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jagerbombme
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I lift at home so I can easily cook up some eggs or eat some chicken or tuna immedietly after lifting, will eating food do the same thing as a shake for me besides not eating all the sugar? or do i need a shake?
Shakes or Food?
- Thread starter jagerbombme
- Start date
Hey buddy you do what ever works best for you. I do not give a damn about what people always say about food being the best and shakes can not substitute. Shakes are full of nutrients just like food. I drink 4 shakes a day and may get in 2 meals and I am bigger and stronger than just about every one in my gym as well as all of the meal eating folks. I am not saying solid meals are not good but I just cannot sit there and consume all of that shit every day. I have did it in the past and I get better gains when I consume more shakes. Our body's all respond differently thats all that I am saying. I think solid food plays more of a important role when you are getting lean for a competition whether when you are bulking up.
jagerbombme said:
SgtSlaughter
New member
Shakes AND Food... PWO I have a "light" shake 50 grams whey or so in water maybe i'll splash some juice in there too...then 45-60 mintues later (i'm starving) I'll eat a big PWO meal.
and NO Shakes are NOT full of nutrients just like food. Try to live off shakes for the rest of your life...see what happens.
EDIT: ANNNNDDDD... Our body ALL respond the same when given a caloric surplus
Which is weight gain. Given the right stimuli (proper training) one will gain muscle.
The simplest reason for that: You're consuming more calories than you ate when you ate whole food.BLACKDOOG said:
and NO Shakes are NOT full of nutrients just like food. Try to live off shakes for the rest of your life...see what happens.
EDIT: ANNNNDDDD... Our body ALL respond the same when given a caloric surplus
Which is weight gain. Given the right stimuli (proper training) one will gain muscle.hmm..ive heard mixed things about this.. a lot of people would rather have a shake immediately after lifting with simple carbs to cause the insulin spike with whey protein for faster absorption..
the only time i ever have a shake is after a workout, all the rest are whole foods. to be honest, i hate the shake..id much rather make a meal to bring with me..
the only time i ever have a shake is after a workout, all the rest are whole foods. to be honest, i hate the shake..id much rather make a meal to bring with me..
jagerbombme
BANNED
thanks everyone, i use muscle milk bananna and throw a bannana in there with it, or i have a chocolate scifit which only has like 3 carbs and throw 2 fat tablespoons of natural peanut butter in with it. but i am trying to lean up so im wondering if dropping the shakes and eating just chicken, turkey, tuna, bacon n eggs will still absorb the protien i need but also starve my body of fuel and make it look for fat to burn. i've also read that fat doesn't get stored as fat, unless your eating lotsa sugar with the fat, but how much fat should i cap at a day. my one buddy who used to compete told me 70g. im talking from meat and eggs and milk fat also, not doughnuts.
SgtSlaughter
New member
70g for 200lb human... or 70grams for a 140lb human HUGE difference... i'd NEVER go by what someone else did, even if they had the same exact stats as me.jagerbombme said:
use fitday.com bro. Try a 40/30/30 ratio (Protein/Carbs/Fats) and see how that works for you. Total cals will be dependent on your weight and activity level (and metabolism...but that's hard to judge unless your lean as hell and can't put on weight)...
google: michael and kendra elias calculator
then plug in the foods you eat into www.fitday.com ...and there ya go.
Healthy fats stimulate natural testosterone production...do NOT avoid them.
Oh...and sure, you can go on an entire diet of whole foods. Why not? Probably better for you... but it's hard for some to get in all the calories they need, hence the daily Supplementation with shakes (not meal replacement) ..>SUPPLEMENT
ok...i'm spent. lol.
gettnlarge01
New member
For me a PWO shake then 1hr later a PWO meal. I even have a protein shake in the morning when I get up then 1hr later I have my first real food meal.Keep in mind it takes longer to break down solid food than it does something already in liquid form. But we are all different so you need to find what works best for you.
jagerbombme
BANNED
ok, thanks for the good info everyone
javaguru
Banned
sgtslaughter said:Shakes AND Food... PWO I have a "light" shake 50 grams whey or so in water maybe i'll splash some juice in there too...then 45-60 mintues later (i'm starving) I'll eat a big PWO meal.
The simplest reason for that: You're consuming more calories than you ate when you ate whole food.
and NO Shakes are NOT full of nutrients just like food. Try to live off shakes for the rest of your life...see what happens.
EDIT: ANNNNDDDD... Our body ALL respond the same when given a caloric surplus
I don't understand the attitude that a protein powder "isn't food." I consume 5 oz of beef daily and that is my only consistent non-powder intake of protein. Milk Isolate scores a percect 1.00 on the PCDAAS (all egg and dairy have a perfect score) is high in glutamine and relatively cheap per gram of protein. While the best quality meat (beef) scores a .92 and the lowest a .7 on the PCDAAS.
My milk protein isolate protein shakes provides me with over 100% of the USRDA of magnesium and zinc and it has NO added minerals. The US Department of Agriculture studies have found up to 2/3 of Americans ("food eaters") are deficient in those two minerals. One serving(26g P) also provides 35% USRDA for Calcium and 50% of the USRDA for Vitamin C, you could live off milk isolate and never have to worry about scurvy. Milk protein isolate is simply skim milk microfiltered to remove the lactose and spray dried, it maintains most of the mineral content of skim milk; It also keeps those microfractions intact.
Food  /fud/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[food] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. any nourishing substance that is eaten, drunk, or otherwise taken into the body to sustain life, provide energy, promote growth, etc.
SgtSlaughter
New member
Interesting read JavaG.
Personally, I've experienced MUCH better results from eating the majority of my calories from whole food.
As well as a feeling of satiety that whole food gives me... whey and water cannot.
The lack of Mag., Zinc, Calcium, Vit C can be obtained through whole foods and/or ingesting a multi-vitamin.
> 60% of Americans are overweight and most likely don't eat the proper "whole foods."
That's great that you've found protein supplementation via shakes to work out for you. It's my opinion and perogitive to vary my daily intake with whole foods that provide a feeling of satisfaction and a whole bunch of other stuff i'm not going to waste my time looking up
Personally, I've experienced MUCH better results from eating the majority of my calories from whole food.
As well as a feeling of satiety that whole food gives me... whey and water cannot.
The lack of Mag., Zinc, Calcium, Vit C can be obtained through whole foods and/or ingesting a multi-vitamin.
> 60% of Americans are overweight and most likely don't eat the proper "whole foods."
That's great that you've found protein supplementation via shakes to work out for you. It's my opinion and perogitive to vary my daily intake with whole foods that provide a feeling of satisfaction and a whole bunch of other stuff i'm not going to waste my time looking up
javaguru
Banned
I advocate taking hi GI carbs during and after your workout to create an insulin response. I think this is particularly important when "bulking."jagerbombme said:
Here is a "typical" day of eating for me, I'm not bulking but maintaining. If I were bulking I would have two servings of oatmeal in my first meal instead of oatbran. Meal five would also be a fairly high carb meal 100g of complex carbs and I would shift the other meals up for a total of eigh meals.
Meal 1: 1 Cup Blueberries, 1/3 cup oatbran 1 Milk Isolate shake (52 g protein)
Meal 2: 1 apple 1 cup broccoli 1 MI shake 2 fish oil capsules
Meal 3: Workout meal 20g BCAA 40g dextrose sip during workout
Meal 4: Post workout, Kraft mac and cheese prepared with skim milk, no margarine or butter and MI shake. Sometimes I make pancakes, or spaghetti...
Meal 5: 1 cup broccoli, 1 cup spinach, 1 apple, MI shake 3 fish oil capsules 2 tbsp flax seeds.
Meal 6: 5oz Ground sirlon 2 eggs(vegetarian fed chickens) 3 whites
Meal 7: 1 cup broccoli, 1 cup spinach MI shake 6 fish oil capsules 1 borage oil capsule.
This is my physique now;
http://photos.yahoo.com/javaguru01
javaguru
Banned
sgtslaughter said:Interesting read JavaG.
Personally, I've experienced MUCH better results from eating the majority of my calories from whole food.
As well as a feeling of satiety that whole food gives me... whey and water cannot.
The lack of Mag., Zinc, Calcium, Vit C can be obtained through whole foods and/or ingesting a multi-vitamin.
> 60% of Americans are overweight and most likely don't eat the proper "whole foods."
That's great that you've found protein supplementation via shakes to work out for you. It's my opinion and perogitive to vary my daily intake with whole foods that provide a feeling of satisfaction and a whole bunch of other stuff i'm not going to waste my time looking up
I just take issue with people claiming protein powders aren't "food" when they clearly are by definition and in many ways they are superior to meats.
I've never advocated a limited diet, one reason I consume beef everyday is because it's the highest quality meat protein and it's been nicknamed "nature's multivitamin" for a reason. I don't advocate mrp shakes because you're consuming maltodextrin and missing out on the nutrients in vegetables, fruit and whole grains. With my shakes I use vegetables, fruits and whole grains to provide the carbs othe rthan in my workout shake.
Whey is highly overrated as a protein source, it's too rapidly absorbed for general use and has low levels of glutamine and being more highly processed loses more of it's micronutrients. Milk isolate provides satiety and has a much better amino acid profile. I use vegetables and grains as carb sources and the fiber further increases satiety. I'm not a fan of malto or dextrose as carb sources unless it's around the workout.
Most vitamins use magnesium oxide which is poorly absorbed and usually no more than 10%-20% of the RDA. The USRDA for zinc is 15mg. One cup of raw broccoli florest provide .28 mg of zinc which is roughly 53 cups for the RDA. One cup of raw spinach provide .16 mg zinc which is roughly 93 cups of spinach. Oatmeal has .78g zince per 100g (120g in a cup) or 16 cups of oatmeal prepared with water. A Chicken breast has .94g of zinc requiring more than 15 to meet the USRDA for zinc. One cup tuna has 1.19 mg requiring roughly twelve cans of tuna. Now, beef is your best bet from meat sources, 3 oz of round steak has 4.07mg of zinc so 12oz would more than satisfy your zinc requirements. One staple of my diet, wheat germ, provides 14.13mg zinc and 275mg magnesium from one cup.
Here are other advantages I've found with Milk Isolate shakes over meat.
1. Convenience, it's easier to pack fruit/oatbran/ powder and a shaker bottle than have to worry about keeping meat refrigerated. There is also almost zero preperation time.
2. Cost, I can get 390g protein for about $7.00 from MI while 85g of protein from chicken breast costs $1.99. Steak is even more expensive. Tuna is slighly cheaper for the crap soy laced chuck light but I can barely stomach the stuff anymore and then there is the mercury.
3. Dietary manipulation, with less than 1 G CHO and less than 1g F per serving it's easier to get my protein and manipulate fat than even chicken breast.
4. It's easier for me to throw down six protein shakes a day than eat twelve chicken breasts.
Just my .02
gettnlarge01
New member
I count my shakes as meals because they do provide me with what I need. I take 3 shakes a day everyday but the other 7 seven meals are with solid foods. I tried the all shake diet before and didn"t get what I needed from it,my gains are better and easier to keep with what I"m doing now.
SgtSlaughter
New member
Very interesting Java... I need to look into Milk Isolate...
Whey, I thought was derived from milk...
Have a product link handy to a M.I.?
Whey, I thought was derived from milk...
Have a product link handy to a M.I.?
Sassy69
New member
Part of the discussion about whether or not protein shakes are "food" comes from when people, esp newbies, get all caught up in this thing where they think "fitness" & "diet' means replacing most of their meals w/ protein mix and removes the whole concept of balanced "nutrition". Also when we talk about "protein mix", unless you are specifically referring to a brand (and even then its not necessarily a "known" quantity), you can't say that the mix will be equivalent in nutritional value to real food. But as a general rule I'd consider real food to be the foundation of a good meal plan & protein mix to be a supplement.
jagerbombme
BANNED
interesting. i guess it's something each individual needs to toy with to get a diet that works for him/her. and yes where is this MI, throw a link brother
javaguru
Banned
javaguru
Banned
You are correct, milk is roughly 80% Casein and 20% whey and they are most commonly seperated via an acid process. This denatures both protein sources and destroys the microfractions so many articles talk about.sgtslaughter said:
http://www.proteinfactory.com
http://www.trueprotein.com
SgtSlaughter
New member
Thanks man!
What do you think of egg white protein?
(If you've done the research... I'd like to pick your brain, lol)
What do you think of egg white protein?
(If you've done the research... I'd like to pick your brain, lol)
javaguru
Banned
Whole eggs and whites have a perfect amino acid score. Most of the micronutrients are in the yolk. I actually like cooked eggs so I prefer that route. I buy the vegetarian fed chicken eggs, 25% less saturated fat and more omega 3's. I use two yolks and three whites(I use normal eggs for the whites). I really haven't looked into the specific benefits of egg protein.sgtslaughter said:
SgtSlaughter
New member
I love whole cooked eggs, I do similar except I use egg beaters (with whole eggs) out of convience and I don't like wasting yolks... crap, I wasn't specific enough...JavaGuru said:
Egg white protein Powder, is what I meant... just out of curiousity. Or is M.I. still better for all around any time of day protein?
jagerbombme
BANNED
so what is better java, the complete milk dairy isolate or just the milk protien isolate
... about the eggs also, i just use regular eggs, 2 yolks, 12 egg whites at a crack? how good is the protien from the whites themselves? is that what contains perfect amino profile?
... about the eggs also, i just use regular eggs, 2 yolks, 12 egg whites at a crack? how good is the protien from the whites themselves? is that what contains perfect amino profile?
jagerbombme
BANNED
awesome info bros, thanks
SgtSlaughter
New member
Nice bro, .. last night i placed an order (went with protein factory)... 45% egg white 45% milk pro. isolate 5% CLA powder (DAMN that's an expensive add on) and i forget what the other 5% was.Cutt29 said:
I'll let you guys know what I think of it overall after I get through most of the 3lbs
