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Quick Rant..I need your help bros..........

JKurz1

JKurz1

Banned
Here's my story.......6'2, 185 and about 8%. I'm extremely anal about my diet and feel it's necessary to do at least 20 mins of cardio 1st thing in the morning for mental purposes. I think it's because my last meal is about 5 mins before bed so I feel if I do cardio, it's kosher. So, I do it 7 days a week and train at least 5. On the other two days I do 2 sessions of cardio.....nothing but a little HIIT on the elliptical for 20 minutes, but still....my cals are most likely on the light side as the scale hasnt moved more than a couple pounds each way for awhile + my strength is stagnent. Sounds like I need a week off, but there is no way I could handle it........I just dont wanna piss this cycle away by doing too much and/or not consuming enough cals. I was at my best in college...250, around 12%, and stronger than shit mainly because I knew JACK SHIT about nutrition. We used to slam the cafe buffets, I did little cardio, and just trained balls out. Subway was the king of foods. After every session, we'd grab a footlong tuna and scarf it then go to dinner........protein shakes were of the unthinkable, as were most supplements......although we did slam phosphagain II with ice cream often.........beers on the weekends coupled with late night pizzas were of the norm.........Why dont you just go back to that? I hear often, but I'm thinking it was 5+ years ago so my metaobolism was prob through the roof. I now am a CPA and in an office all day, not walking across campus, etc.........so, what do I do? How the hell do I snap this? DOES ANYONE ELSE SIT ALL DAY ND FEEL MY PAIN?
 
It's all in your head bro....You need rest to build on your base, without knowing if your stuck at your current weight or still gaining 5-10lbs a year...it's impossible to give you advice on what you should do.

But rest and recovery are #1 even if your on.

On a bulking cycle I don't care who you are, you cannot make super gains without adding some fat. You can gain lean mass but it will be slow.

I posted on your last thread as well. You need to understand that sometimes rest and recovery aid more than any diet ect. If you never give your body time to recover...and rest you will not gain. If you do not eat like a horse you will not gain.

Souds to me like you need a professional dietitian...I know there are alot of them helping BB's and never letting the BF to get above 12%....but in my case it's a dream.

Your either ripped to the bone or naturally thin.
Or your bulking and stronger than hell.(with some 15-20% bf)
No in between....your lifts will suffer and it's the worst type of mind game you can play on yourself.
 
JKurz1 said:
Here's my story.......6'2, 185 and about 8%. I'm extremely anal about my diet and feel it's necessary to do at least 20 mins of cardio 1st thing in the morning for mental purposes. I think it's because my last meal is about 5 mins before bed so I feel if I do cardio, it's kosher. So, I do it 7 days a week and train at least 5. On the other two days I do 2 sessions of cardio.....nothing but a little HIIT on the elliptical for 20 minutes, but still....my cals are most likely on the light side as the scale hasnt moved more than a couple pounds each way for awhile + my strength is stagnent. Sounds like I need a week off, but there is no way I could handle it........I just dont wanna piss this cycle away by doing too much and/or not consuming enough cals. I was at my best in college...250, around 12%, and stronger than shit mainly because I knew JACK SHIT about nutrition. We used to slam the cafe buffets, I did little cardio, and just trained balls out. Subway was the king of foods. After every session, we'd grab a footlong tuna and scarf it then go to dinner........protein shakes were of the unthinkable, as were most supplements......although we did slam phosphagain II with ice cream often.........beers on the weekends coupled with late night pizzas were of the norm.........Why dont you just go back to that? I hear often, but I'm thinking it was 5+ years ago so my metaobolism was prob through the roof. I now am a CPA and in an office all day, not walking across campus, etc.........so, what do I do? How the hell do I snap this? DOES ANYONE ELSE SIT ALL DAY ND FEEL MY PAIN?
Click to expand...

Do all the same, eat 500more cals a day
 
you are 100% correct in EVERYTHING you said EXCEPT one..........No way do I need a professional dietician.......I know more about training,diet, etc. Than 95% of the world...that's not a toot of my own horn, but its through many,many years of reading EVERYTHING, LISTENING to everyone's opinions, and studying it..........no doubt. Now, do I need help? Yes, but more of a mentally coping form...like a shrink...lol.....in all seriousness, it's a matter of breaking my mind so I can allow myself to eat more...I swear to you, if I was active all day (work wise) I could EASILY do it......but its the whole Idea of sitting all day long and eating all day long, that I cant grasp MENTALLY! Feel me?

I've tried to tried to train in the am, but then 6pm comes around and guess what? I feel like I could go again cause I sat all day...so guess what I do? I'll admit it, I'm a mental case, but this is why I need your help!
 
Then you of all people...not tooting your horn back at ya...should know about metabolism and calorie intake? Translates to either maintaining, gaining, or loss. What's the problem?
Remember you can always cut the fat.
 
I had a long answer post here but then I realized you're talking about doing this natty.
Can't help you. At this point in your life you're looking for the fountain of youth. Your natural test levels used to take care of your food/strength requirements. Welcome to phase two and the American sedentary way of life. You could eat more and walk everywhere you go, even if it's miles, like the Europeans do. But the short answer is AS.
 
JKurz1 said:
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=358962
Click to expand...




In my opinion you would need to change your whole routine. your most likely over training. i did this split and in one months i put on over 10lbs of lean mass and droped my bodyfat by 4%.
2 on 1 off

day 1: chest x8 sets/shoulders x8/tris x8/forearms x8

day 2: legs x8/back x8/bis x8/traps x6

day3: rest then repeat.

i trained as intensly as i could and i rested only for my training partner to do his set. when i was done one exercise i went straight to the next. it took me no longer than 50 minutes each day. i did no cardio and no ab work. i lifted explosively but controlled. i did two exercises for each bodypart, and mostly compound lifts. i ate like a pig not cause i wanted to but because my body told me too!

i swear by this split. you should give it a try for 4-6 weeks and then take a week off training and you will most likely have put on some serious muscle. and if your on AS than thats even better!
 
rep range?

No way I could legs and back in the same day, so nix that........I do chest/delts and tris but it's more like 5 sets of each max...........45 min max in the gym, dont think its overtraining, but I do need a break or 2........
 
JKurz1 said:
rep range?

No way I could legs and back in the same day, so nix that........I do chest/delts and tris but it's more like 5 sets of each max...........45 min max in the gym, dont think its overtraining, but I do need a break or 2........
Click to expand...


I thought the same thing. but i realized i can do whatever i want. its all in your head. if you think you cant do it then your not gonna do it. but if you think you can then you have a way better chance of acheaving your goals. if your serious about putting on muscle and lots of it then you gotta work for it. training 6 days a week is too much. and only hitting each body part once per week is not enough. after 2 days your muscles need to be hit again. train your body more freqeuntly with less volume and high intensity.

i train like dorian yates with my last set as my working set. i gradually build up the weight and then on my last set i give it everything i got, and some. if you want to put on size you need to train like a bodybuilder not a power lifter. I bring every set to failure, and on my last set i shoot for a rep range of 6-8. i also use drop sets, rest-pause, negatives. you need to spice up your workouts and bring the intensity or you not gonna grow.

As Arnold said "Dont just lift weights, build muscle"
 
I really think you should try getting rod of your diet say for 6 weeks just eat fatty foods as well then go back to your current strict diet I bet youll be a happy man and then just repeat, I was in the same exact spot
 
Ulter said:
I had a long answer post here but then I realized you're talking about doing this natty.
Can't help you. At this point in your life you're looking for the fountain of youth. Your natural test levels used to take care of your food/strength requirements. Welcome to phase two and the American sedentary way of life. You could eat more and walk everywhere you go, even if it's miles, like the Europeans do. But the short answer is AS.
Click to expand...
430 25 minutes HIIT
530
1/2 cup oats
pc of whole wheat
1/2 can tuna salad
1 scoop whey

830
egg whites to fill 1 cup
1/2 cup oats
1 scoop whey
1/2 tub dry curd cc, some rasberries, blueberries, and 1/2 banana

1130
6oz ground beef
1 c brown rice or 6 oz yam
2c of green vegies
large salad

230
6oz chicken, , 250g of cottage cheese, tb peanut butter, scoop of whey
1/2 banana

4pm train

530
1/2 cup oats, 1 scoop whey


830 Bedtime
250g cottage cheese, 22oz of skim, scoop of casein, 3-4 handfulls of nuts.............


starting Feb 1, I got a cycle planned out...won't be natty...so, U-man you think I need to change my training rouitne? I need a 45 min. max session, let me have it........diet revamp?
 
its all mental..

ifyou say you learned a lot from this site then you obviously know what you need to do..

cut back on the am cardio.. do some light cardio after you lift while drinking a protein shake.. not first thing in the am

eat more .. eat until the scale moves up anda bit of fat comes with it.

start a log.. write down everything you want to do TOMORROW.. then as you eat/train write it down and see where you screwed up.. ie missed a meal, missed a workout.. did to much cardio.. then write down why you screwed up.. just keep on top of this log and within 2 weeks you will be doing what you want if you are truly DEDICATED..

good luck bro
 
Judo Tom said:
its all mental..

ifyou say you learned a lot from this site then you obviously know what you need to do..

cut back on the am cardio.. do some light cardio after you lift while drinking a protein shake.. not first thing in the am

eat more .. eat until the scale moves up anda bit of fat comes with it.

start a log.. write down everything you want to do TOMORROW.. then as you eat/train write it down and see where you screwed up.. ie missed a meal, missed a workout.. did to much cardio.. then write down why you screwed up.. just keep on top of this log and within 2 weeks you will be doing what you want if you are truly DEDICATED..

good luck bro
Click to expand...

Here's my BIGGEST problem..........my appetite. I've tried it all, eq (few years ago) b-12, no carbonated bevs, etc and NOTHING works. So, some reccomended a bowl of MJ to help out. So, I train, slam my shake, come home, shower get ready for the next day, etc and have a bowl. Does this work? Absolutely! One problem, it makes me tired as all hell. So, I have a bowl of peanuts, a huge casein frosted shake, and a half tub of dry curd cottage cheese and boy does it taste damn good.......then, I find that I crash wihin 10 minutes........so, I feel it necessary to do cardio 1st thing for mental stability cause I guess I feel guilty for eating so much so late. So, I'm stuck between a rock and hard place.........
 
Like I said, the geniuses are all on the AF training board. But I will give you MHO. You're not doing enough cardio to take away any appreciable mass. It clears your head and gets your metabolism started to ensure an appetite later, so leave it.
Stop training for a week and then come back with an entirely different routine. You don't have to switch muscle groupings that work but do them in a reverse order at 5x5 and heavier weight. As Curious George has posted on our board. What you're doing now is "detraining" your muscles. And they are going to hold their set point.
After you've done this for 3-4 weeks go back to what you're doing now and in the 3rd week you should notice you've gone up on everything and gained some weight. Granted you're not going to put on more than 3 pounds of LBM naturally in 8 weeks but you get off this plateau. Like these guys are saying much of this is in your head. Changing everything after time off inspires your head as well as causing muscle growth. And don't stress about the time it takes. Just let it happen.
 
Ulter said:
Like I said, the geniuses are all on the AF training board. But I will give you MHO. You're not doing enough cardio to take away any appreciable mass. It clears your head and gets your metabolism started to ensure an appetite later, so leave it.
Stop training for a week and then come back with an entirely different routine. You don't have to switch muscle groupings that work but do them in a reverse order at 5x5 and heavier weight. As Curious George has posted on our board. What you're doing now is "detraining" your muscles. And they are going to hold their set point.
After you've done this for 3-4 weeks go back to what you're doing now and in the 3rd week you should notice you've gone up on everything and gained some weight. Granted you're not going to put on more than 3 pounds of LBM naturally in 8 weeks but you get off this plateau. Like these guys are saying much of this is in your head. Changing everything after time off inspires your head as well as causing muscle growth. And don't stress about the time it takes. Just let it happen.
Click to expand...

SOunds good...I've tried many different routines with all good results.....can you give me a routine that you would reccomend?
 
I couldnt find where the newb registers..........my computer screen doesnt show the image to well....too dark........
 
Hey jkurz....I have seen you on the training board of EF.

It seems to me there are a lot of things working here. You are doing cardio 7 days a week, you are training 5 days a week and you are doing a shitload of volume in your workouts. In order to put on weight, the calories consumed must be more than the calories spent. It sounds like you are not only not feeding yourself enough, you are overtraining with your volume....not to mention doing a million sets of shrugs.....a million sets of chest work and only a couple sets of squats.

In my opinion, you just need to get back to the basics. Madcow posted several times Bill Starr's 5x5 program from a mod on meso-rx. He explains the 5x5 well and it might be something you should look into.

What Ulter was talking about was detraining. What happens is your body adapts to a certain stimuli. When doing the same load or rep scheme for so long, your body no longer is forced to adapt and it actually decreases the gains in which you have made. I was talking to Ulter about that a couple of days ago.

Another thing, your body will not let you try and max out on a weight for more than 2 or 3 weeks in a row. Your central nervous system will shut that down and not allow it.

It sounds to me like you need to stick to the basics of squats, deadlifts, good mornings, chins, rows, incline and flat press, military press, leg curls and dips. All the extra isolation work that you have been throwing in there probably had made you sore but has not done that good towards growing muscle.

Eat Eat Eat. You are tall and lean. You need to understand that it is hard to gain muscle without gaining a little bit of fat. With your metabolism raising from the cardio and lack of calories....you are probably breaking down muscle growth.

Remember this*
When your body is not getting adequate calories from your diet, it will search elswhere to nourish it. You don't have a lot of bodyfat to begin with, so where is it going to find it? Stored fat? Nope! Glucose in the muscle cells? Nope....You have already spent all that doing cardio and working out. Protein/muscle cells? Yep! Protein can be broken down by the body into ketones and carbs. You are doing all that hard work in the gym for nothing! It's a waste!

I hope this gets through to you how important eating and not overtraining is. Here is the post that madcow refers to often about Bill Starr's 5x5. It is a start for you. Notice how low the volume is and also notice how the weights go up when the body adapts to the previous weight.
http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/showthread.php?t=12

If I can help anymore, check us out at AF.
 
jkurz1:

if you want to put on mass, then your gonna need alot more carbs than that. oatmeal is a slow-burning cabohydrate and therefore is not good imediately after workout. after workout you need simple carbs like sugar, white breads and rice. glucose is the fastest form of carbohydrate that enters the blood stream. it boosts protein synthesis thru the roof. you should take in about 25% of your daily carbs after an intense workout. carbs have to first replenish depleted glycogen levels before they are stored as body fat. after training and when you wake up is when your glycogen levels are the lowest, and therfore you need to "carb up" at these times.
and youll need to bump up the protein. instead of one scoop take two each shake. glutamine and creatine are a must for packing on size. glutamine somehow promotes growth by increasing the hydration state of muscle cells. it also promotes protein synthesis. creatine increases strengh and size by pumping water into your muscles, this makes them expand and the long term effect is permanent growth. glutamine: 5g breakfast/after training/before bed
creatine: 5g before training/after training

also take in 20-25% of your daily calories at breakfast. when you wake up your glycogen levels are at there lowest and your cortisol levels are high. eat lots of carbs and protein to snap out of this catabolic state. slow burning carbs are best here like oatmeal or buckwheat pankakes.

these are my opinions after a few years of research and fuckin' around in the gym.
im 21, 5'10" 193 lbs 11% bf. 2 months ago i was 180 lbs with 21%bodyfat. ive put on around 30 lbs of lean mass in the last 2 months. i did this naturaly( my first cycle will be 2 weeks). I was out of shape since i was a kid, so i researched like crazy and developed a plan. and that plan worked like crazy!
i hope this helps you out a bit cause it helped me! Get JACKED!
 
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