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Where did GOD come from?(click here)

havoc

havoc

Shaolin Ninja
This question along with others are asked of me at least once a month when a few of my friends and I have just inhaled some Jah-herb and our minds expand for that time of uplifted insight. Anyway , here is the answer. The question of "Where did God come from" is not applicable to God. This question assumes that everything including God, is subject to the limitations of time and space, an assumption that the scientific communtiy has questioned and virtually dismissed since Einstein's theory of relativity which has its faults. Since God exists outside the time and space framework as we know it renders any questions of where He came from and what He was doing before He created what we know as the universe totally meaningless. These questions might be legitimate if God is subject to time and space, which He is not. The Bible teaches that God is not bound by time and space, and that He has not chosen to reveal to us(from our perspective) all that took place before He created the universe. Science for me only proves and backs up my faith 100%. Maybe some of you on here have asked yourself this question before so I am glad to help you out this fine day. peace and ganja leaf
 
I agree. There are some things the man upstairs simply did not want us to know. In reality we are all blinded to things we can not comprehend. That is what faith is all about.
 
Deep. Heavy.

The Universe has existed for an eternity
Earth has existed for 4 billion years or so
Life has existed for about 4 million years or so
Homo Sapiens showed up about 1 million years ago
(forgive me if times are off)
We are but a flash of light, and our lives barely a blink.
Why do we believe we are center to every thing ?
 
You can read all about that in a great book by Fred Heeren called ''Show Me God'' Has Stephen Hawking and all the greats in it.
 
whats up havoc

IMO all gods were created by man to answer the questions that we will never know the answers too. (ie...where did we come from, where do we go when we die, ect)

Just the opinion of an atheist!
 
Actually, I know where god came from. When I accepted Jesus Christ as my personal savior, he told me. God is from Buffalo. :D
 
I pretty much agree with you, havoc.
The problem you get into with lots of these philosophical questions,
is the question doesn't fit the domain of the answer.
The question is outside the realm of the expected answer.
For example "What's the meaning of life" implies you're expecting an answer with meaning.
"Meaning" implies you're in the realm/domain of reason.
And yet, we know that life includes thinks like chance, illogic, accidents, and other phenomenon that don't follow reason.
So the question boils down to what is the logic of illogic?
What is the reason for things that don't have reason?
And since there is no "logical" way to answer that, people use that to say "See, you can't prove the existance of God".
"God must not exist".
 
I find it highly presumptuous of you Havoc, to assume that even if there were a god, that it is a male, "he".

I admit to being suspicious of the "higher power" creed, but I'm damn sure that if there was one, it sure as hell wouldn't be just a male. Maybe two..female and male, maybe a hermaphrodite type creature with elements of both, but most certianly not "he".
If there is one law in nature and the universe that I am sure even "higher power" adheres to, it is balance. A deity that has only male attributes would not incur balance.
 
The natural state of the Universe is chaos
Logic, Order, Good, Bad only exist in the minds of the perceiver.
 
Yes, well, the original bible also stated that your Jesus Christ was only 3 cubits high (roughly 4 and a half feet) and had a misshapen hunchback. However, the Catholics couldn't abide the fact that their son of god was deformed, so they took that part out.

And, on another point, civilizations earlier than Christianity believed in multiple deities (male and female). In fact, your own religion is a multiple deity; the father, son and holy ghost. 3 godheads. they just all happen to be male.
 
The shell,.....the white......the yolk........Still just one egg........Jesus was a hunched back dwarf, I think he would of fixed that?:D
 
The shell, the white, the yolk.....

I've had a lot of so called educated people try and defend their reasoning for their 3 headed god being a single deity, but I must say, that was probably the most succinct. Well done.
 
Havoc,

God comes from the "nothingness", and it is very difficult for everyone to comprehend it.
There is research right now been conducted somewhere in England about this "nothingness" which is the first second of the begining of time. This "nothingness" has a name.
I posted about this a while back but no one replied.
peace
:alien:
 
The Bible doesn't describe God as either male or female.
It describes he/them as one god with three aspects,
something like father,son and holy ghost.
I think the Hindu's came a little closer in describing him as God the creator, sustainer, and destroyer.
It is "man creating God in man's image" to turn around and say God is a male or God is a female.
But yes, biblical writers telling a story 5000 years ago had to tell it in the frame of reference
understood by the people of the time.
Since they understood men and women, not holy ghosts, the story comes out that way.
Actually Genesis has been mis-translated. The Genesis original actually states "Let US create man in OUR image",
as though God was having a dialog among his multiple selves.
Again, this is so outside the domain of our understanding, it is useless to try to explain it with human reason.
 
Actually the bible does describe God as a male in several references. The first being in Genesis where it says God created man in the image of himself.
 
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kat said:
I find it highly presumptuous of you Havoc, to assume that even if there were a god, that it is a male, "he".
Click to expand...

As in all writing, when the gender of the subject is unknown, that subject is referred to as "he," or, in God's case, "He."

Although, if He were a malevolent deity, I would understand the desire to refer to Him as "She." =)

-Warik
 
There is no GOD. It's all in your tiny brains. The only thing religion is good for is so there wont be chaos!!
Adam & Eve, Ha!
Noah's Ark! OK!!!


Get real!
 
nice post havoc

I believe that God created us and gave us rules such as there is a begining to everything on earth and there is an end to everything. I think that this does not apply to God. Everytime I hear someone argue that there is no God I usually hear them say "well, if there is a God, where did He come from?" and I try to explain to them that maybe those rules do not apply to God, since He made them for us. As far as the Bible goes, its my opinion that things where not translated exactly and that theres documents that are missing. How much....I dunno, but there is evidence that the Catholic church has found and hid supposedly direct transcrips of Jesus Christ. Another thing is that the Bible can be taken literally, or metaphorically (i dunno if thats the right word that Im looking for here). Maybe noahs arc isnt true....but there is a meaning behind it im sure. Is God male or Female??...well I dunno and I dont really care. He is what He is. well, just my thoughts here

underguy77
 
why do you people believe that god is some kind of creature? that he's some kind of ruler be it male or female who sits on a throne somewhere on the other side of the universe?

what i understand as god is the very energy and consciousness which makes up our universe. god is not outside of us. god IS us. god is everything around us. god is what was and what will be.

and, yeah, like havoc, i believe the concept of god has absolutely nothing to do with our space-time notions.
 
As expected, some good replies, some ignorant ones.

Someone mentioned Noah and the Ark or Adam and eve, thats fucking Genesis, the first five books of the bible(the pentateuch, the torah) is a liturgy meant to teach lessons to the people of that time, its not meant to be taken literally therefore has no correlation whatsoever with this post. The bible has been redacted so many times its ridiculous. Who gives a fuck if there was a flood etc, thats not the fucking point, the point is that the wise, noble, admirable, righteous man(NOAH) lived and the opposites of his attributes did not.

What is sad is that most on here reply in a brainwashed manner, the Christianity of today is nothing like the past as far as how it is taught, the true meanings, the theology, therefore your replies are out of anger because you hate and dislike the way it was brought upon you, thats your fault for not finding out the true meaning, theology of the bible, makes you sound even a bit dumber than you already are in my opinion because my standpoint is 100% fucking different from yours guaranteed. You assume to much about my initial post, next time, don't respond, it will save you a bunch of typed words that just make me laugh. This shit isnt even worth explaining. peace

**Schooled once again by Havoc**
 
You go on with your bad self. Warrior of the faith!!! That's you Havoc, through and through.
 
God never came from anything. God has always been here. What? No Catholics here?
 
havoc said:
As expected, some good replies, some ignorant ones.
Click to expand...

Please explain to me why not believing in god is considered ignorant? If you have no tangible proof to go on what is the basis of my faith? Because some books said it's so? Or some guy on an altar tells me so? Sounds very weak to me...
 
"Please explain to me why not believing in god is considered ignorant? If you have no tangible proof to go on what is the basis of my faith? Because some books said it's so? Or some guy on an altar tells me so? Sounds very weak to me..."

To say that there is no God is just plain ignorance. It takes no thought whatsoever. There are three proofs that God is exists.
Here goes one proof:
God is defined as the greatest conceivable being. God is the being than which none greater can be conceived. Now let's use paintings as our analogy.
Painting A:exists only in the mind
Painting B:exists in the mind and also in reality
Now atheists belive in Painting A that God or the painting only exists in the mind. But if you believe in the definition of God, which you cannot refute, then you have to believe in painting B. This is a thousand year old proof that best proves that God exists.
 
dude said:
"Please explain to me why not believing in god is considered ignorant? If you have no tangible proof to go on what is the basis of my faith? Because some books said it's so? Or some guy on an altar tells me so? Sounds very weak to me..."

To say that there is no God is just plain ignorance. It takes no thought whatsoever. There are three proofs that God is exists.
Here goes one proof:
God is defined as the greatest conceivable being. God is the being than which none greater can be conceived. Now let's use paintings as our analogy.
Painting A:exists only in the mind
Painting B:exists in the mind and also in reality
Now atheists belive in Painting A that God or the painting only exists in the mind. But if you believe in the definition of God, which you cannot refute, then you have to believe in painting B. This is a thousand year old proof that best proves that God exists.
Click to expand...

That still doesn nothing to prove anything either way. You're talking in terms of theories with no tangible proof. Isn't it odd that in biblical times all these "miracles" happened, but none happen today. Religion and belief to me is control. I don't consider not believing in god stupid. Just logical and reasonable to me...
 
Oh, yeah? Tell that to Madeline O'Hair.

Oh, wait you can't she is dead now. I bet she has seen god. ;)



I would like to quote Mother Abigail from The Stand (best book ever written):

"It doesn't matter whether you believe in god because he believes in you."

:D
 
I don't understand why some people are SO against the belief in God. What happened that made you feel this way? Believeing in God most certainly cannot hurt you, but it could harm you if you are wrong. IMO there has been way too many occurences throughout our history that CANNOT be explained by science, so do not throw the science mumbo jumbo in my face
 
"That still doesn nothing to prove anything either way. You're talking in terms of theories with no tangible proof. Isn't it odd that in biblical times all these "miracles" happened, but none happen today. Religion and belief to me is control. I don't consider not believing in god stupid. Just logical and reasonable to me..."


Have you proved that God doesn't exist? Are you saying you have to see him for him to exist. Let me give you an example of something that exists in this world but you cannot see it. For instance, justice exists but it is not something you can see or touch. And that brings another question, just because you can see it, touch it, hear it, etc. does that mean that it is real?
 
True. Justice does exist. But there is an immediate(usually)and tangible outcome from it. For instance, if you murder someone you go to jail or are executed. I'm not trying to disprove God or change anyones mind. It just isn't for me. I choose to make up my own mind and not have other do it for me. I don't need a book or rules to tell me how to live life...
 
"I don't understand why some people are SO against the belief in God. What happened that made you feel this way? Believeing in God most certainly cannot hurt you, but it could harm you if you are wrong. IMO there has been way too many occurences throughout our history that CANNOT be explained by science, so do not throw the science mumbo jumbo in my face"

It is funny that you say that because William James said that it is not right to be agnostic. He says choose one or other and in that sense it is best to choose to believe in God becaue if he exists then you will receive eternal life and if he doesn't you lived a good life. On the otherhand if you choose not to believe in God and you are wrong then you will have some serious consequences. So believing in God is a win-win situation.
 
"True. Justice does exist. But there is an immediate(usually)and tangible outcome from it. For instance, if you murder someone you go to jail or are executed. I'm not trying to disprove God or change anyones mind. It just isn't for me. I choose to make up my own mind and not have other do it for me. I don't need a book or rules to tell me how to live life..."


I like your outlook. I think it is good to question whether this is a God or not. But to the others who just say that there is no God, it is just plain ignorant.
 
And just to let you all know I went to Catholic elementary and middle school. So I was raised to be Catholic. Maybe some day I'll find what I'm looking for. But right now I don't believe in much the way religion is today...
 
Austin316 said:
I don't understand why some people are SO against the belief in God. What happened that made you feel this way? Believeing in God most certainly cannot hurt you, but it could harm you if you are wrong. IMO there has been way too many occurences throughout our history that CANNOT be explained by science, so do not throw the science mumbo jumbo in my face
Click to expand...

Im in no way against your belief or anyones believe in a God, be that God Budah, a Great Spirit, or what ever. But don't let them close your mind with fear. Open your mind to all things great and small. Humanity is but a spec in time and space.
 
"And just to let you all know I went to Catholic elementary and middle school. So I was raised to be Catholic. Maybe some day I'll find what I'm looking for. But right now I don't believe in much the way religion is today..."

There is a difference between believing in religion and believeing in God. Religion is made up of man made rules. I am not trying to put down Catholics, but Catholics believe you have to do certain things to go to heaven. For instance, you must be baptized, say 50 hailmary's for sinning, etc. That to me sounds more like religion then believing in God.
 
you will find this interesting, this guy proved scientifically that Noah's Ark found on Mt. Arat is the real piece. He also found the real Mt. Sinai in Saudi Arabia, that is a mountain in the middle of the desert closely guarded by troops. It has pictures and everything. It is worth looking at. Also, read what it says about the Ark of the Covenant.


Wyatts Archaeological Research
 
Daeo-wasnt referring to you at all when I said ignorant, believe what you must.

Jimsbc- noah's ark has never been found, thats incorrect brother, I have seen that link before along with others similar to it. Jimsbbc, do a search on the "Epic of Gilgamesh", its the flood story with different names that was written many, many years before Noah's story, the story was copied to prove a point to the people at that time.
 
Since you were too lazy to read it:

Twelve years of electronic and mechanical probing has positively identified it as a boat.

3. Repeated chemical analysis of many different samples, taken at different times by different people and analyzed at different laboratories, positively prove it to be composed of very ancient wood and metal.

4. Samples of petrified wood have been located and taken from the structure in the presence of many witnesses. In addition to previous tests, I have additional samples which have metal brackets and rust, which were videoed as they were retrieved from the boat. I will have them tested at various testing facilities in the future and in the presence of witnesses.

5. A large number of ancient and medieval inscriptions near the site positively identify it as Noah's Ark. There will be more on these inscriptions in our later book, which will include photographs.

6. Its 515 foot length, its 138 foot width (splayed) are the measurements of Noah's Ark as recorded by Moses (educated to use the ancient Egyptian cubit) in the Book of Genesis. See an explanation under "Questions I Am Most Frequently Asked About Noah's Ark".

7. It is located in the mountains of Urartu (Ararat) as specified in the Bible.

8. Its location at an elevation of 6300 feet above sea level is above any possible height reachable by a "local flood" but is below the maximum water level that would result from all the water of our planet washing the earth's surface (7000-8000 feet).

9. Its location, many miles from any present or ancient body of water that would support it, defies any other explanation.

10. Its massive size and weight make it impossible that it could have been "trundled" (dragged) this distance from water, and its altitude above present and past sea levels defies any other explanation.

11. Contrary to a touched up photograph, which has been widely circulated, it's the only formation of its kind on planet earth, other than remains of other ancient boats of much smaller size.

12. Your writer, in the presence of Turkish authorities and other observers, performed an electronic survey of a site that some of our critics said resembled the boat formation (the similarities were vague at best, nonexistent in actuality); the metal detectors and sub-surface radar scans showed nothing in the site that were not present anywhere in the area.

13. A careful electronic survey of the area around the formation showed none of the structures present in the formation.

14. Chemical analysis of the area around the formation showed only normal traces of the metallic oxides and organic carbon which are present in large amounts in the formation.

15. Train-loads of petrified wood are present in the formation, but there is little to be found in the rest of eastern Turkey.

16. Many ancient historians record that the remains of Noah's Ark were to be visited in this area.
 
god is where he always has been and always will be..Up Snuffaluffagus' ass. :kaioken:
 
Biatch, I told you to email me about whatever. I'll bring the hydro, you bring the Ziti, hurry up.
 
dude...i'm lmao, that is the most ridiculous anology i have ever read. Using analogy to make an argument just shows that you cannot successfully explain the original premise. I am wondering if anyone of the "god believers" here believe in Zeus, or maybe Osiris, or any other of the almost infinite number of gods created by man throughout history?? If not, why not...they are much older than your "jesus". I think most so called devout individuals would laugh at someone who professed to believe that Zeus was their god and lived on mt. olympus hurling "thunderbolts". Do you not realize that people once believed in these gods as strongly as you do yours, whatever one that may be. It kind of makes it seem silly if you really think about it.:confused:
 
Actually I did not come up with that proof. It is a thousand year old proof that has not been disproved so how can it be stupid. Can you prove it to be wrong?
 
BTW, I never specified which God. All I said was God so where do you come up with Jesus Christ. When discussing religion I like to take an agnostic view so that I my statements may not be biased.
 
Did I mention GOD spelled backwards is DOG? I hope Santa brings me the George Foreman grill I want this year... :santa: :santa2: :flake:
 
I thought blue whales could swim ?.........LOL .....Not a good example! I get your point bro! It would be a bitch catching them all plus the polar bear would kill the lion on the boat!
 
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Holy Shit, stop talking about the fucking ark, it was never meant to be taken literally. Read below:

Discovered in Nineveh, the Gilgamesh Epic (700 B.C.) was recorded on clay tablets and translated by George Smith in 1872. Mr. Smith is quoted as saying, "I am the first man to read this text after two thousand years of oblivion." The discovery of the tablets and the translation of the Gilgamesh Epic rocked the world. Now, "scholars" believed that the Bible story of Noah and the Ark was inspired by the Gilgamesh Epic.

Do a search, there are so many flood stories, its to prove a point that the righteous prevail and the evil and immoral fucks dont. End of story.
 
Havoc,

Very true, I studied and read the story of Gilgamesh in a Humanities class in school. Both stories are very much alike!
 
"SECOND.YOU LIKE ANALOGIES?GOD IS LIKE SANTA CLAUS,PEOPLE INVENTED HIM TO FEEL BETTER ABOUT THEMSELVES AND HUMAN NATURE. "

That is not a very good analogy because you can trace the origins of Santa Claus and how he came to be made up. Santa Claus is not real and that can be proved. Can you prove that God is not real?
 
On da real... I'm gonna pray to my lost homeboys tonight to come back from the dead and tell me what the fuck the deal is with God....
 
dude said:
"SECOND.YOU LIKE ANALOGIES?GOD IS LIKE SANTA CLAUS,PEOPLE INVENTED HIM TO FEEL BETTER ABOUT THEMSELVES AND HUMAN NATURE. "

That is not a very good analogy because you can trace the origins of Santa Claus and how he came to be made up. Santa Claus is not real and that can be proved. Can you prove that God is not real?
Click to expand...


Actually Santa Claus is based on a real person. Plus he gives me toys every Dec 25... :santa: :santa2:
 
May1010 said:
Not believing in God is just stupid!
Click to expand...


Well, ..... I try to keep an open-mind about most things, if I agree with them or not. (for example, I don't agree with male homosexuality, though, I don't think it is 'moraly wrong' as the bible suggests)

Faith is a very powerful thing, or should I say that I belive in the power of faith.

However, when someone basis thier beliefs on faith (not just on religous matters), they have lost all objectivity, which is unfortunate.

Those with religous faith can not be objective on the subject, nor can those with atheistic faith...... only agnostics retain thier objectivity.


A much more interesting subject to debate is morality :D
 
I don't think that there is one story in the bible that is believable. If you've read the old testament then you know that God supported genocide, child killing, terrorism and mayhem. God in the old testament was a very cruel and punishing figure. Most of the stories are simply ridiculous, such as the story of Job, burning bush, etc.

Then in the new testament we have a whole new God and his son Jesus that seem to have gone to a hippie commune and returned with new insight.

Anyways, using the bible as a guide is one thing, but people who hold it as 100% truth and divine knowledge are naive.
 
"Those with religous faith can not be objective on the subject, nor can those with atheistic faith...... only agnostics retain thier objectivity. "

That is why when you discuss, debate, or philosophize about whether God exists or not you must take an agnostic view on the matter. That way there will be no biased opinions and you can logically think about it.
 
Listen, these debates get no one anywhere. No one's going to convince anyone that their beliefs are wrong. If you want to know if god exists bad enough, kill yourself and find out.
 
dude said:
"Those with religous faith can not be objective on the subject, nor can those with atheistic faith...... only agnostics retain thier objectivity. "

That is why when you discuss, debate, or philosophize about whether God exists or not you must take an agnostic view on the matter. That way there will be no biased opinions and you can logically think about it.
Click to expand...

Thank you, that is one of the points I was trying to convey. However as Burning_Inside states.... "No one's going to convince anyone that thier beliefs are wrong" ... because most are blinded by their faith.
 
mrbill said:
dude...i'm lmao, that is the most ridiculous analogy i have ever read. Using analogy to make an argument just shows that you cannot successfully explain the original premise. I am wondering if anyone of the "god believers" here believe in Zeus, or maybe Osiris, or any other of the almost infinite number of gods created by man throughout history?? If not, why not...they are much older than your "jesus". I think most so called devout individuals would laugh at someone who professed to believe that Zeus was their god and lived on mt. olympus hurling "thunderbolts". Do you not realize that people once believed in these gods as strongly as you do yours, whatever one that may be. It kind of makes it seem silly if you really think about it.:confused:
Click to expand...

I hope Slugo doesn't read this...he's a catholic priest. We'll know what happened if we hear that tell-tale, "Oooo oooooooo." :eek:

You, my friend, are enlightened. I agree with your broad-minded hypothesis. You obviously have the ability to think beyond the scope of your time, your culture, and your existence ;) Props.
 
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