Nootropics and Athletic Performance

[Jacob Creutzfeldt]

I am looking for a nootropic therapy to assist me in my athletic pursuits. The ideal components will enhance speed, reflexes, rate of learning, and energy production. I have heard of deprenyl/piracetam/hydergine/DMAE stack, but am unsure of dosages when synergistically combined. Any help or insight is greatly appreciated.

 

[chillin408]

When I take piracetam/hydergine/DMAE I definetly feel a increase in athletic performance. The stack improves my mind-muscle connection, and you don't feel little pains, like strains. At 800mg of P with 1 tab of H in the morn. along with another tab of P in the afternoon I felt close to nothing, unless if I add some DMAE, like 300mg. Later I noticed if I take 2 tabs of hydergine 9mg that I really feel the good mind-muscle connection, I took DMAE about 600mg and also 2400mg-3200mg of P,or if H would do a good job in isolation. i wonder if P even ddoes anything by iteself. I have takin a few day off using this stuff though. I mainly bought them to help concentrate and to be attentive, these were just other effects.

 

[william2000]

Interesting

The amount mentioned above would give me a head ache and make me feel dull . . . although much lower doses of piracetam definitely improve my performance . . .

Another thing that does is Phosphadytl Serine PS. I immediately noticed that my pool game improved.

 

[Jacob Creutzfeldt]

Deprenyl, Piracetam, Hydergine, DMAE

I am thinking of combining these three nootropics. Does anyone know what type of dosages I should start with?

 

[chillin408]

Theres some real world experiences and information at rec.drugs.smart at deja.com . I've heard 2.5mg a day of deprenyl is a good dose. You might want to check if its safe to use the other pharmacuetials your planning on using with deprenyl. I've heard that ritalin or any stimulants used with deprenyl can be problematic.I think too high dopamingec levels and/or other neurotransmitters is a reason why some med's can't be used with deprenyl. I know a lot of what I'm saying is vague, but just mentioning just incase you didn't know, and theres alot of information on that other board rec.drugs.smart

 

[booger]

I've used deprenyl, hydergine, and DMAE before, and in massive dosages and found they are a waste of time as far as increasing athletic ability. They don't do much of anything for speed, reflexes, or energy production. Rate of Learning is kind of a subjective matter and hard to measure.

The only substances I've ever used that work are stimulants such as caffeine, ephedrine, Dex, Ritalin, Cylert, and epinephrine(adrenalin). Anabolic steroids have a very dramatic effect. Creatine works quite well, but I don't get the punch I got from it that I did when I was young. Procrit(EPO) is great for endurance.

I've always considered nootropics to be BS. They might help some old geezer with a senility problem but for the average Joe they're nothing more that an expensive placebo. They just make you think you're smarter.

If you really want to increase your rate of learning you need to lower the resistance in the neural synapses with chemicals, and I won't name them specifically, that have hallucenogenic properties.

 

[Triple J]

Have to disagree with Booger regarding nootropics, but I would say it is a highly individual matter.

As far as dosing and considering you are stacking you will want to obviously start with minimal dosages and slowly experiment to what seems to be the right dosages where you feel optimal. I don't see any real danger in the stack you are considering if you follow that advice. For instance, something like 1mg D, 100mg DMAE, 400mg P, and 5mg H.

All the above substances I believe have also been shown to have some antioxidant capabilities but I would empasize also utilizing plenty of supplemental nutritional support to provide the raw materials and antioxidant protection for these metabolic pathways once you embark.

For those substances which you do not have experience in it would be best to use them stand-alone rather than rushing into a stack. A stack can easily result in too much stimulation which would result in a loss of focus (a dumbing-down effect) rather than the enhanced state which you are seeking.

Here is some other info I recall reading various places:

Piracetam has been shown to help oxygen utilization and help prevent altitude sickness. If I recall it enhances communication between left-right hemispheres of the brain. I believe it is hormone-related in its actions and activity, showing somwhat greater affinity in younger subjects with relatively more normalized higher overall hormone levels. It was popular with European bodybuilders at one time, speculatively related to enhancing hormone receptor sensitivity.

Deprenyl is a highly selective MAO inhibitor which prolongs dopamine activity in the brain (vs. throughout the body) through inhibition of the MAO enzyme. As far as brand goes, liquid deprenyl citrate which was manufactured by Discovery was once conisdered the premium source, but it is no longer available as the FDA busted them and through the guy in jail after numerous failed attempts over the years. Maybe you can find some. Some people who are sensitive to other sources were able to use the liquid citrate form without problem. I have been told this was related to other byproduct harmful metabolites from other manufacturers. At any rate the proper dose of Deprenyl is age-related and any such dosage recommendation would have to be scaled down further in consideration of someone who is stacking multiple nootropics. Vitamin B6 is important for the dopamine pathway, and perhaps tryosine or phenaline as aminos easily converted to dopa. Maca herb I belive contains L-dopa as do kidney beans.

The hydergiene I believe increases the firing rate or sensitivity beytween synapses something like caffeine.

DMAE is a nutrient like substance in that it provides more choline to the brain to enhance that neurotransmitter pathway (cholinergic). It has also been shown to clean out accumulated waste and is sometime prescribed for ADHD. Vitamin B5 is essential for this pathway.


Good luck

 

[booger]

I don't dispute your statements Triple J but, my idea of improvement of whatever you are seeking has to show me something substantial or I don't consider it worth my money.

Remember the first time you took caff/eph? Remember the rush of energy? Or maybe the time you tried a couple of grams of niacin on an empty stomach. Remember the itching and redness like the histamine release from a bunch of bee stings. Or maybe the conciousness altering effects of some illegal drug. That's my idea of 'working'.

These other things are so minimal. It's like 'is it working'? If I have to conciously decide if something is working then it's a 'maybe it's working or maybe it's just a placebo effect'. I'm never really sure. And there is no instrument like a EEG available to check to see if there is some change in brainwave activity.

 

[Triple J]

Booger, like I said, it is a highly individual matter in regards to benefits. Some people will experience a strong positive response similiar to what you cite, once they find their sweet spot with nootropics. And with less sides than something like C/E.

 

[digso]

where can i find nootropics in Canada?

 

[bdog527]

bump

 

[triguy]

proof nootropics aid performance!!!!!!

: Arzneimittelforschung 1979;29(8a):1261-6 Related Articles, Links


[Hemodynamic effects of nicergolin in man at rest and during exertion (author's transl)]

[Article in German]

Boismare F, Lefrancois J.

In 10 healthy subjects the injection of 10-methyl-1,6-diemthyl-ergoline-8 beta-methanol-(5-bromonicotinate (nicergoline, Sermion) (5 mg i.v.) caused a permanent decrease in blood pressure. This decrease in blood pressure is due to a rapidly occurring alpha-blocking effect and a secondary central alpha-stimulating effect which did not affect the postural regulating mechanisms of the arterial blood pressure in their function. The bradycardia and the elevation of the systolic volume and of the cardiac output are based on this central effect. After oral administration of 30 mg nicergoline the same modifications appeared but to a lesser extent. If nicergoline was administered in a dosage of 30 mg p.o. 1 h before bicyle exercise (100 W for 5 min), the cardiac output and blood flow in the lower extremities increased and the elevation of the systolic pressure was limited. However, the reactive tachycardia remained at the same level. The metabolic consequences of this administration resulted in an inhibited increase in the concentration of lactic acid in the blood, which is normally caused by this exertion. This favourable metabolic effect can be explained by 1. the initial bradycardia and the decrease in the total peripheral resistance whereby the oxygen consumption of the myocardium is reduced; 2. the peripheral vasodilation

 

[gsxr600]

I dont intend to highjack this thread, but its in relation, and i cant seem to post a new thread, so...


I have just started a heavy training schedule, and in doing so I feel as though I'm lacking "mentaly" as to when i was taking it easy. I'm not over training, but i feel pretty drained after my workouts pysically and mentally.

I have recently been reading up on DMAE and DEPRENYL and was wondering if anyone has advice on the latter substances? Experiences, and if they work or not.
I'm taking Gingko right now, and even though its supposidly useless, i have noticed some improvements.

ALso if you know of any other Memory enhancers, and Intelligence enhancers, i would be very appreciative of your advice.

I would really like to enhance mental acuity, memory, intelligence, and cognitive function, hopefully this all comes in a bottle

gsxr600

 

[triguy]

CANT TAKE MY MIDDAY NAPS!!!!!!!

currently taking : 6am then train at 7:30, try an nap at 1pm


gingko 300mg
cdpcholine 250mg
vinpocetine 10mg
hupA 50mcg
dmae 25mg
piracetam 400mg

what ya think i should drop or lower?

 

[triguy]

good up & coming nootropic board

http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=6&t=365

 

[Jacob Creutzfeldt]

As a guess, I would say the huperzine. Maybe it is interacting synergistically with the choline and dmae. If I'm not mistaken, huperzine binds to the enzyme that breaks down acetylcholine.