This is a fucked up disturbing video. If you still shop at J.Crew after this...

[jenscats5]

Yes, for the 20th time animals should be treated humanely. It goes beyond just meats & clothing.

Another point I was making, I just don't see how someone can say "Save the Minks" and then go "ooh ahhh" over a diamond that was mined by a maimed child. How can anyone question my for fur and get on their soapbox, when they can't confirm that an animal did not suffer to make most of the goods or at least one good they consume. How can anyone say "Save the Minks" yet get in their gas guzzling SUV and add more cars to road thus harming the air that we and the minks breath.

I just don't get it.

You asked for & I told you what/how I was making an effort in a cause I believe in......you asked who had solutions - and while I have no all out solutions to correct the problem, I listed what I do or could do....

As for the "gas guzzling SUV" - mine serves a purpose cuz you ain't getting thru Vermont in January in 28" of snow in a hybrid car.

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

You asked for & I told you what/how I was making an effort in a cause I believe in......you asked who had solutions - and while I have no all out solutions to correct the problem, I listed what I do or could do....

As for the "gas guzzling SUV" - mine serves a purpose cuz you ain't getting thru Vermont in January in 28" of snow in a hybrid car.

Mine serves a purpose because I like it. Oddly, it gets the best mileage among all my daily drivers.

 

[starfish]

Yes, for the 20th time animals should be treated humanely. It goes beyond just meats & clothing.

Another point I was making, I just don't see how someone can say "Save the Minks" and then go "ooh ahhh" over a diamond that was mined by a maimed child. How can anyone question my for fur and get on their soapbox, when they can't confirm that an animal did not suffer to make most of the goods or at least one good they consume. How can anyone say "Save the Minks" yet get in their gas guzzling SUV and add more cars to road thus harming the air that we and the minks breath.

I just don't get it.

They make hybrid SUVs...See them all the time.

It's all about choices. Becoming aware of what is going on in the world and doing something positive about ....if that is the kind of human being you are...or are not.


Enjoy your fur....Hope it makes you feel like a good person.

 

[gotmilk]

I'd a-bomb most of Asia anyhow...

But I'm fucking crazy.

 

[mekannik]

This reminds me of the Denis Leary routine off of no cure for cancer:

Red meat, white meat, blue meat, meat-o-fucking-rama. You will eat it. Because not eating meat is a decision. Eating meat is an instinct! Yeah! And I know what it's about.

"I don't want to eat the meat because I love the animals. I love the animals." Hey, I love the animals too. I love my doggy. He's so cute. My fluffy little dog.. He's so cute- There's the problem. We only want to save the cute animals, don't we? Yeah. Why don't we just have animal auditions. Line 'em up one by one and interview them individually. "What are you?" "I'm an otter." "And what do you do?" "I swim around on my back and do cute little human things with my hands." "You're free to go." "And what are you?" "I'm a cow." "Get in the fucking truck, ok pal!" "But I'm an animal." "You're a baseball glove! Get on that truck!" "I'm an animal, I have rights!" "Yeah, here's yer fucking cousin, get on the fucking truck, pal!" We kill the cows to make jackets out of them and then we kill each other for the jackets we made out of the cows.

 

[Raina]

You know that's an interesting post. When I was in college, I walked out of Biology labs because I refused to do certain things regarding animals. I found it over the top and unnecessary. I took the condescending remarks my professors gave to me (along with the lower grade for missing the lab) and I took the smart ass remarks from people more concerned with their med school GPA than their values.

In all of my classes it's been stated since day 1 that if you don't participate in all of the labs you get an F. I think that's fair. I can tell you that I learned infinitely more about how the heart actually worked by atually working with a cow heart. Sticking my fingers through the veins. It all made so much more sense.

I've never regretted any work I've done in a lab with animals-- animals I've worked with that were already dead or that I had to kill. Sorry but you can't exactly get to help a prof work on cancer research without live tissue. That all said I've worked with a lot of dead humans whole and in pieces before. For anyone with a passion for that sort of thing nothing can possibly teach as well as hands on in the tissue.

 

[gotmilk]

we had a dead lab at our school. They had all their faces wrapped and they were so bloated anyhow that it never really resembled an actual person.

I'd still nuke Asian countries and Wyerth for electrocuting horses to produce Premarin

 

[Raina]

I grew up fairly rural too. I've milked cows, fed cows that were going to get slaughtered, helped slaughter chickens. I've always had a very real sense of where our food comes from. I'd have no issue eating a cow that I was petting the day before. That's what it's for. I grew up around family that hunted. I've seen deer gutted since I was little, bunnies gutted, squirrels. I've honestly seen my parents' cats do more cruel things to animals than happens in slaughter (bringing home maimed pheasants and neighbor dogs tearing up chickens(.

And it's not that I don't love animals. I donate to the humane society, my own pets live better than most people, my desk at work is like a shrine to my ferrets and dogs. Also because so much lab research is done with dogs and ferrets veterinary care for both winds up being better in the end.

I could have a career of giving animals diseases and working on cures without any issue and go home and sleep with my dog on my pillow. I think it's hard to even debate issues like these because most people either have one opinion or another but no amount of arguing can sway someone who has strong feelings about this or any issue.

That said I look adorable in all of my fur edged winter coats and I will never wear fake fur (or carry a purse that's pretending to be something it's not).

 

[jenscats5]

100% misinformation and pro-worker prooaganda.


The "exploitation" you talk of was actually an IMPROVEMENT in the lives of most people. Yes, people worked in factories - 7 day weeks for 12 hours a day. Yes, they worked in slaughterhouses that would make people cringe today, and yes, kids worked in factories.


This enviroment was actually an INCREASE in standard of living. This replaced AGRICULTURE - the most grueling lifestyle there is; farming as a means of subsistence is far more rigorous than any factory job. These factory jobs that you call "exploitation" finally removed man's dependence on Nature for food - no longer would people starve because of drought or other agricultural issues. These people flocked to the cities for this work - they were not pulled out of some paradise.

A similar phenomenon is going on in China today. Younger people are leaving the farms in droves to work in shitty (by US standards) factory jobs. And lie Americans 100+ years ago, the factory workers LOVE their jobs and wouldn't dream of going back to agriculture. The Industrial revolution was harsh, but it was a cake-walk compared to what it replaced.

As for the oft-cited child labor, I know you are familiar with John Locke's advice that "all children above age 3 should be schooled in use of the loom".

Child labor ENDED with the Industrial Revolution. Before that, every child was expected to work on the farm as soon as they could walk. The free market stopped child labor, because it put enough wealth into enough hands so that kids did not have to work.

Did you read "The Jungle"?? And what did you think, re: the working conditions/treatment of workers (not the slaughtering animal part)??

 

[EnderJE]

Wow. This thread makes me laugh and cry at the same time.

It seems like we have a really charged issue.

I find it interesting that some here say not to take advantage of those life less fortunate. I'm curious if they wear leather or receive anything from sweatshops.

Make your own Nike AirShocks! Do you make all of your own clothing and walk to work too?

Personally, I don't have any issue with the video. I'm sure that makes me less of a person in a few people's eyes; but hey....its the interweb, you've go to hate somebody. Let me tell you a story about when I visited some friends in a third world country and saw how they trimmed the dog population down with their cars...I still get a kick of remembering it. Dammit. There I go showing how much I dislike dogs again.

That is..except for Raina's gay dog. He's growing on me.