I have used TNE pre workout and I swear, it's like I'm lifting air. The TNE I have is dark like tren and smells like vanilla quite strongly. When you sweat you smell like the vanilla too, but I don't mind since I think it smells great as does the girl I've been hooking up with. I've actually let her pin me with it pre sex since she loves when I'm absolutely primal. Can't recommend the stuff enough