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*Tricking The HPTA: Suppressing Prolactin May Alter The Ability of Testosterone To Suppress LH/FSH Release!*

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ross
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big_griff said:
i know many if not all will think i'm crazy or stupid for this, but i don't really care. I tried something pretty radical on this current cycle, i'm running tren e. and deca together, while running dostinex(cabergoline) to supress prolactin, and i'm doing fine, actually my libido response is very similar to ross! I'm having NONE of the issues i had before while running deca and tren separately! So far so good! I'm in week 5 and no issues, actually, nothing but good things! So thats my two bits. :)

Amen brotha!
 
digit0x said:
Ross,

Your prolactin and its effects on the HPTA are well sourced. However, do you have well founded research on Cabergoline (or its core ingredients) and its proven effect on prolactin?

If you can cite that info, I'm going to buy Caber.

Cabergoline (brand names Dostinex® and Cabaser®), a lysergic acid amide derivative, is a potent dopamine receptor agonist on D2 receptors. It also acts on dopamine receptors in lactophilic hypothalamus cells to suppress prolactin production in the pituitary gland. It is frequently used as a second-line agent in the management of prolactinomas when bromocriptine is ineffective.

Contents
1 Pharmacokinetics
2 Carcinogenity
3 Uses
4 Off-Label/Recreational Uses
5 Contraindications and Precautions
6 Pregnancy and Lactation
7 Side effects
8 Interactions
9 Dosage
10 External links



Pharmacokinetics

Following a single oral dose, resorption of cabergoline from the gastrointestinal (GI) tract is highly variable, typically occurring within 0.5 to 4 hours. Ingestion with food does not alter its absorption rate. Human bioavailability has not been determined since the drug is intended for oral use only. In mice and rats the absolute bioavailability has been determined to be 30 and 63 percent, respectively. Cabergoline is rapidly and extensively metabolized in the liver and excreted in bile and to a lesser extent in urine. All metabolites are less active than the parental drug or inactive altogether. The human elimination half-life is estimated to be 63 to 68 hours in patients with Parkinson's disease and 79 to 115 hours in patients with pituitary tumors.


Carcinogenity

In rodents a dose-dependent increase in malignant tumors has been found. The correlation is thought to be species specific. No clinical data exists on carcinogenity in humans.


Uses

Monotherapy of Parkinson's disease in the early phase.
Combination therapy, together with levodopa and a decarboxylase inhibitor such as carbidopa, in progressive-phase Parkinson's disease.
Adjunctive therapy of prolactin-producing pituitary gland tumors (microprolactinomes).
In some countries also: ablactation and dysfunctions associated with hyperprolactinemia (amenorrhea, oligomenorrhea, anovulation, and galactorrhea).

Off-Label/Recreational Uses

It has at times been used as an adjunct to SSRI antidepressants as there is some evidence that it counteracts certain side effects of those drugs, such as reduced libido and anorgasmia. It also has been suggested online that it has a possible recreational use in reducing or eliminating the male refractory period. It is also used by bodybuilders to control gynocomastia caused by elevated prolactin levels caused by use of Trenbolone esters.


Contraindications and Precautions

Hypersensitivity to ergot derivatives
Pediatric patients (no clinical experience)
Severely impaired liver function or cholestasis
Co-medication with drugs metabolized mainly by CYP P450 such as erythromycin and ketoconazole, because increased plasma levels of cabergoline may result.
Cautions: severe cardiovascular disease, Raynaud's Syndrome, gastroduodenal ulcers, active gastrointestinal bleeding, hypotension.

Pregnancy and Lactation

Pregnancy: Approximately 100 female patients became pregnant under therapy with cabergoline for hyperprolactinemic conditions. The incidence of spontaneous abortions and congenital abnormalities was comparable to nontreated patients. Nevertheless, women wishing to become pregnant should wait a period of four weeks after discontinuation of cabergoline. Patients becoming pregnant under therapy should terminate cabergoline immediately, if possible.
Lactation: In rats cabergoline was found in the maternal milk. Since it is not known if this effect also occurs in humans, breastfeeding women should not be treated.

Side effects

Approximately 200 patients with newly diagnosed Parkinson's disease participated in a clinical study of cabergoline monotherapy. Seventy-nine (79) percent reported at least one side effect. These side effects were chiefly mild or moderate:

GI tract: Side effects were extremely frequent. Fifty-three percent of patients reported side effects. Very frequent: Nausea (30%), obstipation (22%), and dry mouth (10%). Frequent: Gastric irritation (7%), vomiting (5%), and dyspepsia (2%).
Psychiatric disturbances and central nervous system (CNS): Altogether 51 percent of patients were affected. Very frequent: Sleep disturbances (somnolence 18%, insomnia 11%), vertigo (27%), and depression (13%). Frequent: dyskinesia (4%) and hallucinations (4%).
Cardiovascular: Approximately 30 percent of patients experienced side effects. Most frequent were hypotension (10%), peripheral edema (14%) and non-specific edema (2%). Arrhythmias were encountered in 4.8%, palpitations in 4.3%, and angina pectoris in 1.4%.
In a combinatiion study with 2,000 patients also treated with levodopa, the incidence and severity of side effects was comparable to monotherapy. Encountered side effects required a termination of cabergoline treatment in 15% of patients. Additional side effects were infrequent cases of hematological side effects, and an occasional increase in liver enzymes or serum creatinine without signs or symptoms.

As with other ergot derivatives, pleuritis, exudative pleura disease, pleura fibrosis, lung fibrosis, and pericarditis are seen. These side effects are noted in less than 2% of patients. They require immediate termination of treatment. Clinical improvement and normalization of X-ray findings are normally seen soon after cabergoline withdrawal.

The reported incidence and severity of side effects in hyperprolactinemic patients was comparable.


Interactions

No interactions were noted with levodopa or selegiline. The drug should not be combined with other ergot derivatives. Dopamine antagonists such as antipsychotics and metoclopramide inhibit the clinical action of cabergoline and should therefore not be used concomitantly. The use of antihypertensive drugs should be intensively monitored because excessive hypotension may result from the combination.


Dosage

Parkinson's disease: Monotherapy: Initial dose should be 0.5 mg daily. The usual maintenance dose is 2 to 4 mg daily. Combination therapy: Usually 2 to 6 mg daily.
Tumors of the pituitary gland and other hyperprolactinemic conditions: Initially 0.5 mg per week, slowly titrated to 4.5 mg per week, if necessary.
Ablactation: According to specific treatment scheme.

External links

Cabergoline Can Damage Heart Valves
Cabergoline (Systemic) - Medlineplus.org
Dostinex - rxlist.com
Scientifc Information on Dostinex and Cabaser (Swiss, in German)
[hide]v • d • eErgolines
Lysergic acid derivatives Bromocriptine, Cabergoline, Ergine,Ergonovine, Ergotamine, Lysergic acid, Lysergol, LSD, D-Lysergic acid hydroxyethylamide, Lisuride, Methergine, Methysergide, Pergolide
Hallucinogenic lysergamides AL-LAD, ALD-52, BU-LAD, CYP-LAD, DAL, DAM-57, Ergonovine, ETH-LAD, LAE-32, LSD, LPD-824, LSM-775, D-Lysergic acid N-(α-hydroxyethyl)amide, Methylergonovine, MLD-41, PARGY-LAD, PRO-LAD
Other ergolines Ergoline
Natural sources Argyreia nervosa, Claviceps spp., Ipomoea tricolor, Ipomoea violacea, Rivea corymbosa
 
KD1 said:
Im on it right now, 0.5mg 2xEW and my balls look like raisins ( due to 500mg TestE + 250mg Eq + 40mg TBol ).

MANY FAKES! BEWARE!

Cabergoline is NOT a cheap drug.

I would ONLY go with a pharmaceutical brand such as Cabaser by Upjohn or Dostinex.
 
Thanks for the references.

Ross, (or anyone else) have you ever run a cycle with one of these Caber products and a similar one without, found your recovery to be noticebly more effective at keeping gains and returning body to normal function?
 
gjohnson5 said:
Remember the reason why cabaser/dostinex is only approved for .5 mg in the US. Some studies suggested that people suffered heart failure from taking this at higher dosage. I can say I took it at 2mg's a day for several weeks and saw none of this. To each his own

Did you use a Pharmaceutical brand?

It is a FACT that cabergoline will drastically reduce prolactin, just as Arimidex will decrease estrogen. Unless of course, our shit is FAKE.

If you didn't experience an increase in libido and orgasm intensity, I suspect you were not using real Caber.
 
Re: *Tricking The HPTA: Suppressing Prolactin May Alter The Ability of Testosterone T

I bought generic cabaser from an Indian pharmacy. In india there is no such thing as a prescription, so they will sell to you and ship

- Ross - said:
Did you use a Pharmaceutical brand?

It is a FACT that cabergoline will drastically reduce prolactin, just as Arimidex will decrease estrogen. Unless of course, our shit is FAKE.

If you didn't experience an increase in libido and orgasm intensity, I suspect you were not using real Caber.
 
Vascular Freak said:
few questions bros as i just got dostinex today...

1 i have liquid dostinex so could i take a smaller dose ed as opposed to e3d or e4d?

2 also what is a good dose when running 50mg tren ed?

3 dostinex is the same is caber right?

Ross hook me up with some answers!!

1.) NO

2.) .5mgs E3D

3.) YES

:)
 
It should also be noted that USING AN AROMATASE INIHIBITOR in conjunction with Testosterone will ALSO reduce the amount of HPTA suppression experienced.
 
I think ulter mentioned the doseage in the study was 10mg's BTW, the highest I've seen pills were the 4mg ones that I had to split up.
 
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