The mildest good building stack.

[Realgains]

Nandrolone is a very good ananbolic but quite weak androgenically. This means that it is a decent muscle builder but usually triggers far less in the way of sides than the more androgenic hormones.
Nandrolone aromatizes at a rate of about 25% of testosterone so water gain and bloat is less of an issue with this hormone.
Nandrolone can cause gyno in the sensitive from progesterone , estrogen or the combo of both however it is very rare at moderate doses.
Nandrolone is very mild on the hair line as it converts to the weak androgen DHN . In fact it is the only roid that is mild on the hair line.

Because nandrolone is so weak androgenically it can kill ones sex drive pronto. Very small doses of this hormone will shut down test production utterly and with little androgen sex drive can disappear.

So stack nandrolone with 100mg of proviron per day for the mildest decent stack out there. Proviron will keep Mr. Happy, happy. Good doses of nandrolone are 2mg per pound of body weight or slightly more.

As I mentioned nandrolone is very inhibitory at small doses and it also seems to be somewhat difficult to recover natural test levels form post cycle for some men. So be sure to hit the clomid hard at 300 mg on day one and then use 50 mg for at least 4 weeks. Clomid should begin three weeks after your last shot of nandrolone deconate.

Because nandrolone is so mild androgenically it can be used for a longer cycle. 12-16 week cycles are not uncommon when using nandrolone as the primary AAS. If you run it that long you will experience some degree of testical shrinkage so it may be wise to use H C G at 500 iu's per day for two weeks mid cycle and or for the last two weeks before the cycle ends. In this way the testes will be at or near 100% size post cycle and will be better able to respond to LH.

It is also important to front laod Deca as it is a very slow ester of nandrolone. A double weekly dose on day one would be good.

Believe it or not almost everyone will get very nice gains from 400mg of nandrolone per week and 100 mg of proviron per day. No ancillary drugs are usually needed with this dose as bloat is minimal ,acne is usually not an issue, and gyno is very very rare. Also those that are prone to hair loss will find Nandrolone quite agreeable.
One warning........progesterone from nandrolone conversion can cause gyno in the sensitive. It is very very rare at moderate doses but if you do get it there really isn't anything you can do to stop it. Some say the addition of some winstrol will help but this is not a sure thing. I have had gyno, although not from nandrolone. It isn't that big of a deal really as it can be taken care of with simple day surgery...I have very little scarring and unless you get very close and look real hard you cannot see anything.

No steroid is without risks but nandrolone proves to be very mild for the vast majority of lifters.

RG

 

[Keep it beefy]

this is good information. i'm personally into mild cycles myself, and i think it's great that your spreading the cycle propaganda that this board is altogether missing too much these days. mega stacks, killer dosages, blah blah blah.

i personally am scared of nandrolone just because of the effect that it has on the hpta. frightening to think of your testicles permanantly shut down. i'll stick with test only cycles, with low doses, and take liver protectants for the hepatic lipase activity. at least then i know my balls will be healthy

 

[lawnsaver]

The HCG will hinder the suppressive actions of nandralone and the use of Vitex will help with the increased prolactin production. I would make sure I would use proviron as HCG can create a lot of estrogenic conversion. If proviron isnt available, a 10mg dose of nolvadex while HCG is active, should do the trick.

I agree, nandralone is a great compound, but I would opt for 4-500mg of Boldenone as a substitute for the deca. If primobolan becomes more cost effective, I would choose that first.

 

[Realgains]

The HCG will hinder the suppressive actions of nandralone and the use of Vitex will help with the increased prolactin production. I would make sure I would use proviron as HCG can create a lot of estrogenic conversion. If proviron isnt available, a 10mg dose of nolvadex while HCG is active, should do the trick.

I agree, nandralone is a great compound, but I would opt for 4-500mg of Boldenone as a substitute for the deca. If primobolan becomes more cost effective, I would choose that first.

Indeed 20 of nolva should be used when using H C G ...sorry I missed this and thanx for bringing it up.

Does Vitex really work? I know little about this drug. Tell me more about this drug.

Boldenone is also a fairly mild roid and could be used instead of deca but is is a little more androgenic than nandrolone and aromatizes a little more too at about 50% of that of testosterone.

I didn't mention primo due to its excessive cost. It is also frequntly faked with the "real macoy" hard to find. It also will not give the muscle gains of nandrolone or boldonone mg per mg.

 

[lawnsaver]

Indeed 20 of nolva should be used when using H C G ...sorry I missed this and thanx for bringing it up.

Does Vitex really work? I know little about this drug. Tell me more about this drug.

Boldenone is also a fairly mild roid and could be used instead of deca but is is a little more androgenic than nandrolone and aromatizes a little more too at about 50% of that of testosterone.

I didn't mention primo due to its excessive cost. It is also frequntly faked with the "real macoy" hard to find. It also will not give the muscle gains of nandrolone or boldonone mg per mg.

Since Nandralone converts to progesterone, which increase prolactin, which is the cause on the gyno created by fina, anadrol, and deca. Vitex reduces the production of prolactin. This product wont really help with water retension, but only with the side effects of the prolactin.

I stated EQ as a substitute because of the 100mg ED of proviron. This some more than handle any estrogen related conversion. If proviron is being used, nolvadex isnt needed. Proviron is one of my favorite compounds and is used during if arimidex isnt around, or in bridges to keep gains without effecting my HPTA.

I have to disagree to the statement of primo not having the muscle building effect that deca has on a MG for MG basis. Primo being one of the only "true" anabolics, I have to say 4-500mg of it a week is awsome. The great thing with primo is that diet really has no effect to the muscle building effects of the compound. Deca is extremely sensitive to the intake amount of protien and without enough, the anabolic effects diminish. Primo is not affected by calorie or protien intake...A beautiful thing.

 

[Realgains]

Since Nandralone converts to progesterone, which increase prolactin, which is the cause on the gyno created by fina, anadrol, and deca. Vitex reduces the production of prolactin. This product wont really help with water retension, but only with the side effects of the prolactin.

I stated EQ as a substitute because of the 100mg ED of proviron. This some more than handle any estrogen related conversion. If proviron is being used, nolvadex isnt needed. Proviron is one of my favorite compounds and is used during if arimidex isnt around, or in bridges to keep gains without effecting my HPTA.

I have to disagree to the statement of primo not having the muscle building effect that deca has on a MG for MG basis. Primo being one of the only "true" anabolics, I have to say 4-500mg of it a week is awsome. The great thing with primo is that diet really has no effect to the muscle building effects of the compound. Deca is extremely sensitive to the intake amount of protien and without enough, the anabolic effects diminish. Primo is not affected by calorie or protien intake...A beautiful thing.

Interesting...and I am always learning.

I would also call nadrolone a pure anabolic. Bill Lewellyn calls nandrolone the least androgenic AAS and I would have to agree with him athough primo is very mild as well.

Yes protein intake is very important with nandrolone and needs to be quite high all the time ....good point.

I would have to disagree with you in regard to which hormone is a better muscle builder...primo or nandrolone....I think nandrolone beats primo most of the time.

Oh, an estrogen inhibitor like arimidex and an androgen with estrogen inhibition properties like proviron will not help with the gyno caused by H C G. Estrogen is made directly at the testes with H C G use, and without a conversion enzyme, and thus nolvadex is the best choice. Clomid could also be used although it is not quite as affect as an estrogen blocker IMO.

 

[MJay95]

Indeed 20 of nolva should be used when using H C G ...sorry I missed this and thanx for bringing it up.

Does Vitex really work? I know little about this drug. Tell me more about this drug.

Boldenone is also a fairly mild roid and could be used instead of deca but is is a little more androgenic than nandrolone and aromatizes a little more too at about 50% of that of testosterone.

I didn't mention primo due to its excessive cost. It is also frequntly faked with the "real macoy" hard to find. It also will not give the muscle gains of nandrolone or boldonone mg per mg.

Hey RealGains, what can you do to help with the aromatization/estrogen conversion of boldenone?
(proviron/arimidex/both etc..)

Awesome post bro! I too am into mild cycles and I was debating between Deca & EQ (went with the EQ because I am quite prone to Gyno and don't wan't to risk it)

Ohh Yeah, I'm doing 600mg/week EQ

Thanks


MJay95

 

[lawnsaver]

Interesting...and I am always learning.

I would also call nadrolone a pure anabolic. Bill Lewellyn calls nandrolone the least androgenic AAS and I would have to agree with him athough primo is very mild as well.

Yes protein intake is very important with nandrolone and needs to be quite high all the time ....good point.

I would have to disagree with you in regard to which hormone is a better muscle builder...primo or nandrolone....I think nandrolone beats primo most of the time.

Oh, an estrogen inhibitor like arimidex and an androgen with estrogen inhibition properties like proviron will not help with the gyno caused by H C G. Estrogen is made directly at the testes with H C G use, and without a conversion enzyme, and thus nolvadex is the best choice. Clomid could also be used although it is not quite as affect as an estrogen blocker IMO.

How is nandrolone the least androgenic steroid out there?? It has progesteronic activity which is why water retention occurs. Primo and EQ have much less water retention, which leads me to believe that both are less androgenic than deca. Proviron stops the coversion of test to estrogen. Thats why when taking proviron when off it keeps you hard. It stops estrogen form being converted.

Please tell me why proviron and arimidex wont help with estrogen conversion from HCG???

 

[MadCow1]

I don't think water retention is the deciding factor in classifying a drug as androgenic or not. Deca has always been classified as more of a weak-to-moderate androgen. The best way to consider this is to probably look at those who are most sensitive to androgenic sides, females. Females probably rate the roids in the order of anavar, primo, winstrol/deca (might be debateable on these two).

Still, water retention does not rank among male secondary sex characteristics so that alone does not classify it as androgenic. Deca causes more water retention than equip yet equip is commonly acknowledged to be more androgenic than deca.

My 2 cents anyway.

 

[lawnsaver]

OK...I see your point, but I also link androgenic activity to HPTA suppresion. EQ and Primo dont have nearly the HTPA suppresive properties that Deca has. I guess water retention was a bad example. The bottom line is that I feel Deca has a more pronounced androgenic effect.

 

[MadCow1]

OK...I see your point, but I also link androgenic activity to HPTA suppresion. EQ and Primo dont have nearly the HTPA suppresive properties that Deca has. I guess water retention was a bad example. The bottom line is that I feel Deca has a more pronounced androgenic effect.

To be honest, test, anadrol, and dbol don't have the suppressive properties of nandrolone so the correlation is poor here too. Nothing seems comparable to this compound especially when it is combined with the long acting deca. ester. I've seen the studies using the fool-proof recovery HCG, Novl, Clomid where the testosterone subjects all came back but a second series was required for the nandrolone boys since their test levels were still very suppressed after the first therapy and still below the testost. sample's recovery levels after the 2nd round. Scares the shit out of me.

I have a bunch of US pharm deca (even some purple top 200mg/ml) that I didn't use for my rehab due to these results. I am considering having kids in the next year and don't want to risk it (I've used it before multiple times and always recovered but I remember it taking quite a bit longer to 'feel' right again afterward).

 

[Ckrappraisal]

Wow, really old thread but some of the best info I've come accross in all my days of research. Going to be trying out one of these "Mild Cycles."

 

[d_rson]

I was just thinking the same thing - I don't agree with the original poster.

 

[OMEGA]

I disagree with this post

but wanted to add that Mentzers favorite pre comp stack was suppost to be Dianabol and Deca

 

[Surly Bastard]

sorry but this sound just DUMB

2mg nanrdalone a pound of bodyweight? there nothing mild about that

that will shutdown a persons test production on the spot

how on earth does proviron prevent this exactly? ur test production will sitll suck and ur sex drive will still be shit

i realy hope NO ONE listens to this,

this is the biggest load of BROLIGY

and thinking the world was flat in 1490 was dumb too, right?

Realgains was one we considered pretty damn knowledgeable back then. And he was.

Original post was not dumb. Info is just out of date now. People didn't talk about "PCT" back then NEARLY as much as they do now.

 

[Dogfox]

test is best

 

[Ckrappraisal]

Test can cause androgenic sides such as "hairloss" that make it undesirable for many potential users. Sure the gains are great but I could care less if it speeds up my hair loss by 1000%. Personally I would much rather run a HRT doseage of test @ 200-250 mg per week just to supplement the Deca and help prevent the potential loss of libido. If you are not prone to hair loss that's great but it isn't the reality for many of us.

Just Sayin.