrible attrocities that make Hitler look look like an "Ok type of guy", etc...
To each their own, until they try to force it on me....
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