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UK Starts to come to its senses

Weapon X

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Gun crimes soaring despite ban brought in following Dunblane
By David Bamber, Home Affairs Correspondent
(Filed: 15/07/2001)


THE controversial ban on the ownership of handguns which was introduced after the Dunblane massacre has failed to halt an increasing number of crimes involving firearms.

An independent report, Illegal Firearms in the UK, to be published by the Centre for Defence Studies at King's College in London tomorrow, says that handguns were used in 3,685 offences last year compared with 2,648 in 1997, an increase of 40 per cent.

The figures will renew the debate about the effectiveness of the gun ban, introduced by the last Conservative government and then extended to cover all pistols by Labour after winning the 1997 general election.

Legislation banning larger-calibre pistols was proposed by the previous Conservative government in response to the murder of 16 pupils and their teacher by Thomas Hamilton at Dunblane primary school in March 1996.

But Labour broadened the scope of the Act to cover smaller handguns as well, despite opposition from the sporting community. The law is now so restrictive that British Olympic shooting competitors go abroad to practise because their weapons are illegal in this country.

The new report, commissioned by the Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting, was compiled by John Bryan, the former head of the firearms intelligence unit at New Scotland Yard.

Mr Bryan said that his report cast doubt on the wisdom of the ban. "The increase in the use of handguns by criminals since the implementation of the 1997 Act clearly raises important questions for policy-makers considering further controls on legally-held firearms."

David Bredin, the director of the Campaign for Shooting, said: "It is crystal clear from the research that the existing gun laws do not lead to crime reduction and a safer place.

"Policy-makers have targeted the legitimate sporting and farming communities with ever-tighter laws. The research clearly demonstrates that it is illegal guns which are the real threat to public safety."

The number of crimes involving handguns has increased, mostly due to a flood of illegally imported weapons and the use of those already in circulation before 1997.

The report also shows a dramatic rise in firearms incidents in general, from 4,904 recorded incidents in 1997 to 6,843 last year. It reveals an increase in crimes using shotguns, up from 580 in 1997 to 693 last year.

Offences involving air weapons show an even more startling rise, from 7,506 in 1997 to 10,103 last year. Mr Bryan compiled the statistics from Home Office figures and information obtained by analysing individual forces' crime totals.

A firearms amnesty at the time of the ban's introduction resulted in 160,000 handguns being surrendered to the police at a cost of £90 million to the taxpayer in compensation.

A Home Office spokesman said: "The Government did not believe that banning handguns by itself would eradicate gun crime. We recognise there is a continuing problem with the use of guns by criminals and that it has increased over recent years.

"We are taking further measures against criminals who use guns and we already have schemes in the pipeline to curtail illegal gun use. These include a national register of legal guns, an intensified effort against illegally smuggled weapons and a determination to punish criminals who use guns."

http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/ma...un15.xml&sSheet=/news/2001/07/15/ixhomef.html


:doublefi:
 
So how does this indicate that the UK is coming to its senses?? Mebbe you could give us your personal insight into this? In what way are we coming to our senses?

The report basically says.....we didnt expect banning guns to remove all gun crime.....we acknowledge this and we are taking steps to limit gun crime.

Again, in what way does that indicate we in the UK are coming to our senses?


Weapon X said:
Gun crimes soaring despite ban brought in following Dunblane
By David Bamber, Home Affairs Correspondent
(Filed: 15/07/2001)


THE controversial ban on the ownership of handguns which was introduced after the Dunblane massacre has failed to halt an increasing number of crimes involving firearms.

An independent report, Illegal Firearms in the UK, to be published by the Centre for Defence Studies at King's College in London tomorrow, says that handguns were used in 3,685 offences last year compared with 2,648 in 1997, an increase of 40 per cent.

The figures will renew the debate about the effectiveness of the gun ban, introduced by the last Conservative government and then extended to cover all pistols by Labour after winning the 1997 general election.

Legislation banning larger-calibre pistols was proposed by the previous Conservative government in response to the murder of 16 pupils and their teacher by Thomas Hamilton at Dunblane primary school in March 1996.

But Labour broadened the scope of the Act to cover smaller handguns as well, despite opposition from the sporting community. The law is now so restrictive that British Olympic shooting competitors go abroad to practise because their weapons are illegal in this country.

The new report, commissioned by the Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting, was compiled by John Bryan, the former head of the firearms intelligence unit at New Scotland Yard.

Mr Bryan said that his report cast doubt on the wisdom of the ban. "The increase in the use of handguns by criminals since the implementation of the 1997 Act clearly raises important questions for policy-makers considering further controls on legally-held firearms."

David Bredin, the director of the Campaign for Shooting, said: "It is crystal clear from the research that the existing gun laws do not lead to crime reduction and a safer place.

"Policy-makers have targeted the legitimate sporting and farming communities with ever-tighter laws. The research clearly demonstrates that it is illegal guns which are the real threat to public safety."

The number of crimes involving handguns has increased, mostly due to a flood of illegally imported weapons and the use of those already in circulation before 1997.

The report also shows a dramatic rise in firearms incidents in general, from 4,904 recorded incidents in 1997 to 6,843 last year. It reveals an increase in crimes using shotguns, up from 580 in 1997 to 693 last year.

Offences involving air weapons show an even more startling rise, from 7,506 in 1997 to 10,103 last year. Mr Bryan compiled the statistics from Home Office figures and information obtained by analysing individual forces' crime totals.

A firearms amnesty at the time of the ban's introduction resulted in 160,000 handguns being surrendered to the police at a cost of £90 million to the taxpayer in compensation.

A Home Office spokesman said: "The Government did not believe that banning handguns by itself would eradicate gun crime. We recognise there is a continuing problem with the use of guns by criminals and that it has increased over recent years.

"We are taking further measures against criminals who use guns and we already have schemes in the pipeline to curtail illegal gun use. These include a national register of legal guns, an intensified effort against illegally smuggled weapons and a determination to punish criminals who use guns."

http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/ma...un15.xml&sSheet=/news/2001/07/15/ixhomef.html


:doublefi:
 
By realizing that banning handguns doesn't drop crime rates and isn't the answer to the problems.
Waking up, and I wish the American Left would, also.
 
Care to respond to the other thread you posted on this subject a few days ago?? I bumped it for ya....

BTW it was always known that restricting gun use wouldnt eliminate all gun crime......that is obvious (and your report says so....so it must be true). However, eventually guns will become harder to come by (the ban is still in its infancy) and then good results will be seen.



Weapon X said:
By realizing that banning handguns doesn't drop crime rates and isn't the answer to the problems.
Waking up, and I wish the American Left would, also.
 
Weapon X said:
By realizing that banning handguns doesn't drop crime rates and isn't the answer to the problems.
Waking up, and I wish the American Left would, also.

The current ban would have stopped the Dunblane massacre as the nutter involved had legally owned firearms (which people cannot now own due to the new laws)

If the ban stops more massacres like this, then it worked.
 
Some results on violent crime were announced in the UK today:

Violent crime rose for the second year in a row by more than 30,000 offences to 733,000, but the rate of the rise has slowed from 16% 12-24 months ago to 4.3% in the last 12 months.



So obviously the lack of guns in the public domain hasn't sent the UK spiralling towards disaster as some posts here are suggesting.
 
I don't X was suggeting disaster.

It appears that he is stating that a firearms ban is usualy done to appease voters (like so many political moves), yet has no real effectiveness.
 
Many hurried laws are to appease voters, but the post-Dunblane laws will prevent another Dunblane.

There have been several cases of mentally ill people with legally owned firearms going nuts. This cannot happen after post-Dunblane laws (as people cannot legally own these weapons anymore).

That in itself has got to be a good thing.

No law/order system is perfect and every country has its own different problems which aren't necessarily comparable to the problems in other countries.

Criminals will always be able to get hold of weapons (and no laws are going to stop that), but this does prevent legally owned weapons from causing harm.
 
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We can ban anything and prevent its being used in a crime. If we had banned Kool-Aid, all those people wouldn't have died in Jonestown.
The question is whether the benefits outweigh the risks of our freedoms under the Constitution, and in the case of firearms, which are also used to save thousands of lives every year, I don't believe that this particular deal with the devil is worth it.
 
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