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Su opinión al respecto bros

Pro Testo 5005

New member
Andando curioseando por otros foros me encontré con el siguiente comentario acerca de los posibles daños que puede llegar a sufrir el corazón por la hipertrofia muscular, espero y los expertos en estos temas: Genome, quenepo, pajaro loco, goering, muscle doc etc etc pudieran comentar algo al respecto:

El problema de subir de peso aunque sea de puro músculo, sobretodo si es con pesas, es que el corazón tiene que trabajar más para poder atender la demanda de oxigeno y de energía que el cuerpo requiere. El corazón con el ejercicio tambien crece, si es con ejercicio aeróbico e isotónico las paredes engruesa hacia afuera, pero con ejercicio anaeróbico e isometrico como predominantemente son las pesas la pared engruesa hacia adentro reduciendo la cavidad auricular y ventricular con lo que la cantidad de sangre que almacena es menor y entonces se requiere una mayor cantidad de latidos para enviar la misma cantidad de sangre al sistema circulatorio.

Eso no significa que las pesas sean malas, al contrario son buenas si se les combina con ejercicio aeróbico y el aumento de pesos corporal no es tan alto, pero si la hipertrofia muscular es muy alta como en los fisicoconstructivistas ponemos en riesgo la salud.

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:alien: Paz:alien:
 
Bueno tan exactamente asi no es la cosa, pero un buen porcentaje de la hipertrofia cardíaca es de esa manera, tanto con ejercicios aerobicos como con los anaerobicos como las pesas, sihaces un mal uso de los mismo, pues si puedes tener problemas.
Existe lo que se conoce como corazon del deportista, pero es un sistema de adaptacion de años arduos de entrenamineto, y al contrariode lo que dices, los atletas suelen manejar valores de frcuencia cardiacas y pulsos bajos, incluso por debajo de los parámetros cnsiderado como normales (menores de 60 latidos por minuto), en reposo, claro está.
Se ha comentado mucho del gran Swartzer, que su intervencion carídaca era debido a la gran hipertrofia cardiaca que tenia, pero yo creo que sencillamente intervinieron los factores de riesgo cardiovasculares, uno de ellos, la edad. Si lo que tuplanteas fuera cierto, sería muy comun ver hombres infartados con menos de 25 años, cosa que es extermadamente rara sino hay patologia cardíaca de base. Si eso fuera así, el deporte no sería entonces bien indicado.
Claro hay abuso, ignorancia, y eso si que sonpeligroso, todo tiene su ritmo, su momento, solo que a veces nos excedemos.
tengo algunos articulos que tendre que buscar y revisar que tratan sobre el tema, cuando aparezcan en mi desorden de cosas, te hago el cmentario
espero te quedes mas tranquilo y los demas del foro tambien
Un abrazo
 
Bueno, yo no soy un cardiologo experto, ni mucho menos, pero por los articulos que he visto, la hipertrofia concentrica del ventriculo izquierdo (en este lado es que ocurre la mayor hipertrofia), esta asociada con los fisiculturistas que abusan de los AS (1) y los atletas de elite con entrenamiento con pesos (4). Sin embargo, esto no esta necesariamente asociado a una disfuncion cardiaca (4). Si esta asociado a un aumento de la presion arterial como consecuencia de un bombeo mas fuerte de la sangre (4).

Otro problema es la trombosis interna en el corazon, para los fisiculturistas con abuso de los AS (3).

La hipertrofia excentrica del corazon ciertamente viene como consecuencia de los ejercicios aerobicos, y si esta asociada a una menor cantidad de latidos (2) y de menor presion arterial (5), debido al mayor volumen que puede ser bombeado por latido.

Mis dos centavos :)

Ok, ahora las referencias de los numeros que puse entre parentesis:

(1) Sports Med 1999 Oct;28(4):237-44

Sports-specific adaptations and differentiation of the athlete's heart.

Urhausen A, Kindermann W.

Institute of Sports and Preventive Medicine, Department of Clinical Medicine, University of Saarland, Saarbrucken, Germany. [email protected]

Although the sports-specific adaptations and differentiation of an athlete's heart (AH) were first described 100 years ago, the condition is still an area of active debate. In clinical practice, there is often an obvious lack of basic knowledge concerning the prerequisites and well established extent of the structural and functional characteristics of an AH. Some misunderstandings arise from the somewhat misleading term 'athlete's heart' because not every athlete, even if he or she is training and competing at a very high level, develops an enlarged heart. Such a condition can only be expected after years of quantitative and qualitative demanding aerobic endurance training. Although the correlation with competitive performance of endurance events is rather low in trained athletes, the relationship between heart dimensions and ergometric performance represents an important criterion for differentiation between physiological and pathological cardiac enlargement. The assessment of measures exceeding the usual clinical limits, especially concerning volume-dependent echocardiographic parameters, also requires consideration of the strong influence of anthropometric data. The existence of a concentric left ventricular hypertrophy (LVH) in strength-trained athletes is still a topic of debate in the literature, but is rejected by most recent well-conducted trials. In our review. only bodybuilders using anabolic steroids exhibited a distinctly higher hypertrophic index compared with all other groups of endurance or strength athletes. Current unsolved issues in clinical sports medicine concern the early detection of myocardial complications in athletes exercising during infectious diseases, and the eligibility for competitive sport in cases of borderline LVH.

Publication Types:
Review
Review, tutorial

PMID: 10565550 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
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(2) J Cardiol 2001;37 Suppl 1:85-8 Related Articles, Books


Short-term heart rate variability in young athletes.

Aubert AE, Beckers F, Ramaekers D.

Laboratory of Experimental Cardiology, Department of Cardiology, University Hospital Gasthuisberg O/N, Herestr 49, 3000 Leuven, Belgium.

OBJECTIVES: The purpose of this study was to determine whether the type of training in a young population differentiates heart rate variability parameters between athlete groups and sedentary subjects. METHODS: The effect of different types of physical training on heart rate variability was evaluated in 10 aerobic trained athletes, in 7 anaerobic trained athletes, in 7 rugby players (mixed type training) and in 10 sedentary control subjects. All groups were age matched (18-34 years). Electrocardiogram tracings were recorded digitally in the supine position and standing position. Measures of heart rate variability were obtained, from both time- and frequency analysis of 10 min resting heart rate. After these tests, blood pressure was measured using an automatic inflation cuff. RESULTS: Resting heart rate was lower in aerobic and mixed type athletes compared to controls. Only aerobic athletes had evidence of increased vagal activity in the time domain compared with control subjects (increased SDNN supine, increased rMSSD supine and standing and pNN50 standing). In the frequency domain, aerobic athletes presented with both higher low-frequency and high-frequency power in the standing position and low-frequency power in the supine position compared to controls. CONCLUSIONS: It can be concluded that heart rate variability is affected by chronic exercise, especially in endurance trained athletes. This infers that especially aerobic exercising can have beneficial effects on the cardiovascular risk profile.

PMID: 11433833 [PubMed - in process]
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(3) Ann Thorac Surg 2000 Aug;70(2):658-60 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut


Ventricular thrombosis and systemic embolism in bodybuilders: etiology and management.

McCarthy K, Tang AT, Dalrymple-Hay MJ, Haw MP.

Department of Cardiac Surgery, Wessex Cardiac & Thoracic Unit, Southampton General Hospital, United Kingdom.

Increased thrombogenicity and acute embolism are well-recognized complications of chronic anabolic steroid abuse. The following cases highlight such dangers in steroid-enhanced bodybuilders who developed intracardiac thrombosis that subsequently embolized. Systemic anticoagulation and surgical thrombectomy constituted the mainstay treatment. This represents the first report of such devastating cardiovascular complications after anabolic steroid abuse and their management.

PMID: 10969698 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
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(4) Cardiology 1998 Oct;90(2):145-8 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut


Left ventricular wall thickening does occur in elite power athletes with or without anabolic steroid Use.

Dickerman RD, Schaller F, McConathy WJ.

Department of Biomedical Sciences, University of North Texas Health Science Center, Fort Worth, Tex., USA.

Reports on the occurrence of left ventricular wall thickening in resistance-trained athletes have rejected the possibility for this physiological adaptation to occur without concomitant anabolic steroid abuse. Others have concluded short bursts of arterial hypertension that occur with maximal weight lifting are not sufficient to induce left ventricular wall thickening, and left ventricular wall thickness >/=13 mm should not be found in pure resistance-trained athletes. Therefore, we examined 4 elite resistance-trained athletes by two-dimensional echocardiography. In addition, we retrospectively examined the individual left ventricular dimensions of 13 bodybuilders from our previous echocardiographic studies. All 4 elite resistance-trained athletes had left ventricular wall thicknesses beyond 13 mm. One of the elite bodybuilders has the largest left ventricular wall thickness (16 mm) ever reported in a power athlete. Retrospectively, 43% of the drug-free bodybuilders and 100% of the steroid users had left ventricular wall thickness beyond the normal range of 11 mm. In addition, 1 drug-free subject and 3 steroid users were beyond the critical mark of 13 mm. No subjects demonstrated diastolic dysfunction. In contrast to previous reports, we have demonstrated that left ventricular wall thicknesses >/=13 mm can be found routinely in elite resistance-trained athletes. The use of anabolic steroids concomitant with intensive resistance exercise does appear to augment left ventricular size without dysfunction. Anabolic steroids may accelerate left ventricular wall thickening indirectly by increasing strength, thus augmenting the pressor response.

PMID: 9778553 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
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(5) Hypertension 1999 Jun;33(6):1385-91 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut


Muscular strength training is associated with low arterial compliance and high pulse pressure.

Bertovic DA, Waddell TK, Gatzka CD, Cameron JD, Dart AM, Kingwell BA.

Alfred and Baker Medical Unit, Baker Medical Research Institute, Prahran, Australia.

Aerobic exercise training increases arterial compliance and reduces systolic blood pressure, but the effects of muscular strength training on arterial mechanical properties are unknown. We compared blood pressure, whole body arterial compliance, aortic impedance, aortic stiffness (measured by beta-index and carotid pulse pressure divided by normalized systolic expansion [Ep]), pulse wave velocity, and left ventricular parameters in 19 muscular strength-trained athletes (mean+/-SD age, 26+/-4 years) and 19 sedentary controls (26+/-5 years). Subjects were healthy, non-steroid-using, nonsmoking males, and athletes had been engaged in a strength-training program with no aerobic component for a minimum of 12 months. There was no difference in maximum oxygen consumption between groups, but handgrip strength (mean+/-SEM, 44+/-2 versus 56+/-2 kg; P<0.01) and left ventricular mass (168+/-8 versus 190+/-8 g; P<0.05) were greater in athletes. Arterial stiffness was higher in athletes, as evidenced by lower whole body arterial compliance (0.40+/-0.04 versus 0.54+/-0.04 arbitrary compliance units; P=0.01), higher aortic characteristic impedance (1.55+/-0.13 versus 1.18+/-0.08 mm Hg. s. cm-1; P<0.05), beta-index (4.6+/-0.2 versus 3.8+/-0.4; P<0. 05), and ln Ep (10.86+/-0.06 versus 10.60+/-0.08; P<0.01). Femoral-dorsalis pedis pulse wave velocity was also higher in the athletes, but carotid-femoral pulse wave velocity was not different. Furthermore, both carotid (56+/-3 versus 44+/-2 mm Hg; P<0.001) and brachial (60+/-3 versus 50+/-2 mm Hg; P<0.01) pulse pressures were higher in the athletes, but mean arterial pressure and resting heart rate did not differ between groups. These data indicate that both the proximal aorta and the leg arteries are stiffer in strength-trained individuals and contribute to a higher cardiac afterload.

PMID: 10373221 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
 
hey Bro!!!
cada vez me sorprendes mas con tus comentarios, me parece que vives pegado del internet, Mi madreeee!!!!
hahaha
agradezco mucho las referencias bobliograficas, al menos es algo concreto donde confiar, y gracias por la direccion del Swartzer, de verdad yo no lo sabia, :p
un abrazo
 
Oye Goering estoy con Muscle se ve que te pasas navegando todo el dia,de donde diablos sacas tanta informacion eheheheeh:D sigue asi para que nos las enseñes,y me encanto lo de Arnold.No lo sabia
 
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