Partial deads

[SteelWeaver]

About how far off the floor does a partial dead start aka Dave Tate's programme wk 4?

 

[bignate73]

usually above or below the knee.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Thanks bignate - I found one or two posts stating knee level, so that's what I did - wow! Those REALLY hit the lower back hard.

 

[THeMaCHinE]

Pin pulls are one of my all-time favorites. I set the pin to where the bar will pull from just above the knee. You should be able to pull quite a bit heavier than from the floor.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Well, unfortunately, I don't have any "pins" - my silly gym doesn't have a power rack, so I just set up some step class risers (which were too low anyway), then just went down to knee level without the customary pause on the pins or whatever. Kind of means stopping in mid air, but it was a 20-rep set, so it wasn't like I was handling a whooole lotta weight.

 

[JJFigure]

Why 20 reps? If you're shooting for strength, I wouldn't do more than 5 reps. Even then, I think you're at risk of losing form. I've only been doing working sets of 2-3 reps when I DL (with a complete stop and reset in between reps).

Another way of doing partial deads is starting from the floor and stopping at knee level. This will help strengthen the starting position of the DL.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Why 20 reps? Uhhhh ... cuz Dave Tate SAID so.

Joke - I was kinda thinking the same thing, but since Westside turns out some of the strongest people on the planet, I figured I'd keep my thoughts to myself, try the programme all the way through, and then evaluate.

The partials are part of the accessory work on max effort squat day. Everything else on that day is 1RM stuff, 5, 8 or 10 reps ... so, I dunno?

 

[JJFigure]

That's right, I forgot you were doing a program. 20 reps seems like a lot though, even for accessory work. Oh well, who am I to question Dave Tate?

 

[spatts]

Steel, rack pulls, pin pulls, whatever you want to call them are done from varying heights, but are targeted around your weakness. Everything about Westside is about blowing away your weakness through speed and strength. If you stick at the bottom, you may want low rack pulls in the rotation more often. For lockout work, you may want to do high pulls or reverse band deads more often...and like someone else said, if you stick at the knee, do them from there. Partial speed pulls are great too...bands or chains.

Just like when we do floor press, 2 board, 3 board, 4 board, 5 board, and lockouts for bench, you can train your deadlift from bottom to top too. Make every link stronger, and your pull will go up.

 

[spatts]

...oh, and that's a beginner routine. You may not want to do the 20 rep thing. If you do, you won't want to do it for long. That's just to build up conditioning in people that are NEW to the game. All your BB lifting has already hit this target.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Oh. I thought it meant beginner to PL when it said beginner. Oh well - OK, I'll drop them to 8 or 10. Can't do bands/chains - well, not til I get a rack, and figure out what resistance I need on the bands and how to achieve that with the bits of rubber they call bands at the sports store. This is likely to take a few months - ah, well, can't be helped.

spatts - what do you think of the volume for hams on the Dave Tate programme? - I'm reeeallyy feeling like my hams are just never quite recovered - Even with a day or so with, say, 2 sets of 50 reps SLDLs with just the bar - they're still sore when it comes time to do MORE glute ham raises, MORE pull throughs .... It's funny - there's a lot of tri volume too - but those just keep getting stronger - no probs recovering. I'm starting to wonder if I shouldn't juse increase the number of days between squat days. Make it a total nine day cycle or something?

Also, no reverse hypers at my gym - are hyperextensions a good enough sub? Those and pull throughs and SLDLs are what I've been doing ...

Any thoughts?

 

[TheProject]

Spatts thinks you should drop the Tate program, and look at the Asylum Numbers thread on the Training Journal board, or the Sample PL thread that I PM'd to you, both of which are just a straight WSB program.

Your volume is too high; you don't need to build up conditioning because you're not a beginner. Shouldn't ever feel overtrained/underrecovered.

Hyperextensions aren't really a good sub for the reverse hyper; you can rig up one with a preacher curl bench, or another tall surface you can lay across. You can do them with just bodyweight, then add bands when you get some.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Thanks Project. I really appreciate all the help you've been giving me. The only reason I decided on the Tate programme was that there were no chains or bands involved, it was all laid out, easy to access, and didn't involve hours and hours trying to download videos. I'm feeling really frustrated now though, which upsets me, since training is usually my main joy and satisfaction in life.

I think I'm going to put WSB on the backburner for a while, at least until I have a power rack (frankly, the programme is impossible without one) and can actually get the videos downloaded (my brother has ISDN, but he's apparently not speaking to the family at the moment ), find all the relevant threads, do all the relevant reading - you know - collate everything. I'm too stressed right now trying to catch up everything at school to be stressed about training. Too many learning curves

It's distressing, because I HATE giving up on anything, but I hate doing a half job even more, so I guess it's OK for now.

About the reverse hypers - I found a surface that I thought would do at my gym, but when I tried it I got this weird pain in my lower back - it was very nasty - so I stopped. I'll figure something out eventually ...

 

[SteelWeaver]

Mmm - now I don't know WHAT to do - my squat just went up 5 kilos since last week ... the heaviest I've ever hit - I almost can't believe I did it. Continue, or change ... THAT is the question.