Pledge of Allegiance IS Unconstitutional!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JohnnyO]

Didn't the Puritians have GOD in school? Look what happened to them. Oh, what a peaceful society, let's crush someone to death under a big slab of concrete for being different. Not exactly the smartest peanuts in the bag. Cotton Mather even wrote books on teaching and raising children .. best sellers today aren't they?

 

[curling]

Jonny, please explain what you are talking about. Because I have never seen in the Bible where it says to kill people under big slabs of concrete. Please show me that verse. Second, what did cottom mathers teach. Third did you know that private Christians home schools totally out test the piece gov't ran school. When are people going to wake up and realize the gov't sucks at everything they do except the military and even then the only reason it does good is because of the private sector. We need to stop having the govt teach our kids because the gov't for the most part are dumbasses.

 

[Train Harder]

What the fuck is so funny about Maryland.

 

[GX94]

First let's define religion: 1 a : the state of a religious b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

If we remove God from the pledge we are still supporting a religion, the secular or atheist religion. Yes, if you read the definition, atheism is a religion. These people truly believe and have faith that there is no God. So what have they done here? The court has traded one religion for another, which is still in violation of the constitution by the courts interpitation. What this comes down to is a lawyer in the most liberal state in the union has pulled a publicity stunt for his own gain at the expense of our country. This is indeed a free country where people can worship as they please, but the United States is a fundamentally Christian country just as Afghanistan is a fundamentally Muslim country. If the pledge offends someone, then don't say it. But these people need to remember that this is a Christian country and if they don’t like it, they need to go to a country of their choice that is predominately their religion.

Anyway, all of this is really immaterial. The senate has voted 99-0 against the ruling, which clearly shows that you atheist freaks have a long way to go if you plan to change our country.

GX

 

[rotovibe]

in addressing the God influence in our government...

We have to understand that we all live under a moral law. Atheist, post-modern thinkers, relativists must answer this question… can we run an effective government on subjective criteria? Probably not…because someone’s morals may be different from another person’s. If you purport relativist laws who will abide by them? I don’t have to. What if killing your child is a moral imparative for me? Would you hate me or respect my views?

Society runs on moral standards, I don’t care who you are or what you believe you abide by them. Man didn’t create them…psychopaths have admitted guilt and wrong doing on several occasions…even THEY are atune to these STANDARDS.

What our ancestors realized is that no man is fit to set a standard law. Man is fallable. They must look towards a governing authority for influence and pattern their articles to that standard. That standard happens to be the CHRISTIAN GOD and His revelations through a collective of manuscripts called the septuagint, and later the BIBLE.

America was patterned after Roman republica. Where the Romans failed is in their lack of a MORAL STANDARD which led to the demise of the empire. Germanian tribal raids only aided in the downfall. Theocracy doesn’t work, history has proven that.
That is also where socialism failed.

So in essence, our governmental system is based on Moral absolutes (don’t kill, steal, etc…) which so happens to be influenced by the christian God. And rightly so.

IF THERE IS A MORAL LAW. THERE IS A MORAL LAW GIVER.

Where has our society turned for the worst? Take a guess…

Governments have to be run with absolutes, that’s how you govern. You have to be JUST, that is the reason for incarceration and execution for wrong doing. If we dessolve these absolutes we wouldn’t have any basis for a functioning government.

IMO, quibbling over mandates such as wether or not to say “under God” is not the issue.

Dying for our country, as honorable as that is, isn’t the issue either. Believe me, I am very greatful for the personal sacrifice that each of you committed to give someone like me freedom in this country.

The issue at hand is important enough for the government to address. I don’t think this country’s problems (even the world) can be fixed through government mandates. It has to start with the individual. It all leads to those MORAL ABSOLUTES. The government can only pass laws that will potentially offend people, it will always do that. In order to fix our present situation is to examine those MORAL ABSOLUTES and their application in our lives. It is how we raise our kids. It’s how we treat our wives and husbands. And to perpetuate those absolutes…

Atheism cannot run America, relativist theories will not run this country.

Please, I realize that this is a bit long-winded but if you got this far I welcome any questions or opinions that we can discuss. Atheism, any eastern religion, agnosticism, I would love to discuss apologetics and philosphy with you. If there are any legitimate questions, you can PM me. If you want to flame, just post a reply

 

[HansNZ]

I find it extraordinary the way church goers think that religion = morality or that you have to believe in God to be an ethical person.

 

[rotovibe]

HansNZ?
Where do you get your morals and ethics?

 

[JohnnyO]

Cotton Mather was a school master / minister in New England in the 1600's, when God was really in the public schools in MA and surrounding areas. Published many books on raising children and how to discover "witches." Giles Corey was "pressed" (crushed) to death for calling the religious system silly and refusing to participate (refused to plead guilty or innocent) so they killed the "witch" anyway.

 

[plornive]

First let's define religion: 1 a : the state of a religious b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : CONSCIENTIOUSNESS
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

If we remove God from the pledge we are still supporting a religion, the secular or atheist religion. Yes, if you read the definition, atheism is a religion. These people truly believe and have faith that there is no God. So what have they done here? The court has traded one religion for another, which is still in violation of the constitution by the courts interpitation. What this comes down to is a lawyer in the most liberal state in the union has pulled a publicity stunt for his own gain at the expense of our country. This is indeed a free country where people can worship as they please, but the United States is a fundamentally Christian country just as Afghanistan is a fundamentally Muslim country. If the pledge offends someone, then don't say it. But these people need to remember that this is a Christian country and if they don’t like it, they need to go to a country of their choice that is predominately their religion.

Anyway, all of this is really immaterial. The senate has voted 99-0 against the ruling, which clearly shows that you atheist freaks have a long way to go if you plan to change our country.

GX

That's ridiculous. I am an atheist and I don't have faith that there is no god. I'm just pretty sure that monotheism is not an accurate conception of reality because it is one idea out of an infinite number.

Agnosticism exists among theists and atheists. Theists may have faith while aknowledging that there is no way to know absolutely. Atheists may conclude that monotheism is not real for all practical purposes, but know that there is obviously no way to prove this.

I'm pretty sure god doesn't exist just like I'm pretty sure there is not an eyeball floating right behind me. That is not faith. That is just holding a practical belief.

Furthermore, scientists who say that force equals mass times accelleration don't have "faith" in this. They are just statistically extremely sure that it will hold true in any practical situation. Science allows for revision.

I find it humorous when someone who relies on faith thinks other people do, too.

 

[JohnnyO]

Ugh, but the country was FOUNDED by a bunch of athiests? They ran the country FINE?

Thomas Jefferson called by Bible "a pile of SHIT!!!"
Adams said the Bible woudl be a good book if they took the religion out!!