TESTOSTERONE is for women

[Realgains]

We all need testosterone. Ladies produce small amounts of test in the ovaries and adrenal glands. A womens test levels are usually okay until menopause when they drop like a stone, however, young women can have a test levels that is too low especailly after having a kid or two.

You may have a low testosterone level if you have the following symptoms........#1 BY FAR.... low to no libido especially if you have never been able to orgasms even with direct clitoral stimulation.
#2. Easily fatigued
#3. Poor muscle tone
#4. Hair loss
#5 Great difficulty loosing body fat even with a low cal diet and cardio.

So if you suspect a low test level then get you doc to check your total test and free test levels. If your total test is 30 or lower and you have a low libido then you probably need some replacement therapy. If you have all the above symptoms then you need test for sure.

The best way for a women to replace test is via test gels or creams. They are applied daily usually to the inner forearm. They are made from natural sources and are available only at "compounding pharacies" The dose is normally 2.5 to 5mg per day.
Some use a larger dose on some days if they expect a particularily stressful day or if they are doing a tough athletic event that day.

You will find that you will gain more muscle and have better muscle tone with replacement therapy but don't expect large gains in muscle as this takes a test level that is well above the high normal range.

RG

 

[Temple]

Will the test gel at this dose lower your natural test production? If it is too low, it really doesn't matter overly much if it does but does the gel simply supplement what you are already making or does it shut your natural production down and you need to get all of your test from the gel or cream?

 

[FitFossil]

Question for Realgains:

I just started the 2% test creme from a compounding phcy. They had me start with 1mg/day. I've been on 10 days and don't feel any different (no change in libido, no difference in energy or stamina, etc.). Do you think my dose is too low, or do I need to give it more time? I'm only doing this to get my test levels in a normal range (not for extra muscle). I also want to be careful about acne - don't know why I have a prob w/ this even though my test level is low and I'm 39 years old. (Total test was 23 ng/dl and they said normal was 49-120.) Any advice would be great - Thanks!

 

[Realgains]

Will the test gel at this dose lower your natural test production? If it is too low, it really doesn't matter overly much if it does but does the gel simply supplement what you are already making or does it shut your natural production down and you need to get all of your test from the gel or cream?

Once the test level gets into the high normal range (if it does) then yes your own natural test production will slow and even stop but that doesn't really matter since it was never enough anyway. For optimal athletic abilty one needs a test level in the upper normal range. For optimal health one doesn't need to go above mid normal. The thing is each person is different in there bodily needs for testosterone so lab normals are not always the best thing to go by. If you are feeling good and have no androgeic sides then you are getting enough.

One thing is for sure...if your levels are above high normal you will certainly get a shitty lipid profile with a depressed HDL and elevated HDL and you don't want that for years on end.

So when you get your levels checked after being on therapy always be sure to check the lipid profile. You may be feeling great and have no androgenic sides but your lipid profile may be getting messed up if the dose is too high for your body.

RG

 

[Realgains]

Re: Question for Realgains:

I just started the 2% test creme from a compounding phcy. They had me start with 1mg/day. I've been on 10 days and don't feel any different (no change in libido, no difference in energy or stamina, etc.). Do you think my dose is too low, or do I need to give it more time? I'm only doing this to get my test levels in a normal range (not for extra muscle). I also want to be careful about acne - don't know why I have a prob w/ this even though my test level is low and I'm 39 years old. (Total test was 23 ng/dl and they said normal was 49-120.) Any advice would be great - Thanks!

Thats a pretty low dose but it may be enough....give it some more time and then get your levels checked. I would think that you would need to increase to 2-3mg per day.

23 is low and needs supplementation if you experienced the symptoms of low test. (#1. Being very low to no libido and a pissed off partner)
49 is decent and but you will probably feel best above 60.

RG

 

[Temple]

Why would a woman's natural test being above high normal give her a bad lipid profile? Is it the other hormones that she has in addition to the high test i.e. estrogen? It would seem to me that even above high normal for a woman would not make her lipid profile any worse than a man's who has more test that she would.

 

[Realgains]

Why would a woman's natural test being above high normal give her a bad lipid profile? Is it the other hormones that she has in addition to the high test i.e. estrogen? It would seem to me that even above high normal for a woman would not make her lipid profile any worse than a man's who has more test that she would.

I am not sure excactly how high a women test levels would need to be in order to mess up lipid profiles but it doesn't need to be as high as a normal non using male. Its not going to get way out of hand until bodybuilding doses are used and that takes about 30-50 mg per of injections. At 50 per week that is still not as much as a normal male produces since a portion of that 50 is in ester weight and assililation is not 100% from injections.

Our endocrinologist is most concerned about a shitty lipid profile and androgenic sides if one levels goes much above the noraml range.

It may have something to do with a womens other hormones being thrown out of balance.

Even if your lipid profile remains normal with a total test of 150 you will certainly get androgenic sides after a long period of use.....its just a matter of time.
A little too much over a years time = androgenic sides.......a lot too much over two months =androgenic sides and a shitty HDL/LDL ratio but this usually requires injections and at least 30- 40 mg per week at that.

RG

 

[w84me]

good info - thanks RG - I'm scheduled to have my blood work & check up this Friday - is there anything in particular that I need to request testing to the doctor, or just ask for a baseline?

 

[Realgains]

I have high test levels and my lipid profile is great. Even on 100mg of test cyp my lipid profile was fine. IMMV

I wish I had your genetics spatts..... even on as little as 400 per week my lipid profile is just terrible. My wifes profile was equally crappy on only 10mg of the mild androgen anavar.


RG

 

[Realgains]

good info - thanks RG - I'm scheduled to have my blood work & check up this Friday - is there anything in particular that I need to request testing to the doctor, or just ask for a baseline?

Get a base line lipid profile for sure..... and liver enzymes too in case you want to take 17 aa roids in the future (like anavar and winstrol)

RG

 

[MS]

Maybe you slightly confused what your endo said? Test in the ranges you mentioned for women is unlikely to cause lipid problems UNLESS you're talking about women who have natural hormonal imbalances such as PCOS, in which case the high test/normal estrogen levels are linked to insulin resistance which is the real cause of the lipid probs. Same deal in men, but at higher doses. RG, have you ever had a glucose tolerance test? Of course, test can come with other 'sides' for women, but I wouldn't have said poor lipid profile was one of them.

The orals (including Anavar) are completley different-they have a direct impact on the liver, causing blood lipid disturbances even at very low doses. This is not the same as testosterone.

 

[Realgains]

I will ask our endo more about this . She did say that if the levels go much above high normal there will be an adverse affect on the hdl/ldl profile and ratio...how high above normal levels have to go I don't know. She always tests the lipids with follow up blood work.

One thing is for sure 17 aa roids are far worse for the lipid profile. My wifes lipid profile really suffered on but 10mg of ananvar per day....its back to normal now but she did have a hdl/ldl ratio of 15 to 1 while on!!!



RG

 

[Temple]

Maybe you slightly confused what your endo said? Test in the ranges you mentioned for women is unlikely to cause lipid problems UNLESS you're talking about women who have natural hormonal imbalances such as PCOS, in which case the high test/normal estrogen levels are linked to insulin resistance which is the real cause of the lipid probs. Same deal in men, but at higher doses. RG, have you ever had a glucose tolerance test? Of course, test can come with other 'sides' for women, but I wouldn't have said poor lipid profile was one of them.

The orals (including Anavar) are completley different-they have a direct impact on the liver, causing blood lipid disturbances even at very low doses. This is not the same as testosterone.

Thanks MS - to make sure that I am understanding this, in PCOS the problem is that estrogen levels stay the same whereas with supplemental test the estrogen is supressed?

Also do all drugs that impact the liver effect it the same way. For example would a daily diet of Tylenol cause problems with lipid profile or any of the other prescription drugs that have liver issues as a possible side?

 

[MS]

The problem in PCOS is most likely due to high insulin levels (which cause elevated test) combined with high bodyfat (a side effect of hyperinsulemia??). The high bodyfat/peripheral test leads to higher peripheral estrogen levels....this effectively shuts down E production from the ovaries, but the women's total E levels remain 'normal'.

A similar thing can happen in males with hyperinsulemia/obesity. They have higher E levels due to higher peripheral aromatase activity.

But I digress. My point was that women with endogenous excess test often also have other problems which are linked to the PCO syndrome, rather than a direct effect of test. So if a doc picked up a women with high test levels in the normal population, it would not be surprising that they will also often see elevated lipids. This is not the same as test causing the lipid disturbances.....the high test is just a symptom of an underlying pathology.

I would think the amount of supplemental test needed to elevate a women's lipids would be pretty high. I'm sure there are some Pro women who might have to worry about it, but most of us don't IMHO.

Many liver toxic drugs do not cause lipid problems. It depends on which system within the liver the drug effects. I would not expect normal Tylenol use to have any impact on lipids. As a strange side note, there is some evidence (at least in rats) that supplemental testosterone treatment helps to protect the liver from Tylenol damage However, the Tylenol would also possibly inhibit your anabolic response to exercise, so the best bet is to take the testosterone and leave the Tylenol on the shelf!

 

[Realgains]

UP for low sex drive and poor gains he he he

RG

 

[BrickGirl]

Could you use an injectable instead and if so, what ester and how much? I know it's a broad question, just wondering. Thanks

 

[newgirl-chargeback]

I was wondering about this too....good bump

 

[Realgains]

Could you use an injectable instead and if so, what ester and how much? I know it's a broad question, just wondering. Thanks

There is some evidence to suggest that esterfied T is not healthy if used over years.....but many would disagree with this.

If you did do T injections you need to be very careful as it is very easy to get too much. You need to try 5-10mg every 3 days to maintain T in the normal range with an even blood level. Injecting once a week will result in a high spike and then a big drop by day 5. At the least you should inject every 5th day with no more than 20mg.
After a couple week get you T levels checked and adjust the dose until you are maintaining T between 50 and 80.

It is best to use a long acting ester like Cyp or enanthate although sust would work too.

You need to get tiny little pins, like 27-30 gauge 1.5 inch pins, or your butt is going to take a beating over the months.
Also, you need to use a tiny syringe like a TB or slin syringe for the extra pushing power which is needed in order to get the liquid through the tiny pins....but more importantly you need them for VERY ACCURATE dosing!

RG

 

[newgirl-chargeback]

RG -- so you prefer cyp over prop? Can you enlighten me? And if I read this wrong and you do feel prop is a viable ester, what would you consider a safe dose/frequency.

 

[Realgains]

RG -- so you prefer cyp over prop? Can you enlighten me? And if I read this wrong and you do feel prop is a viable ester, what would you consider a safe dose/frequency.

Prop is best while taking bodybuilding doses and that would be 50-100mg per week, injecting every other day . You want the fast acting ester(prop) because if bad sides come on then you can bail out of a cycle fairly quickly.

Now for replacement therapy you want to avoid every other day injections for comfort sake and you want to use an ester that has a slower release so blood levels stay more consistent. You could use low dose prop but you would have to inject every other day in order to keep blood T levels consistent. So 5mg of prop every other day would work......

Remember that the injectable is more bioavailable than the gel so you could easily get by with 5mg of gel per day but that much test in IM form would be too much and would push yout T level over the upper limit of normal......do that over many months and you will get a dropped voice tone and hair growth for sure.

RG

 

[newgirl-chargeback]

As always, thank you.