Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below Ok here goes. i have some t3 i took a small dose for a week. I mean small 10mcg. It made me feel a bit lethargic but i did drop a couple pounds. Ran into a bodybuilding buddy, he told me the shit is very dangerous get the fuck off it. What is the deal with this stuff i have had a few people tell me dont fuck with it. I have read all the opinions on here some say its ok if used right others say your tyroid will be fucked for life. I am on 2 months of hgh now for 2 months and not seeing the fat loss results that i want althoug the stuff has helped and worked great in other areas. I keep looking at the box in my drug drawer and it is saying come on use me! will 20 mcg a week for 4 weeks fuck me up. also at 2 iu a day of hgh i am having some joint pain in my hands i am just wondering if i am not using enough hgh so far no water bloat. thanks dudes for any advise. will give karma.
T3 please help me
- Thread starter dreath
- Start date
Using thyroid medication without medical supervision and without a need is dangerous. Like all other hormones, when exogenous T3 is used endogenous production will decrease - most of the time your endogenous production will raise several weeks after stopping cytomel but it won't return to pre-cytomel levels. That is my experience, anyway.
My TSH went from around 1.5 before using cytomel, to about 3.5 after. A lower TSH is better, 3.5 is close to hypothyroidism......If i had to do it over, i would NOT have taken cytomel. I was taking small doses, as well.
My TSH went from around 1.5 before using cytomel, to about 3.5 after. A lower TSH is better, 3.5 is close to hypothyroidism......If i had to do it over, i would NOT have taken cytomel. I was taking small doses, as well.
RADAR
Well-known member
F
figure8
Guest
TSH levels always vary. You cant say it went down from the t3 use just by one test, I used cytomel it did not mess my thyroid at all Just dont take alot no more tham 50 mcgs thats safe and ramp off slow dont stay on for more than 6weeks.poantrex said:
I have about 10 bloodtests here that disagree with you.
Thanks guys for the feedback. i think i will run a 6 week dose and just cap out at 40 mcg since the pills i have are 20mcg. I forgot to metion that I am taking hgh as well, and I read on here from dr j that you need t-3 when you are on H. I am not hardcore but I love chemicals and herbs, and i believe in moderation. also i am on celxa and wellbutrin and i am sure you guys know how hard those drugs make it to lose weight. moderation is the key to life and most people on here say that there thyroid is fine if t3 is used correctly.
For the few people that have had thyroid probs are you 100 percent certain that t3 caused the problem. thank dudes
For the few people that have had thyroid probs are you 100 percent certain that t3 caused the problem. thank dudes
Proceed at your own risk. I used no more than 20mcg of T3 for a couple of weeks and my thyroid output lowered considerably. NOT HYPOTHYROID, NO I WASNT SHUT DOWN, BUT MY TSH WENT FROM 1.5 TO 3.5. THE UPPER LIMIT OF NORMAL RANGE IS 4!! THAT IS THE NORMAL THYROID SCORE OF SOMEONE IN THEIR 50's!!! That is VERY signifigant.
But most of the fools here never get bloodwork done and think they're fine just because they dont "feel" symptoms. Whatever.
HGH doesn't need T3 by the way, exo-HGH signifigantly *increases* free T3 levels. I can provide you with studies to prove it if you want.
But most of the fools here never get bloodwork done and think they're fine just because they dont "feel" symptoms. Whatever.
HGH doesn't need T3 by the way, exo-HGH signifigantly *increases* free T3 levels. I can provide you with studies to prove it if you want.
WHAT THE HELL ILL POST IT ANYWAY
Okay, i'm seeing everyone recommend the use of cytomel concurrently with growth hormone, and i'm sick of it. This belief stems from the fact that there are a few studies indicating that exogenous HGH impairs the production of _T4_, and somehow bodybuilders misinterpreted that.
T4 is not very metabolically active, whereas T3 is.
HGH actually _increases_ the conversion of T4 to T3, and Free t3 levels are signifigantly higher when running HGH - if you add T3 to a HGH cycle you may be negating that benefit. Here are some studies to prove it:
Effects of recombinant growth hormone therapy on thyroid hormone concentrations.
Kalina-Faska B, Kalina M, Koehler B.
Department of Pediatric Endocrinology and Diabetes, Medical University of Silesia, Katowice, Poland. [email protected]
BACKGROUND AND OBJECTIVE: There are numerous, often contradictory reports on the effects of growth hormone (GH) therapy on thyroid function. The aim of this study was to assess the effect of such therapy on serum concentrations of thyroid hormones in GH-deficient children euthyroid prior to the treatment, and to determine the necessity of thyroid hormone administration in these patients. MATERIAL AND METHODS: The study included 32 GH-deficient patients in the first stage of sexual development, in whom disorders of thyroid function could be excluded. The inclusion criteria were based on clinical examination and levels of thyroxine (T4), triiodothyronine (T3), free thyroxine (fT4), free triiodothyronine (fT3), reverse triiodothyronine (rT3), thyrotropin (TSH) before and after stimulation with thyrotropin-releasing hormone (TRH). Recombinant growth hormone (rGH) (Genotropin 16U, Pharmacia) was administered at a dose of 0.7 U/kg/week. Fasting blood samples were drawn before treatment and after 3, 6, 9 and 12 months of therapy. Thyroid hormones were measured using RIA and IRMA methods. RESULTS: There were no physical signs of hypothyroidism in the patients examined during 12 months of rGH administration, and the satisfactory growth rate was achieved. T4 levels decreased in the first 3 months but remained within the normal range, and then returned to the values prior to the treatment. A similar trend was observed for fF4, with 28.5% of patients exhibiting fF4 levels below the normal in the 3rd month. An increase during the first 3 months of therapy was observed in the cases of T3 (statistically non-significant) and fT3, and these values then fell to levels within the normal range of patients' age. During treatment, TSH levels decreased but remained within the normal range. CONCLUSIONS: A transient decrease in T4 concentrations in the 3rd month with unchanged T3 and an increase in fT3 concentrations probably result from the effect of rGH on the peripheral metabolism of thyroid hormones. The results obtained do not support the use of thyroid hormone therapy with levothyroxine during the first year of rGH therapy in patients who are initially euthyroid.
PMID: 14756384 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Effects of short-term growth hormone treatment on PTH, calcitriol, thyroid hormones, insulin and glucagon.
Brixen K, Nielsen HK, Bouillon R, Flyvbjerg A, Mosekilde L.
University Department of Endocrinology and Metabolism, Aarhus County Hospital, Denmark.
We measured changes in serum insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1), calcitriol, parathyroid hormone (PTH), thyroid hormones, insulin, and plasma glucagon in response to seven days of treatment with a pharmacological dosage of recombinant human growth hormone (r-hGH) (0.1 IU/kg sc twice daily) or placebo in 20 normal male volunteers to evaluate whether the effect of r-hGH on biochemical bone markers could be attributed to changes in these hormones. Serum IGF-1 (p < 0.001) and vitamin D-binding protein (p < 0.001) increased steadily during treatment returning to baseline at day 14. Total calcitriol (p < 0.01) and free calcitriol index (p < 0.001) increased transiently at day 4. Furthermore, serum insulin (p < 0.001) and both total (p < 0.001) and free triiodothyronine (p < 0.02) increased during treatment, while serum PTH and plasma glucagon remained unchanged. In conclusion, pharmacological doses of r-hGH increased not only IGF-1 but also free-calcitriol index, insulin, and free T3. The increase in these hormones may be co-responsible for some of the observed effects of r-hGH on bone turnover and calcium homeostasis.
Publication Types:
* Clinical Trial
* Controlled Clinical Trial
PMID: 1449044 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Okay, i'm seeing everyone recommend the use of cytomel concurrently with growth hormone, and i'm sick of it. This belief stems from the fact that there are a few studies indicating that exogenous HGH impairs the production of _T4_, and somehow bodybuilders misinterpreted that.
T4 is not very metabolically active, whereas T3 is.
HGH actually _increases_ the conversion of T4 to T3, and Free t3 levels are signifigantly higher when running HGH - if you add T3 to a HGH cycle you may be negating that benefit. Here are some studies to prove it:
Effects of recombinant growth hormone therapy on thyroid hormone concentrations.
Kalina-Faska B, Kalina M, Koehler B.
Department of Pediatric Endocrinology and Diabetes, Medical University of Silesia, Katowice, Poland. [email protected]
BACKGROUND AND OBJECTIVE: There are numerous, often contradictory reports on the effects of growth hormone (GH) therapy on thyroid function. The aim of this study was to assess the effect of such therapy on serum concentrations of thyroid hormones in GH-deficient children euthyroid prior to the treatment, and to determine the necessity of thyroid hormone administration in these patients. MATERIAL AND METHODS: The study included 32 GH-deficient patients in the first stage of sexual development, in whom disorders of thyroid function could be excluded. The inclusion criteria were based on clinical examination and levels of thyroxine (T4), triiodothyronine (T3), free thyroxine (fT4), free triiodothyronine (fT3), reverse triiodothyronine (rT3), thyrotropin (TSH) before and after stimulation with thyrotropin-releasing hormone (TRH). Recombinant growth hormone (rGH) (Genotropin 16U, Pharmacia) was administered at a dose of 0.7 U/kg/week. Fasting blood samples were drawn before treatment and after 3, 6, 9 and 12 months of therapy. Thyroid hormones were measured using RIA and IRMA methods. RESULTS: There were no physical signs of hypothyroidism in the patients examined during 12 months of rGH administration, and the satisfactory growth rate was achieved. T4 levels decreased in the first 3 months but remained within the normal range, and then returned to the values prior to the treatment. A similar trend was observed for fF4, with 28.5% of patients exhibiting fF4 levels below the normal in the 3rd month. An increase during the first 3 months of therapy was observed in the cases of T3 (statistically non-significant) and fT3, and these values then fell to levels within the normal range of patients' age. During treatment, TSH levels decreased but remained within the normal range. CONCLUSIONS: A transient decrease in T4 concentrations in the 3rd month with unchanged T3 and an increase in fT3 concentrations probably result from the effect of rGH on the peripheral metabolism of thyroid hormones. The results obtained do not support the use of thyroid hormone therapy with levothyroxine during the first year of rGH therapy in patients who are initially euthyroid.
PMID: 14756384 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Effects of short-term growth hormone treatment on PTH, calcitriol, thyroid hormones, insulin and glucagon.
Brixen K, Nielsen HK, Bouillon R, Flyvbjerg A, Mosekilde L.
University Department of Endocrinology and Metabolism, Aarhus County Hospital, Denmark.
We measured changes in serum insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1), calcitriol, parathyroid hormone (PTH), thyroid hormones, insulin, and plasma glucagon in response to seven days of treatment with a pharmacological dosage of recombinant human growth hormone (r-hGH) (0.1 IU/kg sc twice daily) or placebo in 20 normal male volunteers to evaluate whether the effect of r-hGH on biochemical bone markers could be attributed to changes in these hormones. Serum IGF-1 (p < 0.001) and vitamin D-binding protein (p < 0.001) increased steadily during treatment returning to baseline at day 14. Total calcitriol (p < 0.01) and free calcitriol index (p < 0.001) increased transiently at day 4. Furthermore, serum insulin (p < 0.001) and both total (p < 0.001) and free triiodothyronine (p < 0.02) increased during treatment, while serum PTH and plasma glucagon remained unchanged. In conclusion, pharmacological doses of r-hGH increased not only IGF-1 but also free-calcitriol index, insulin, and free T3. The increase in these hormones may be co-responsible for some of the observed effects of r-hGH on bone turnover and calcium homeostasis.
Publication Types:
* Clinical Trial
* Controlled Clinical Trial
PMID: 1449044 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Razorguns
Well-known member
plenty of people on this board have taken up to 100mcg of t3 for a few weeks -- ramped off -- waited a few weeks -- took blood tests and came out fine.
I think the younger and healthier you are -- that more you can take. Cuz your body is more adapted to handle it appropriately w/o damage.
I think the younger and healthier you are -- that more you can take. Cuz your body is more adapted to handle it appropriately w/o damage.
Razorguns said:
Their definition of "fine" is usually what their doctor tells them normal range is....which is crap. The upper part of normal range is not good - there are several studies showing signifigant risk of clinical hypothyroidism later in life with a TSH of 3.5 or above.
In fact, most of the people that posted their bloodwork reported feeling fine but their TSH was ridiculously high for their age. Being close to 1 is optimal for someone with an active lifestyle.
Last edited:
dim said:
I never said that someone will "fuck up" their thyroid. What i'm saying is that thyroid function will return a few weeks after stopping cytomel, but for many people it will NOT BE at the same point it was prior to cycling cytomel.
If you take an exogenous hormone of ANY TYPE, there is a good chance that your endogenous production will be permanantly lower - not necessarily too low, BUT lower. This is true for HGH, Testosterone, ETC, you name it.
I've seen it happen more than once, not just in myself....i'm just trying to warn of the dangers here. I'm done with this shit so if someone wants to subject theirself to the dangers of taking cytomel, so be it.
scriptfactory
New member
You are very "anti-T3". I would like to know who you saw it "happen more than once" with.poantrex said:
I have ran a T3 cycle for 4 weeks with clen and my TSH levels were the same afterwards. I have a normal TSH level of about 2.5. About 3 weeks after my cycle finished my TSH levels were actually lower (2.1 I think.) Your one bad experience doesn't mean that everyone will have this problem.
I am following these posts like a hawk. I can see both sides here, however I need to point out that I am 37 approaching middleage so I am sure My thyroid production is low. I have got every kind of blood test i can except, for the thyroid , doc says i am fine. I am desperatly needing to lose this last bit of weight and i am hoping t3 will help. also I was wondering what everyones takes after they come off t3. appreciate the forum.
Honestly, even if thyroid suppression were not an issue I would still be hesitant about using T3. Even at low doses, for me - it made me lose more muscle/strength than I would have cared for.
I think E/C/A works better for sparing muscle without causing long term thyroid problems.
I think E/C/A works better for sparing muscle without causing long term thyroid problems.
F
figure8
Guest
another thing..... I take heavy doses of bladderwrack and myrhh tablets when I start to ramp off the T3. I continue using them for about a month after I completly stop the T3. These herbs are proven to stimulate the thyroid. The key is Not to stay on for more than 6-7 weeks and ramp off slowly and gradully.
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