why is american education so crappy?

[bluepeter]

Well, if Afghanistan and Iraq are the weakest nations and the only ones we have immediate reasons for going into, we have no choice but to use them as points of origins. But I get your point and I agree with it, I don't think a war on terror is going to solve the terror problem.

Revamping foriegn policy will.

Well put.

 

[nzafi]

The US has followed the same foreign for years now....the only difference is that some presidents are more charismatic than others, hence no one criticizes Clinton, but alot of people attack Bush, while Clinton was also a fucking piece of shit

 

[Code]

Foreign policy hasn't changed in a looooooooong time, prolly 1911.

The US has followed the same foreign for years now....the only difference is that some presidents are more charismatic than others, hence no one criticizes Clinton, but alot of people attack Bush, while Clinton was also a fucking piece of shit

 

[bluepeter]

The US has followed the same foreign for years now....the only difference is that some presidents are more charismatic than others, hence no one criticizes Clinton, but alot of people attack Bush, while Clinton was also a fucking piece of shit

The difference is that Clinton was an accomplished diplomat while George is a clumsy 'fuck y'all, we'll do it ourselves' clown.

Not trying to give Clinton any respect just pointing out that being diplomatic has many advantages when you are President or a leader of any sort for that matter.

 

[nzafi]

I agree with you Bluepeter, but at the end of the day you should know that you are being lied to by both people, and criticize them both. I dont care how diplomatic someone is, at the end of the day I try my best to read and inform myself about politics around the world from multiple sources, and not rely on what Bush or Clinton say.

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

The difference is that Clinton was an accomplished diplomat while George is a clumsy 'fuck y'all, we'll do it ourselves' clown.

bwahahahahaha and I am an accomplished knitter. Care to share Clinton's wonderful diplomatic victories?

How about Americans getting dragged through the streets of Somalia? That was some nice diplomacy..... let;s be diplomatic and not send armor . Then General Powell was requesting the armor and Sec Def Aspin denied it in Clinton's name. Yeah, that was some great diplomacy.

Maybe we could also talk about his response to the 1993 WTC attack....well, except there was no response to the 1993 WTC attack.

How about his launching of missiles into Sudan after the Khobar towers attack?

One of Clinton's few foreign policy wins was when he put the diplomacy aside and used troops, in Kosovo, to help restore order.

Clinton's grasp of foreign policy was abominable, and his "diplomacy" got Americans killed and humiliated in Somalia, allowed terrorism to fester, and set the stage for September 11th 2001.

One of our worst foreign policy presidents ever.

Not trying to give Clinton any respect just pointing out that being diplomatic has many advantages when you are President or a leader of any sort for that matter.

Advantages?

Dead Americans
Unpunished terror attacks

Yes, advantages indeed.

Most foregin resentmentof GW Bush occurs because Bush has pointed out in no uncertain terms the sheer irrelevancy of other countries when the US is resolved to do something.

Is Bush always right? Fuck no. No one is. But in areas of foregin policy, he is exemplifying leadership, right down to the team he has chosen.

 

[bluepeter]

bwahahahahaha and I am an accomplished knitter. Care to share Clinton's wonderful diplomatic victories?

How about Americans getting dragged through the streets of Somalia? That was some nice diplomacy..... let;s be diplomatic and not send armor . Then General Powell was requesting the armor and Sec Def Aspin denied it in Clinton's name. Yeah, that was some great diplomacy.

Maybe we could also talk about his response to the 1993 WTC attack....well, except there was no response to the 1993 WTC attack.

How about his launching of missiles into Sudan after the Khobar towers attack?

One of Clinton's few foreign policy wins was when he put the diplomacy aside and used troops, in Kosovo, to help restore order.

Clinton's grasp of foreign policy was abominable, and his "diplomacy" got Americans killed and humiliated in Somalia, allowed terrorism to fester, and set the stage for September 11th 2001.

One of our worst foreign policy presidents ever.



Advantages?

Dead Americans
Unpunished terror attacks

Yes, advantages indeed.

Most foregin resentmentof GW Bush occurs because Bush has pointed out in no uncertain terms the sheer irrelevancy of other countries when the US is resolved to do something.

Is Bush always right? Fuck no. No one is. But in areas of foregin policy, he is exemplifying leadership, right down to the team he has chosen.

I'm likely misusing 'diplomat'. What I meant was he was diplomatic i.e instead of telling everyone to go fuck themselves, he knew how to use tactics and glib persuasion to get what he wanted. IMO, an invaluable trait which George doesn't know a thing about...........

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

I'm likely misusing 'diplomat'. What I meant was he was diplomatic i.e instead of telling everyone to go fuck themselves, he knew how to use tactics and glib persuasion to get what he wanted. IMO, an invaluable trait which George doesn't know a thing about...........

Bush has angered much of the world because he is not asking their assistance or accepting their counsel.

It;s analogous to a chairman of a company who usually takes the advice of other directors choosing to ignore their feedback.

The otehr directors are going to be pissed, because the chairman has used his power without their assent.

In that situation, it's just too fucking bad.

In this situation, other nations had gotten accustomed to a USA that comes to the UN, that confers with them, that gives them a seat at the table.

Bush has chosen not to do so. Historically, America's incorporation of other nations into its decision process was entirely diplomatic. We preferred cooperation to decisiveness.

Today, we are the "chairman" and we are doing things we believe to be right because we simply have the power. No other nation is America's equal in economy or military power, and we have been the gentle giant for decades.

Now, Bush believes in something and he is acting. Other nations are irrelevant, and he is telling them. It is as if they would prefer he ask their approval, when none is necessary.

A lot of the compliants other nations are offering (and amazingly, democrats are parroting) are simply sour grapes.

 

[nzafi]

One of Clinton's few foreign policy wins was when he put the diplomacy aside and used troops, in Kosovo, to help restore order.

QUOTE]

I would hardly call what NATO did in yugoslavia a win. If you speak to anyone that is from that region, it is disgraceful the way it was handled. Bombing a country into the stone age because of civil wars is ridiculous, and if you look at what is happening as the after math, Serbia is struggling to keep the extreme right-wingers from returning.

 

[bluepeter]

Bush has angered much of the world because he is not asking their assistance or accepting their counsel.

It;s analogous to a chairman of a company who usually takes the advice of other directors choosing to ignore their feedback.

The otehr directors are going to be pissed, because the chairman has used his power without their assent.

In that situation, it's just too fucking bad.

In this situation, other nations had gotten accustomed to a USA that comes to the UN, that confers with them, that gives them a seat at the table.

Bush has chosen not to do so. Historically, America's incorporation of other nations into its decision process was entirely diplomatic. We preferred cooperation to decisiveness.

Today, we are the "chairman" and we are doing things we believe to be right because we simply have the power. No other nation is America's equal in economy or military power, and we have been the gentle giant for decades.

Now, Bush believes in something and he is acting. Other nations are irrelevant, and he is telling them. It is as if they would prefer he ask their approval, when none is necessary.

A lot of the compliants other nations are offering (and amazingly, democrats are parroting) are simply sour grapes.

Sorry Matt, I see what you are saying but that's a load of shit. I don't care how rich and powerful your country is, if you cut off all ties and go it alone as Bush is in danger of doing, you will not be the same for long. Get enough other nations who say 'fuck me?, fuck you!' and America will not be the economic and military power they are now.

Other nations are not irrelevant because we have many things that you need. Try closing down your borders and going it completely alone. You'd do just as well for a while I'm sure but how long do you think until it becomes a problem?

George's screw everybody else attitude is dangerous and damaging in more ways than one. He is alienating many nations that had close ties to the US previously and he is also creating the very thing he claims to be trying to abolish every day. I don't like it on a personal level, I don't like it because I have family and friends that live there and I don't like it because it affects my country as we are closely aligned in proximity etc.

Everybody that thinks they don't need anybody else gets fucked eventually, I'd hate to see that happen.