Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below The last year I've been getting 3 hours a night of sleep if I'm lucky. It takes a shit ton of benzos to knock me out. Ive been on Xanax for 5 years now and my tolerance is sky high. I also have sleep paralysis where I'm paralyzed and half dreaming and half sleeping. My brain feels as if its in REM state, but I can see around my room and see strange, frightening dark figures. When this happens, it feels as if I'm hardly breathing, and I have to kick to wake myself because I feel like I'm suffocating. It's horrifying. I used steroids for over ten years. I took a product with DMAA unknowing what DMAA was for 4 years every day. I used ephedra when it was around. Ive used clen. I was also an opiate addict and am currently on suboxone. So to say I've put my body on a rough ride is an understatement. Could it just be the benzo addiction that is keeping me from getting any sleep or is it possibly sleep apnea?? Im 31 and not over weight. Ive had 2 sleep studies done but I didn't fall asleep during either of them and so theres no conclusive evidence of apnea. The docs have been checking my heart this previous year and are saying its fine. I snorted my pills everyday for 5 years as I was a terrible addict. With the honest information I've provided, can anyone give me an opinion as to what is wrong? The lack of sleep makes me feel like I want to kill myself.
Sleep apnea?
- Thread starter markshark
- Start date
Okay, save your karma, I have a few ideas, I'll just throw this stuff out there as it comes to me:
1) One of the documented side effects of suboxone is interference with sleep, specifically, decreased sleep. So, that's a possibility right there.
2) Were it not for their high incidence of abuse/intolerance benzos are actually one of the better sleep aids because they don't interfere with the natural sleep cycles ... unfortunately, you're abusing them. If you could discipline yourself to find a dosage you could live with, take it just once at bedtime and stay there, you'd be fine but by your own admission you're not doing that and maybe can't do that. You're going to have to figure out what to do with this problem yourself, meaning you have to choose to either go off the benzos (you will have to wean them) or whether you want to taper down to find a dosage you can achieve sleep with and STAY THERE. I've been taking .75 mg of Xanax to help me sleep for years. Once in a while I have to take an additional .25 mg, but that's it, if I can't find sleep then I throw in the towel and get up.
3) With the history of stimulants and foreign substances you might have what I have, which is screwed up cortisol. Cortisol is a weird ass hormone. I've been trying to educate myself as much as possible but it's a lot of info and cortisol and it's production are intertwined with most hormones and many neurotransmitters. It's like a giant puzzle, if hormone A is messed up, it throws hormone B out of whack which sends the wrong signal to some aspect of the HPTA axis ... do you get my point? Any one hormone could be the source of an imbalance causing multiple imbalances. Anyway, you can have messed up cortisol levels and yet your cortisol still tests normal because you're getting cortisol at the wrong time. If you get a blast of cortisol around what would be bedtime, for example, it doesn't matter how exhausted you are, your mind will be racing and sleep will elude you (which is what happens to be my problem, and I also abused stimulants throughout my late teens and 20s and I'm forced to wonder if there's a connection). I originally thought I had adrenal fatigue, maybe I did, now I'm trying to balance my cortisol levels through lifestyle and a supplement. I'm using a product by NOW Foods named Super Cortisol Support and so far I do find I'm much more relaxed in the evenings and often conk out at least briefly with absolutely no chemical assistance, which I have been unable to do for more than 18 years.
4) Insomniacs classically botch sleep studies because they can't sleep. There is a product that you can use at home which might make things easier to establish whether you actually have sleep apnea. Alternatively, got anybody who can spend the night with you and stay awake for a chunk of time and observe you? Trust me, if you have sleep apnea it's not hard to miss.
5) The sleep paralysis is a major issue on a lot of levels. Whether you're aware of it or not it creates anxiety around bedtime, which is only going to make it harder to sleep. Part of your problem could actually be your current state of sleep deprivation. I'm not big on WebMD but you might want to look at this: Sleep Paralysis Symptoms, Treatment, and Causes As you can see, you've already got a couple of conditions that could be contributing to or exacerbating the situation. It's a dog chasing it's tail.
So what can you do?
1. Start teaching yourself what "good sleep hygiene" is. Just Google the term and read, then put the recommendations into practice. Our bodies respond to habituation, you need to develop healthy sleep habits and a bedtime routine and you have to be absolutely religious about sticking to this schedule. You also need to provide yourself a comfortable sleep environment, that usually means the bedroom should be cool (under 70 is ideal, actually), very dark and very quiet. If that means you buy blackout curtains and earplugs, so be it.
2. Make sure your nutrition is healthy, don't eat too close to bedtime, don't consume caffeine within four to six hours of bedtime (frankly, I only allow myself coffee in the morning, that's the only caffeine I have in a day, if I have caffeine after 12:00 sometimes it can cause me problems). Realize you're an insomniac, you have to make certain concessions to your problem. It seems insane to have to live your life around doing something that others take for granted but ... well, think about how a diabetic has to live their life around their sugar levels.
4. Believe it or not, a brief (20 minute only) mid afternoon nap around 6 to 8 hours after you wake up can help you sleep, even if all you do is take 15 minutes and close your eyes.
5. Try meditation, seriously. The easiest way to start is to find some guided meditations you can listen to, there are many free ones available on the internet. Here's some sites you can use to get started: Audio Dharma - Guided Meditations
Listen to the Meditation Oasis Podcast | Meditation Oasis
6. You should be taking a really good multivitamin/multimineral supplement. You also might want to consider the supplement I mentioned for cortisol (I take one first thing in the morning and two in the late afternoon).
7. Think about discussing your benzo addiction with someone. Also think about talking about your insomnia, chronic sleep deprivation, sleep paralysis and suboxone in connection to each other.
8. Think about dealing with your anxiety issues. I remembered you from prior postings and looked you up. I can't help but wonder if you've got some underlying psychological issues. By this I mean something like PTSD. See, in the final analysis my insomnia stems from my PTSD which came from being an abused child. I can remember having difficulty falling asleep from the time I was a little kid (what kid has that problem to the point that they remember it into adulthood?) I have social anxiety, depression, panic disorders, the whole ball of wax. Unfortunately this connection wasn't explained to me until quite recently and I have neither the time, energy nor financial means to address the problem. Speaking as someone who is 18 years older than you I'm telling you don't do what I did and "live with it". It Won't Get Better as You Get Older. How can a problem like this end if it's only going to get worse? You got a lot of life ahead of you, be kind to yourself and get yourself healthy in both body and mind.
Oh, BTW, my husband has sleep apnea, fucker sleeps like a log. His head hits the pillow and he's out within five minutes. I hate him. The point being, however, that he falls right to sleep and his awakenings are not conscious. In fact most people I know with sleep apnea have zero problems falling asleep, it's the people around them who suffer with their snoring and gasping and frequent shifting around.
1) One of the documented side effects of suboxone is interference with sleep, specifically, decreased sleep. So, that's a possibility right there.
2) Were it not for their high incidence of abuse/intolerance benzos are actually one of the better sleep aids because they don't interfere with the natural sleep cycles ... unfortunately, you're abusing them. If you could discipline yourself to find a dosage you could live with, take it just once at bedtime and stay there, you'd be fine but by your own admission you're not doing that and maybe can't do that. You're going to have to figure out what to do with this problem yourself, meaning you have to choose to either go off the benzos (you will have to wean them) or whether you want to taper down to find a dosage you can achieve sleep with and STAY THERE. I've been taking .75 mg of Xanax to help me sleep for years. Once in a while I have to take an additional .25 mg, but that's it, if I can't find sleep then I throw in the towel and get up.
3) With the history of stimulants and foreign substances you might have what I have, which is screwed up cortisol. Cortisol is a weird ass hormone. I've been trying to educate myself as much as possible but it's a lot of info and cortisol and it's production are intertwined with most hormones and many neurotransmitters. It's like a giant puzzle, if hormone A is messed up, it throws hormone B out of whack which sends the wrong signal to some aspect of the HPTA axis ... do you get my point? Any one hormone could be the source of an imbalance causing multiple imbalances. Anyway, you can have messed up cortisol levels and yet your cortisol still tests normal because you're getting cortisol at the wrong time. If you get a blast of cortisol around what would be bedtime, for example, it doesn't matter how exhausted you are, your mind will be racing and sleep will elude you (which is what happens to be my problem, and I also abused stimulants throughout my late teens and 20s and I'm forced to wonder if there's a connection). I originally thought I had adrenal fatigue, maybe I did, now I'm trying to balance my cortisol levels through lifestyle and a supplement. I'm using a product by NOW Foods named Super Cortisol Support and so far I do find I'm much more relaxed in the evenings and often conk out at least briefly with absolutely no chemical assistance, which I have been unable to do for more than 18 years.
4) Insomniacs classically botch sleep studies because they can't sleep. There is a product that you can use at home which might make things easier to establish whether you actually have sleep apnea. Alternatively, got anybody who can spend the night with you and stay awake for a chunk of time and observe you? Trust me, if you have sleep apnea it's not hard to miss.
5) The sleep paralysis is a major issue on a lot of levels. Whether you're aware of it or not it creates anxiety around bedtime, which is only going to make it harder to sleep. Part of your problem could actually be your current state of sleep deprivation. I'm not big on WebMD but you might want to look at this: Sleep Paralysis Symptoms, Treatment, and Causes As you can see, you've already got a couple of conditions that could be contributing to or exacerbating the situation. It's a dog chasing it's tail.
So what can you do?
1. Start teaching yourself what "good sleep hygiene" is. Just Google the term and read, then put the recommendations into practice. Our bodies respond to habituation, you need to develop healthy sleep habits and a bedtime routine and you have to be absolutely religious about sticking to this schedule. You also need to provide yourself a comfortable sleep environment, that usually means the bedroom should be cool (under 70 is ideal, actually), very dark and very quiet. If that means you buy blackout curtains and earplugs, so be it.
2. Make sure your nutrition is healthy, don't eat too close to bedtime, don't consume caffeine within four to six hours of bedtime (frankly, I only allow myself coffee in the morning, that's the only caffeine I have in a day, if I have caffeine after 12:00 sometimes it can cause me problems). Realize you're an insomniac, you have to make certain concessions to your problem. It seems insane to have to live your life around doing something that others take for granted but ... well, think about how a diabetic has to live their life around their sugar levels.
4. Believe it or not, a brief (20 minute only) mid afternoon nap around 6 to 8 hours after you wake up can help you sleep, even if all you do is take 15 minutes and close your eyes.
5. Try meditation, seriously. The easiest way to start is to find some guided meditations you can listen to, there are many free ones available on the internet. Here's some sites you can use to get started: Audio Dharma - Guided Meditations
Listen to the Meditation Oasis Podcast | Meditation Oasis
6. You should be taking a really good multivitamin/multimineral supplement. You also might want to consider the supplement I mentioned for cortisol (I take one first thing in the morning and two in the late afternoon).
7. Think about discussing your benzo addiction with someone. Also think about talking about your insomnia, chronic sleep deprivation, sleep paralysis and suboxone in connection to each other.
8. Think about dealing with your anxiety issues. I remembered you from prior postings and looked you up. I can't help but wonder if you've got some underlying psychological issues. By this I mean something like PTSD. See, in the final analysis my insomnia stems from my PTSD which came from being an abused child. I can remember having difficulty falling asleep from the time I was a little kid (what kid has that problem to the point that they remember it into adulthood?) I have social anxiety, depression, panic disorders, the whole ball of wax. Unfortunately this connection wasn't explained to me until quite recently and I have neither the time, energy nor financial means to address the problem. Speaking as someone who is 18 years older than you I'm telling you don't do what I did and "live with it". It Won't Get Better as You Get Older. How can a problem like this end if it's only going to get worse? You got a lot of life ahead of you, be kind to yourself and get yourself healthy in both body and mind.
Oh, BTW, my husband has sleep apnea, fucker sleeps like a log. His head hits the pillow and he's out within five minutes. I hate him. The point being, however, that he falls right to sleep and his awakenings are not conscious. In fact most people I know with sleep apnea have zero problems falling asleep, it's the people around them who suffer with their snoring and gasping and frequent shifting around.
I'm going to list meditation aids that I use that may be of use to you. Its interesting that those idiots at the fda and dea think that if a substance is legal its safe. Idiots. That shit pseudoephedrine when stacked w/caffeine is also nasty. Funny thing is go ahead and ban ephedra u can just pick it, it grows wild in the american southwest.
Anyway, isochronic tones, binaural beats may help w/sleep. Studying of chess probs and games generally will put anyone to sleep if done long enough. Read the book of Mormon long enough you go out like a light, a very very strange book. I do all this as needed. Also get some high gauss magnets good luck staying awake w/a high gauss magnet on your wrist. Again this shit probably sounds nuts but I work in a hospital wher there's always crazy shit going on w/both patients and the administrative fuckers, so gotta cope and I don't drink alcohol because it funds the government and is a stupid drug. Alcohol is legal but steroids r illegal. Wtf?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using EliteFitness
Anyway, isochronic tones, binaural beats may help w/sleep. Studying of chess probs and games generally will put anyone to sleep if done long enough. Read the book of Mormon long enough you go out like a light, a very very strange book. I do all this as needed. Also get some high gauss magnets good luck staying awake w/a high gauss magnet on your wrist. Again this shit probably sounds nuts but I work in a hospital wher there's always crazy shit going on w/both patients and the administrative fuckers, so gotta cope and I don't drink alcohol because it funds the government and is a stupid drug. Alcohol is legal but steroids r illegal. Wtf?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using EliteFitness
Thank you so much for the reply. You're hitting each nail on the head pretty closely on everything. I believe you about the cortisol because that's what I'm dealing with. I lay down at 11 and fall asleep at 4, wake at 530 after a hideous nightmare, go down stairs terrified, and take my meds then go back upstairs. I do meditate and am into something called ASMR which is relaxing sounds and role plays. It can be found all over youtube, but yes this is what I'm working with. I'm also using 25mg a day of dbol right now because I got it for free. I don't know if I should stop or not. My guess is yes
If you can't sleep properly you're not doing your body any good, anyway, no matter what you take. No rest = no growth.
Look, get yourself healthy. If you think cortisol is a problem then heavy duty, meaning over 40 minutes per day -- workouts and any kind of AAS is just exacerbating the problem. And if you workout within about four hours of what you hope to be bedtime that is also going to contribute to sleep problems (remember what I said about living around your insomnia like other people live around something like diabetes. It is what it is, I don't care if other people can do it, insomniacs just can't) ... and honestly, if the only time you can workout is less than 4 hours before bedtime, give it a rest until you can get some rest. I'm telling you, inadequate recovery is just going to make things worse.
Order a couple of bottles of the cortisol stuff (I pay $15.39 for it from Swanson vitamins NOW Foods Super Cortisol Support with Relora 90 Vcaps - Swanson Health Products) Give it at least a month or two to see if there's any improvement and try to be kinder to yourself. The thing is you need to reduce physical and emotional stress. Meditation can help but if you don't have compassion to yourself and put your body in a position where it can't heal you can meditate until doomsday it won't matter a hill of beans.
Mark, I'm probably old enough to be your mother, man. I'm telling you, you really need to get your priorities straight, seriously.
Look, the human body is amazing and up to a point it can take an incredible amount of abuse but you are headed down a path that has exactly ONE outcome.
If you aren't capable of sleeping there's something very wrong with you, deal realistically with it or play denial man, your choice. How long can you keep popping Xanax? Got some sort of unlimited supply (if so, please, hook me up ...) Anyway, give yourself all the excuses on the planet but the fucking monsters in your bedroom are just going to keep calling in their buddies the longer you operate in a sleep deprived mode, I promise you that.
I also promise you that a hot body now will NOT be any sort of comfort ten years from now when you have all sorts of fucked up health problems that nobody can fix because nobody understands why you have them, and they completely ruin your quality of life.
So suck it up and do what you're gonna do, one way or another
All I can tell you is I know the choice I'd make if someone had told me what I was doing to myself when I was about 15 years younger.
Look, the human body is amazing and up to a point it can take an incredible amount of abuse but you are headed down a path that has exactly ONE outcome.
If you aren't capable of sleeping there's something very wrong with you, deal realistically with it or play denial man, your choice. How long can you keep popping Xanax? Got some sort of unlimited supply (if so, please, hook me up ...) Anyway, give yourself all the excuses on the planet but the fucking monsters in your bedroom are just going to keep calling in their buddies the longer you operate in a sleep deprived mode, I promise you that.
I also promise you that a hot body now will NOT be any sort of comfort ten years from now when you have all sorts of fucked up health problems that nobody can fix because nobody understands why you have them, and they completely ruin your quality of life.
So suck it up and do what you're gonna do, one way or another
All I can tell you is I know the choice I'd make if someone had told me what I was doing to myself when I was about 15 years younger.
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