Sus or test prop

[xlebballax]

Is it okay to switch sus with test prop ? I'm 7 weeks into my 16 week cycle of sus 250 and eq 200.
The only reason I wanna switch is coz I'm trying to figure.out how to stop the gyno when all else has failed.
All info is greatly appreciated.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[eddymerckx]

test is test regardless of the ester--it is the amount that is aromatizing--or in sorta technical terms the methyl group at C19(19th carbon) is chopped off--thus test becomes est. While a longer ester may keep the net level lower it does not matter as you are either sensitive or not very.

In fact, considering prop is so short, it may be actually worse as the peak/valleys will have a much more adverse ratio [of T to E)and the ratio is what triggers (indirectly) the c19 to cleeve

 

[xlebballax]

I did not know that. Thank u for that info. I'm running out of options to battle gyno. Might have to cut test out fully

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

Bro use letro it will kill your gyno!!!

 

[eddymerckx]

I did not know that. Thank u for that info. I'm running out of options to battle gyno. Might have to cut test out fully

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

I think I said (and others)in response to your post yesterday, STOP NOW before it becomes a surgery issue...Do a search for gyno on the site--there are some bros that are freakin experts at it.

When it's fixed we will find a way (if possible) to stop it before it starts.

 

[xlebballax]

I started letro 2 days ago. I'm stopping my sus as of now

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[xlebballax]

Do u recommend I start up primo and maybe winni or var with the eq? I don't want to kill the cycle yet.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

How much of the letro are you using? You need to give it more than two days to work!

 

[xlebballax]

I'm doing .25 a day and gunna jump up soon.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

Way to low I had gyno pretty advanced and was doing 3 mg a day and after a week was 90% gone

 

[xlebballax]

Tell me this, did u stay on ur cycle while doing that? That's my main question.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

Yes unfortunately I am very prone to Gyno once I got it down I dropped the dosage to .5 mg eod and cruised with that to stop it from coming back

 

[xlebballax]

Ok. Ill try that this week at 3mg of letro and see how it works going into next week. Thanks man

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[rustilldown]

Eq aromatizes too you know, I'm not sure how much your running per week but eq ran solo may have adverse effects too seeing as you will have low test. I prefer prop to sus because the sus has so many different esters the peaks and valleys would be worse in my opinion. Prop shot every day would remain fairly stable in my opinion..

 

[Tommygunn1980]

No prob I split 1.5 in am and 1.5 in pm but see what works best for you

 

[rustilldown]

I would stop everything, fix the gyno do a pct and go at it again, running AI from the beginning. just my opinion.. Too much stress trying to slay the dragon while keeping cycle going and feeling like shit on letro..

 

[xlebballax]

Eq aromatizes too you know, I'm not sure how much your running per week but eq ran solo may have adverse effects too seeing as you will have low test. I prefer prop to sus because the sus has so many different esters the peaks and valleys would be worse in my opinion. Prop shot every day would remain fairly stable in my opinion..

I agree with u on the prop being more stable than sus is. But they both aromatize so id rather exclude both to control the gyno growth. As for the eq, my research told me that the aromatizing of the eq is very low so a daily estrogen blocked would do the job.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[rustilldown]

Yah it's about half of test from what I understand, so say if you were running 400mg/week it would be similar to 200mg/week of test, which is low! So you probably would be ok.. How much bf do you have?

 

[eddymerckx]

I would stop everything, fix the gyno do a pct and go at it again, running AI from the beginning. just my opinion.. Too much stress trying to slay the dragon while keeping cycle going and feeling like shit on letro..

^^^agree. stop and fix. and letro will cause all your e to suicide so your cycle is compromised anyway.

 

[xlebballax]

Yah it's about half of test from what I understand, so say if you were running 400mg/week it would be similar to 200mg/week of test, which is low! So you probably would be ok.. How much bf do you have?

I'm running 600 mg/week of eq. I'm at around 10% bf and weighing at 225 lbs and 6'3

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

I've had no problem with my gains on letrozole at all I'm doing a prop Tren cycle and making great gains while taking letrozole with it

 

[xlebballax]

I've had no problem with my gains on letrozole at all I'm doing a prop Tren cycle and making great gains while taking letrozole with it

What are u running exactly? U seem very confident abt how its working and I'm interested to know how its done.

Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[Tommygunn1980]

I'm running 100 mg of prop with 75 mg of Tren ace eod

 

[eddymerckx]

I've had no problem with my gains on letrozole at all I'm doing a prop Tren cycle and making great gains while taking letrozole with it

The problem is that while letero will eliminate 96-98% of estrogen and thus is good for bloat/gyno/high e related sides, it fails to take into account that estrogen is needed for (1) igf/gh production; (2) increased anabolism via glucose metabolism intramuscular; and (3) repair of damage (e.g. growth) via the pentose phosphate pathway.

So you will grow without it, but some critical growth is compromised. BUT in many cases, some bros have no choice as they are just too susceptible to the sides from any e above some baseline. Ideally, you could titrate the anti-e until the just before the tipping point but I am not sure, given the half life, and the fact that there is no real way to know where the tipping point actually is, if it could be done anyway.

My point is, letro is crazy strong and should be used only ny those bros who need it---and that it would be best if the tipping point could be avoided with a milder anti-e.

 

[xlebballax]

The problem is that while letero will eliminate 96-98% of estrogen and thus is good for bloat/gyno/high e related sides, it fails to take into account that estrogen is needed for (1) igf/gh production; (2) increased anabolism via glucose metabolism intramuscular; and (3) repair of damage (e.g. growth) via the pentose phosphate pathway.

So you will grow without it, but some critical growth is compromised. BUT in many cases, some bros have no choice as they are just too susceptible to the sides from any e above some baseline. Ideally, you could titrate the anti-e until the just before the tipping point but I am not sure, given the half life, and the fact that there is no real way to know where the tipping point actually is, if it could be done anyway.

My point is, letro is crazy strong and should be used only ny those bros who need it---and that it would be best if the tipping point could be avoided with a milder anti-e.

Eddy, I started arimidex at .5 eod from day one. And I still got gyno. I skipped my injection today and took the letro. Hopefully it gets rid of my mild gyno by the end of the week and ill shoot again.


Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[eddymerckx]

Eddy, I started arimidex at .5 eod from day one. And I still got gyno. I skipped my injection today and took the letro. Hopefully it gets rid of my mild gyno by the end of the week and ill shoot again.


Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

from day onethat is not a good sign b/c regardless of the compound, stop the e and the prol/prog problem should never have had a chance. You must be really sensitive--may take a while to work--be ready to skip a bit longer (you still have tons of t in your system) let the letro work---the downside sucks as*

 

[xlebballax]

from day onethat is not a good sign b/c regardless of the compound, stop the e and the prol/prog problem should never have had a chance. You must be really sensitive--may take a while to work--be ready to skip a bit longer (you still have tons of t in your system) let the letro work---the downside sucks as*

So I decided to test my body eventho its not the best idea but I wanna get to the bottom of this problem. I'm on day 5 of letro and gyno has already gone down. So Im gunna do a total of 400mg of sus and 400mg of eq bringing them down a bit and if gyno persists then ill drop more to eventually getting off of cycle and starting pct. But I have a good feeling I can control the gyno with mild dosages of letro and smaller dosages of sus and eq.
Wat do u think?


Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness

 

[xlebballax]

And yes dude ur right its worrying that eventho I started an Ai from day I still got gyno.
My 1st cycle was 750mg of sus and 300 of primo with Nooooo gyno. Very odd!
Butttt I was thinking my daily routine over and I have a few ideas that might have affected the work of the arimidex, and things that I did differently this time than last time.

1- I've been on a detox since I started, could it be flushing the arimidex out before it gets into my blood stream.

2- maybe eq and test produced a lot of estrogen when put together.

3- my sus now is a lot more potent. I took delta labs first cycle and now I'm using omega labs.

Orrrr

4- I have no freakin clue!
Haha
Sent from my PC36100 using EliteFitness