Post Cycle Tx...The Truth

[colt1911]

I am not new here.... just back after being gone (activated) USMC for over a year. Anyway. Just when I thought I understood I am now reading that so many people have such completely opposite oppinions on post cycle tx. I don't think anyone will dispute that gear such as Test, fina, winny, d-bol, eq, deca, ect. will work to help you gain muscle and increase strength. Why after years and years of learning and science, can't people agree that certain drugs post cycle help you normalize your system and increase natural test levels? I understand and appreciate different oppinions on different drugs. However, isn't there some truth to what works and what doesn't based on science and actual experience to know what works and what doesn't. I have heard some folks post that taking clomid isn't good because of a few sides like depression, ect. Well hell look at the side effects of other drugs that we take and that doesn't stop us. Test has sides but most would agree that it is very helpful in building muscle when working out and is worth the sides or we wouldn't do it. Can some of you serious guys help some of us that are learning to do what is effective post cycle. I think if everyone who knows what they are talking about would list the top 3-4 drugs to take post cycle and for how long then maybe alot of people reading this would greatly benefit from there experience and would help for all of us to grow big and stay that way. Thanks for reading...

----------------------------
0311 USMC

 

[Nelson Montana]

Two reasons: We're learning more all the time. So even the constants about drugs that work to put on muscle aren't applicable. Five years ago, everyone wanted deca. Knowing what we know about it now, it's at the bottom of the list for a lot of people.

The other thing is, everyone's different. Most the available information from years back was based on very limited study, limted personal experience of men like Dan Duchaine, and limited research. Today, more and more people are coming forward and saying "Wait a minute...that accepted point of view isn't working for me."

One more thing. Post cycle protocol is relivively new. Fifteen years ago , there was no such thing except for "tapering." We now realize, a lot of what was considered good, ain't so good. And some things such as herbal therepy is proving itself benificial. There's still a lot to learn.

 

[colt1911]

Right... I understand that... I guess I was wondering what people are most commonly using and for how long and if somebody knows from actual experience of what feels like it works. I have heard of Tribulis along with clomid or arimidex. Bump for people to post what they do post cycle based on what works for them.

 

[JackAssman]

I did Clomid with Zinc and Maca and felt nothing. I started Tribulus at 2 grams a day after Clomid and Maca and found that it brought my boys back in just a few days. And damn, my loads are huge and I walk around with a chubb all day.

 

[Silent Method]

There is one constant here:

- Different people react differently to different things.



That being said, there are some things that work for a lot of people seeking a specific result. They may not be optimal, and they may do absolutely nothing for some. But, like deca, they might just be gold for some.

Encouraging our community to seek answers in light of these variables is necessary.

However, proclaiming that anyone using a particular drug or therapy method has got it all wrong is ignorant.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Originally posted by Silent Method
However, proclaiming that anyone using a particular drug or therapy method has got it all wrong is ignorant. [/B]

............................................

That's not necessarily true. There are lots of harmful drugs used by lots of people who think it's fine and dandy to do so.

 

[speller]

i personally went through the same dilemma as you. in the past i have always used clomid with hcg. it was only a little while back i examined the "extreme" side effects i experienced. these included complete loss of libido and wacky (to say the least) mood swings coupled with depression.
further poof of my negative experiences was the fact that generally speaking i have an extremely high libido (i would fuck a donkey if it looked at me the right way!) - joking. anyway you get the point. about 4 or 5 days into the clomid i could not get a hard on for the life of me, and the ones i did get were chubby at best. this was a far cry from my 24/7 erections. okay enough about my dick, so i decided to stop clomid and within 5 days the big guy was back and ready to assassinate my girlfriend.
the point being the clomid killed my dick and sex drive in the process.
this last cycle i went without the clomid (i will list what i took at bottom) and i was as hard as a rock the entire time. now that i think about it, i have a hard on right now, i dont even notice it anymore! - again joking.
i had my blood work done both times, after the cycle.
with clomid - levels were just above baseline acceptable levels
without clomid - levels were healthy and where they should be.
first to address you question - why are we straying from what we have always known works. well, whats best today is not always best tomorrow. people took clomid because know one ever knew any better. personally i took clomid because people i knew that did crank took clomid when they were done, so why should i be any different. now i bet if i told those very same people i know to take what i took post - they would be telling people not to take clomid - remember word of mouth is based on what someone else has experienced, and they may not have pursued all avenues. and unless you try both ways "clomid and without" clomid i really dont think that you have the right to tell people what to do.
heres an example.
you may think that clomid works for you because you get "X" results from it. but what you dont realize is that if you tried it without you would get "Y" results which are greater than "X". for people to say 'well all this talk about not taking clomid is shit and ill stick with what works for me" unless you try both ways how do you know what works best for you??
to address you second comment about people worrying about the side effects from clomid and not carrying about the sides from juice. with juice i never see any sides. if they are prevalent they are internally and as bad as it sounds "out of site out of mind" right?? (i do always get blood work done post) with clomid the sides are severe for myself and it attacks my most valuable asset - my cock.
people dont care about the sides from juice because they cant see them - besides some acne. as soon as you fuck with a mans manhood - hes pissed , and scared.
its the same with smoking how can anyone possibly want to start smoking or continue with all the health risks we now know??
sorry for all the ranting - just a very in-depth point you bring up.
my post cycle:
avena sativa
zinc
magnesium
B1 - thiamine
B12 injectable
hcg

 

[Themachine01]

I am wondering if there are those that still believe in and use tapering?

 

[Lift Chief]

i personally went through the same dilemma as you. in the past i have always used clomid with hcg. it was only a little while back i examined the "extreme" side effects i experienced. these included complete loss of libido and wacky (to say the least) mood swings coupled with depression.
further poof of my negative experiences was the fact that generally speaking i have an extremely high libido (i would fuck a donkey if it looked at me the right way!) - joking. anyway you get the point. about 4 or 5 days into the clomid i could not get a hard on for the life of me, and the ones i did get were chubby at best. this was a far cry from my 24/7 erections. okay enough about my dick, so i decided to stop clomid and within 5 days the big guy was back and ready to assassinate my girlfriend.
the point being the clomid killed my dick and sex drive in the process.
this last cycle i went without the clomid (i will list what i took at bottom) and i was as hard as a rock the entire time. now that i think about it, i have a hard on right now, i dont even notice it anymore! - again joking.
i had my blood work done both times, after the cycle.
with clomid - levels were just above baseline acceptable levels
without clomid - levels were healthy and where they should be.
first to address you question - why are we straying from what we have always known works. well, whats best today is not always best tomorrow. people took clomid because know one ever knew any better. personally i took clomid because people i knew that did crank took clomid when they were done, so why should i be any different. now i bet if i told those very same people i know to take what i took post - they would be telling people not to take clomid - remember word of mouth is based on what someone else has experienced, and they may not have pursued all avenues. and unless you try both ways "clomid and without" clomid i really dont think that you have the right to tell people what to do.
heres an example.
you may think that clomid works for you because you get "X" results from it. but what you dont realize is that if you tried it without you would get "Y" results which are greater than "X". for people to say 'well all this talk about not taking clomid is shit and ill stick with what works for me" unless you try both ways how do you know what works best for you??
to address you second comment about people worrying about the side effects from clomid and not carrying about the sides from juice. with juice i never see any sides. if they are prevalent they are internally and as bad as it sounds "out of site out of mind" right?? (i do always get blood work done post) with clomid the sides are severe for myself and it attacks my most valuable asset - my cock.
people dont care about the sides from juice because they cant see them - besides some acne. as soon as you fuck with a mans manhood - hes pissed , and scared.
its the same with smoking how can anyone possibly want to start smoking or continue with all the health risks we now know??
sorry for all the ranting - just a very in-depth point you bring up.
my post cycle:
avena sativa
zinc
magnesium
B1 - thiamine
B12 injectable
hcg

What were the dosages you used?

 

[Themachine01]

I have not found clomid to be very beneficial to myself either, as speller explained. heres what Im getting at, back in the day tapering was the method believed to work, today it is clomid. if there are many bros that have used clomid and know that it didnt work for them, yet there are many that still use it, why is that I rarely ever see anyone taper anymore.

 

[Nelson Montana]

i had my blood work done both times, after the cycle.
with clomid - levels were just above baseline acceptable levels
without clomid - levels were healthy and where they should be.
first to address you question - why are we straying from what we have always known works. well, whats best today is not always best tomorrow. people took clomid because know one ever knew any better.



Ahem...

 

[colt1911]

I read this article after reading posts about post cycle. Have you or anyone heard of this herb tongkat ali?

Testosterone levels are determined by a series of glands, starting with the hypothalamus and the pituitary gland deep inside the head. These glands receive signals, which contain information on what the actual testosterone levels are throughout the body. The sex hormones (androgens and estrogens) themselves give these signals. If levels are high, the signal is to lower them by stopping the body's own production. This is called "negative feedback".

If there is no negative feedback, the pituitary releases gonadotropin-releasing hormone, which in turn stimulates the production of gonadotropin. Gonadotropin, in men, stimulates the testicular Leydig cells to produce testosterone.

The smart approach is to intercept the negative feedback to the hypothalamus and pituitary gland. This will then result into the body producing higher testosterone levels all by itself. There will be no penile and testicular shrinkage. Rather the opposite. Because the testes are in full testosterone production mode, they will increase in size.

There are three pharmaceutical components by which this interception of negative feedback can be achieved, one synthetic and two herbal ones. The synthetic one is clomiphene, which, however, can have a negative impact on liver function.

The two herbal medications that raise testosterone are the Eastern European and Indian plant tribulus terrestis, and the Southeast Asian tongkat ali (eurycoma longifolia by scientific name, pasak bumi in Indonesia).

Tribulus terrestis has been around in bodybuilding for quite some time. Tongkat ali is only now catching on.

An advantage of tongkat ali over tribulus terrestis is that tongkat ali seems to be more powerful in enhancing sexual function as well as muscle growth. There are also a larger number of other health benefits attributes to tongkat ali than there are to tribulus terrestis.

In Southeast Asia, primarily Malaysia, it is as widely used as sexual stimulant as Viagra in the US. However, while Viagra only works on abdominal enzymes, tongkat ali's route of action is by increasing testosterone.

As it's pro-sexual effect is stronger than the one of tribulus terrestis, it can be assumed that it is also more powerful in increasing testosterone. Therefore, tongkat ali has great potential in bodybuilding.

 

[Nelson Montana]

I tried tongkat ali and it did nothing for me. There may be something to it, just like there's something to tribulus, but avena sativa and maca blows it away.

 

[Silent Method]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Silent Method
However, proclaiming that anyone using a particular drug or therapy method has got it all wrong is ignorant. [/B]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

............................................

That's not necessarily true. There are lots of harmful drugs used by lots of people who think it's fine and dandy to do so.

I sould have phrased that statement differently. It was meant to be a conditional statement. Sure, using crack to reduce blood preasure is a pretty concrete example of someone who'd "have it all wrong." However, in keeping with the drive of this thread, clomid for post cycle recovery may work just dandy for some people.

 

[Triple J]

I tried tongkat ali and it did nothing for me.

ditto