hopefully this can answer your question
Mike79 - regarding your comment "95% are unwillingly to ASSIMILATE into American culture and society" is a grossly erroneous statement based on anecdotal or observational and personal and heresay evidence. I hope you can take my word on how prone personal observations are in regards to misinterpretation, and the only evidence I trust is double-blind findings, and even then, I have my doubts. If you have the DOUBLE BLIND amounts of evidence that 95%, then we can talk, but failing that, your statement paints a broad and negative brush over far more Hispanics than is just, and this is 1 cent of the dollar that is used to discriminate against the Hispanic (cent by cent, it adds up).
Without even resorting to studies (which I can for both sides if you wish), I present you with the following reasons for why its so hard to ASSIMILATE, yet why SO MANY DO ASSIMILATE.
1. Anti-Hispanic Prejudice - Hispanics have been here since long before Americans have in many areas, and since the beginning, we have been marginalized in much the same way as African-Americans were (maybe not in all aspects, but my point remains valid). We have been slaves, sharecroppers, not allowed to testify in court, killed, lynched, and denied the same rights as most Americans, even when they are knowledgeable enough to pursue their rights. Our jobs were taken away when soldiers returned from World War II. Hispanic-American reporters have been unwittingly "termintated" (see the life of Ruben Salazar, a prominent reporter for the Los Angeles Times who "died" accidentally by police intervention). In 2003, there are still restaurants where I will be looked at as if I was from Alpha Centauri as soon as I walk in, (and that happened when I walked into a Denny's in Woodland Hills), and I would not receive service for upwards of 45 minutes! (and when I finally did get service, the waitress told me she didn't have tortillas). As much as it may not be legal to discriminate, it's a way of life which most of us who are "minorities" must contend with. Why does this matter? Because being the recipient of centuries of prejudice makes it hard for you to reason why you want to be a part of those who oppress you (hard is not impossible, keep this in mind)
2. Natural Human Enculturation - most groups of people bind to themselves into groups whenever they are in a foreign country and Mexicans are no different. When I was in Okinawa as a kid, I was in the Gaijin community where everyone spoke English. The Americans there had no need to learn Japanese because most everything they felt they needed was in the Gaijin ghetto, and actually held it in contempt (evidenced by the fact Americans would go to Japanese centers and expect the natives to understand their language, sometimes attack the Japanese simply because they could) the local natives because they didn't speak English (1). The point to be made here is the Americans have been in occupation since WWII and a surprising few are functional in the language, even after being stationed for a decade (I admit learning "nihongo" was not easy, but the same can be said for Japanese learning to speak our "eigo"). Visiting American encampments in the Middle East, once again, you will note many Americans will cling to one another and sometimes, many will not learn the language and will resist adopting the culture simply because it is foreign to them. But as anyone who has been in any American areas in foreign countries will also attest, a substantial (I'd estimate 30-40%) portion of Americans will definitely take an interest in adopting, learning, and enculturing themselves and "when in Rome do as the Romans do," and this percentage is pretty constant amongst Hispanics too. In other words, we humans tend to group ourselves based on some binding tie, not just the Hispanics, but there are always significant amounts who will venture out from their own culture to learn the ways of their adopted country.
3. Benefits of homogeneity - you can ask the most ignorant "wetback" you see on the street what one of his top 3 goals are when he comes over here, and most will tell you that it is to LEARN ENGLISH. Even the most simpleminded immigrant understands the importance of learning the language, and many do make heroic efforts to learn the language, but learning a foreign tongue has never been an easy task (try learning one if you don't believe me, in most colleges, foreign language studies rank low in popularity due to the difficulty and repetitiveness of the topic). I mean, how many Americans would learn a foreign language if they weren't forced to? (yes, I know some like me would, but how about out of 1000, I'm sure the number will be quite low). Add to this, the benefits of an education, many Hispanics that I know realize the benefit of learning and push their children to learn, you just don't see too many of these because these folks are busy working and in school, the only ones you typically see are the ones who AREN'T working or schooling. But the Hispanic, like the rest of the human population is not perfect nor any more evolved than Americans, Europeans, or anyone else, so you will have numbers of Hispanics who after trying hard, will give up (just like everyone else, except that they have another culture to fall back on, which in this case, I agree, is a disadvantage). The third advantage that most Hispanics agree on is that "in Rome, do as the Romans" (it is popular in Spanish too), and in spite of the fact that the "Romans" will treat the Hispanics differently, Hispanics still want to emulate them. A last point on this is ALL THE WORLD WANTS TO EMULATE AMERICANS. This statement is broad so it's not 100% right, but for the most part, the Europeans like to emulate some of our things, the Japanese like to do that, and so do the Mexicans…. To see this point, talk to a Mexican who's been here for 5 years and then gone back to Mexico; I'm sure he will tell you that all his people back home will definitely notice his dramatic enculturation into American society, English (maybe choppy and not functional yet) and all.
4. Cycle of Immigration - actually Mexicans have been assimilated into American culture much like Italians, Germans, Africans, and everyone else, the thing is that once integrated enough, most Hispanics and Mexicans (not exactly the same), they blend into the background because the "racial" background and bloodline of many Mexicans can pass for Caucasian because there is European blood in Mexicans too. What this means is that John Smith probably had a grandfather named Juan Martinez, even if he has blue eyes and blonde hair. Now I'm touching a sore point here, and somebody might misinterpret what I'm saying so hopefully I can clarify it by stating this: a Hispanic that immigrated 90 years ago, marries another Hispanic, some of their kids fall in love with European or Anglo Americans and have children, these children then have kids who marry other Americans (because many who fall in love don't care about race), and by the 4th generation, they are indistinguishable by name, or appearance from the rest of the general "American" population. There is a well-known cycle of immigration that occurs over the years and its broken down into 3 generations:
4a. The first generation is the ones who cross the border. They speak their native tongue mostly and really only marry first generation immigrants like them.
4b. The second generation are the children of the first generation. They speak both languages and typically marry mostly 2nd gens, but nearly as frequently, will marry 3rd gens and "Americans"(for the sake of this illustration, Americans means all who are more than 4 generations detatched from immigration)
4c. The third generation are children of the second gens. They usually speak only English and rarely speak their grandparents' tongues. They typically only marry 3rd gen folks or "Americans" but on some occasions marry 2nd gens, very rarely marrying 1st gens. By this time, most of these folks' nationality and culture is nearly indistinguishable from what you would call "typical Americans" and for all intents and purposes, they are "typical Americans." They enjoy almost everything that "typical Americans" enjoy, and consider themselves "Americans"
(now keep in mind, this illustration is a generalization and as such, there are many exceptions to this rule, but it applies quite well to almost all cultures, whether it be Japanese, Chinese, Italian, Croatian, Russian, Brazilian or Mexican)
right now, the recent influx of immigrants (from 88-99) means that the majority of those you consider "Hispanics" or those who you mistakenly call those 95% are comprised of a substantial number of FIRST GENERATION IMMIGRANTS, and as such appear to represent the majority of the Hispanic population to the untrained eye, but in 50 years, they will be like the rest of "normal Americans," indistinguishable from the general population, even race-wise because of the strong Caucasian blood in many Hispanics.
(by the way, I don't subscribe to the concept of race, but unless you want me to double the size of the response as to why I don't, and form a thesis to explain my position, lets just trust that I have a valid reason, and every scientific body for the past 50 years doesn't subscribe to that concept either, but I know many others do, so I thought I would add that last part)
Those of us, who you can classify as Hispanics then, are just the same as you and everyone else. We are all the same, we have ignorant imbeciles who take advantage of systems and as I said before, I am all for removing entitlements to anyone who is illegal, as a matter of fact, IM AGAINST WELFARE IN ALMOST ANY FORM FOR ALMOST EVERYONE, I have little faith that it serves much of a purpose other than to keep the poor in poverty. There are the same proportions of hard-working folks, there are also the same amounts of religious folks, whores, good and bad people, and hard working people like my mother who succeed here. WHAT REALLY GETS MY GOAT IS THIS CONSTANT DESIRE TO SEPARATE THE HISPANIC AS THE PUTATIVE CAUSE OF SO MANY PROBLEMS BECAUSE PEOPLE SEE THE BAD EXAMPLES AND BELIEVE THIS PROVES HISPANICS (OR IMMIGRANTS IN GENERAL) AS "UNDESIRABLE".WE ARE ALL THE SAME MORE OR LESS AND IF WE WANT TO DEAL WITH SOME OF SOCIETY'S PROBLEMS, WE NEED TO BEGIN BY BEING SENSITIVE TO SOCIETY.
Just "shoot the fuckers. twice" doesn't solve the problem
Calling them "wetbacks" doesn't help
Making generalizations that Hispanic (or any) immigrant is lazy, a leech, or unworthy doesn't help
They are not in on some plot to "brown" America
We are all the same, so lets get together and work to resolve the REAL problems in the world, and stop going after one group when they have as many productive and valuable people as the rest of the world does……
(please, read the rest of my posts if you intend to respond as I'm pretty sure I've covered almost everything you'll have a question to, I enjoy holding intelligent discussions and covering well thought out points, but like most other posters, I feel insulted if someone asks me a question which I've already answered… otherwise, I'm more than happy to respond)
(1) for more information on American violence against Japanese:
http://japanupdate.com/previous/02/01/23/story8.shtml
A discussion that is pro-immigration limitations, but I like the point Mr Burtless makes:
"If depression in wages means the overall structure [of wages] is reduced by immigration, I find that a little hard to believe. After all, some of us benefit from immigration. It may not look that way, but the fact that I can purchase a restaurant meal or stay in a hotel or have my clothes dry-cleaned and laundered at a very cheap price relative to what I could in Japan is a real benefit to me and raises my real wage."
Or the idea that in the "big picture" the effect of job loss or displacement has never been quantized:
"I just cannot buy this theory of no displacement, because I am convinced the studies must all be at such a macro level that the displacement or disturbances or adverse effect is so small on the macro scene, but in fact, there are people who are on the micro scene who are adversely affected." Markley Roberts
http://www.cis.org/articles/1994/paper9.html
Hispanics realize the importance of integration
http://www.hispanicmagazine.com/2000/oct/Features/index2.html
An interesting article covering integration of one family
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/meltingpot/meltingpot.htm
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Illegals dont deserve America's benefits! Nothing in life is for free! How about some restitution from Mexico for Native Americans! Your Spanish Ancestors slaughterd them! And your Racist comments are unwarented!
