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What do you prefer test or deca? why?
- Thread starter p.b.
- Start date
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bigmk
Guest
Deca hands down. Best for overall mass...and what bodybuilder isnt looking for more quality size! Some will say the sides are not worth it. I say what sides? I have not personally experienced any deca dick or bloat at doses up to 600mg/week. Try both and get back to me, you will see what i mean.
The_Eviscerator
New member
bigmk said:
I agree, but I like NPP better. Even less sides and it works fast. Also, keeps the joints feeling great.
The_Eviscerator
New member
p.b. said:
Test is definitely going to produce more acne. Some get deca acne, but it is not nearly as bad as test acne.
majutsu
Well-known member
sigh . . . deca can not cause gyno. It aromitizes (turns to estrogen) very, very little, less the natural rate that occurs in men. Only estrogen can cause breat tissue formation. What deca does do is hit the progesterone receptor very, very hard. Progesterone, with even the slightest estogen, can lead to a frightening development of gyno. One that is totally unresponsive to anti-estrogens like liquidex. You need an anti-progesterone like dostinex to stop progesterone gyno.
Deca, by itself, can't cause gyno. Everybody actually takes a little thing with deca, usually test, or has old sust esters in their system, etc, or eq, or an oral, or something that slightly increases the estrogen. Then, the deca's progesterone makes a rip-roaring gyno in prone individuals. Now, well over 80% of people can take deca and test with no gyno at all, and side effect studies place most major sides under 15% (see your pdr
). But people don't really care about chemistry, science, or reality. So they say idiot statements like deca gave me gyno and liquidex didn't help. Deca will probably kill libido without test or dbol or some androgen to replace the suppression. So most people take deca and test. If you've never taken test, it is your first real cycle, and your first cycle shouldn't be 2 drugs (deca and test), anti-progesterones and anti-es, . . . Take test until you know more.
Bigmk -- deca rules! I agree.
Deca, by itself, can't cause gyno. Everybody actually takes a little thing with deca, usually test, or has old sust esters in their system, etc, or eq, or an oral, or something that slightly increases the estrogen. Then, the deca's progesterone makes a rip-roaring gyno in prone individuals. Now, well over 80% of people can take deca and test with no gyno at all, and side effect studies place most major sides under 15% (see your pdr
). But people don't really care about chemistry, science, or reality. So they say idiot statements like deca gave me gyno and liquidex didn't help. Deca will probably kill libido without test or dbol or some androgen to replace the suppression. So most people take deca and test. If you've never taken test, it is your first real cycle, and your first cycle shouldn't be 2 drugs (deca and test), anti-progesterones and anti-es, . . . Take test until you know more. Bigmk -- deca rules! I agree.
majutsu said:sigh . . . deca can not cause gyno. It aromitizes (turns to estrogen) very, very little, less the natural rate that occurs in men. Only estrogen can cause breat tissue formation. What deca does do is hit the progesterone receptor very, very hard. Progesterone, with even the slightest estogen, can lead to a frightening development of gyno. One that is totally unresponsive to anti-estrogens like liquidex. You need an anti-progesterone like dostinex to stop progesterone gyno.
Deca, by itself, can't cause gyno. Everybody actually takes a little thing with deca, usually test, or has old sust esters in their system, etc, or eq, or an oral, or something that slightly increases the estrogen. Then, the deca's progesterone makes a rip-roaring gyno in prone individuals. Now, well over 80% of people can take deca and test with no gyno at all, and side effect studies place most major sides under 15% (see your pdr
Bigmk -- deca rules! I agree.
Sorry brother,but you're wrong on this one.Deca most certainly can cause gyno,as it is a progestin that not only can behave like progesterone(which can cross-activate the estrogen receptor)but can also stimulate prolactin secretion.I have had serious gyno symptoms from deca only runs in the past,on as little as 200mgs/week(Organon yellow tops).I do agree that deca is a great anabolic,but folks need to test the waters to see how they react to the progestin bases(deca and tren),as one persons reactions may be quite different from another based on sensitivity/uptake of the molecule.
Themachine01
New member
Holy shit, its Huck.
majutsu said:So they say idiot statements like deca gave me gyno and liquidex didn't help. Bigmk -- deca rules! I agree.
I had my hormone levels tested at time the gyno was in its initial development and also once more a bit further don the road before i had surgery. Estrogen was well within acceptable levels BOTH times. This was definitely a case of prolactin buildup. People like who see fit to give advice on a subject they clearly don’t understand fully are why people get themselves in trouble.
B
bigmk
Guest
GoFastMan said:
Bottom line..anyone looking into running deca or tren for that matter needs to run dostinex with their cycle to prevent any possible gyno symptoms from developing! Does this mean you should be hesitant to use deca because of gyno...absolutely not! Run the dostinex with your cycle! Remember, deca is a very powerful steroid which needs to be understood before blindly running a cycle. Do your research, keep dostinex on hand, and you should be fine. Get ready to grow like a mofo!
spikemydog
New member
deca is a no go for me.....shuts emm down hard and long.
spikemydog
New member
poantrex exactly!!!!! why walk around depressed and not intrested in women?i stacked it but wasnt impressed.everyones different though.
majutsu
Well-known member
huck and gofastman -- both of you seem to say you ran deca only, had normal estrogen (not elevated from previous cycling). In fact, gofastman, you say your estrogen tested normal. Did you insinuate your prolactin was high? Huck actually suggested his prolactin was high too. I am very interested in this because my research is all about things like deca, test, and their interactions with the cns (read some profiles). [As to the l-dex, gofastman, you need to read more carefully, as I said that l-dex was useless, it was p.b. who asked if you used l-dex, and this I was mocking.] Gofastman, I want as many details as possible on your deca gyno, lab values if you got them, whether you had tissue or just secretion, etc. PM if you wish.
Huck nice to see you. I still believe that progesterone and prolactin activity have to be aided by estrogen to form gyno. This is true in practice, but BBers always talk about deca gyno. We need to figure this out . . . Also, what I said to Gofastman goes for you too, any details about this experience I would like to know. Also what I don't understand is why tren has many times the progeterone activity as deca, but people like you huck find no problems with tren? Is it deca's effects on LH? We need to figure this deca-gyno thing out once and for all. And if its about progesterone, then why is tren not an identical problem for you?
Sorry for hijacking this thread btw. But this is too good.
Huck nice to see you. I still believe that progesterone and prolactin activity have to be aided by estrogen to form gyno. This is true in practice, but BBers always talk about deca gyno. We need to figure this out . . . Also, what I said to Gofastman goes for you too, any details about this experience I would like to know. Also what I don't understand is why tren has many times the progeterone activity as deca, but people like you huck find no problems with tren? Is it deca's effects on LH? We need to figure this deca-gyno thing out once and for all. And if its about progesterone, then why is tren not an identical problem for you?
Sorry for hijacking this thread btw. But this is too good.
Nighthawkk
New member
I like them both when combined, has a very synergistic effect on mass gain IMO
majutsu said:
Actually,fina DOES give me problems as well.I believe that the molecular structure of progesterone can bind the E/R,and in those that are sensitive genetically,can activate it into a signaling complex.So what you have is a cross-activation,rather than direct estrogenic activation.Oddly enough,NOLVADEX has halted,or greatly reduced gyno symptoms from deca/tren for me on a couple of different occasions,so it's keeping the activity blocked off for me,by blocking the progesterone from even binding.Where symptoms persisted,a small amount of bromo on top of the nolvadex did the trick(a dual progesterone/prolactin attack).These androgens,progesterones,prolactins,estrogens are tricky little devils,lol.
Themachine01
New member
HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex said:
I always run nolva now throughout my cycles, which always include either deca or fina now. I run it at 10mg/day throughout.
psychedout
New member
p.b. said:
Bump.
Nighthawkk
New member
p.b. said:
People say it doesn't, but I have heard that estrogen must be present in order for any progestagenic activity to occur. I'd like to hear what others have to say about this too
p.b. said:
It certainly can help.Occupying and blocking off as many mammary estrogen receptors as possible is certainly going to reduce your chances of full blown gyno,even if it's occuring through progestogenic initiation.Using nolvadex has been quite helpful in my case,but remember,everyone reacts differently,so use caution and keep your deca dosages low to moderate with a nolvadex dosage of 10-20mgs/day(if you're sensitive to deca)to test the waters,and SLOWLY work your way up.
S
satchboogie
Guest
for me..
its deca hands down!
400-600mg a week with some primo/nolva/and proviron does a super outstanding job..
bloated like a baloon but strong like a moutain lion!
its deca hands down!
400-600mg a week with some primo/nolva/and proviron does a super outstanding job..
bloated like a baloon but strong like a moutain lion!
Bumping this back up,as it may answer a few questions for those curious.
