noob that needs help with sups...(really skinny/tall guy)

[gunsdiesel]

okay, don't flame, i searched and found some answers, but jesus there's a ton of threads on this message board..
First off, I'm getting back into lifting, and I have a really messed up frame.
I'm 6'2-6'3 and weigh about 160lbs. I'm extremely skinny, and I figured I would start using supplements to add a little boost. I have a big tub of protein powder, and creatine powder in my closet from a while ago that never got used due to me not knowing when and how much to take. So what would your recomendations be for me on how to bulk up? what kind of supplements, what time should i take them, and what types of work outs I should do.

any help is appreciated.
thanks

 

[clublavela]

I"m seeing some really nice gains with the MRI product NO2.....plus i wouldn't use that creatine i would go to the af store and order the new cee which is a lot better than the old creatine or so people have said. I like NO2 it helps recovery faster

 

[PONCHITO]

make sure you eat enough. get your diet down to, its just as important as lifting.

 

[gunsdiesel]

because I'm so skinny, are there any foods out there that are actually bad for me?
ex. fastfood

because at hardee's they have the double monster thick burger which is like:
1400 calories
96 g fat
56 g protein
60 g carbs

and from looking around the forums, i need atleast.....
3000 calories
480g carbs
240g protein
64g fat
.....a day to begin gaining some weight


hell this sandwhich would take care of half of the calories needed,lol
i know i would need much more protein in my diet, as well as carbs, but i was just wondering if i should stay away from foods such as these....god knows i love 'em though

thanks again

 

[RuckstaR]

What kind of creatine do you have? I assume if its old then it's mono, and I would probably use 5g, 2x a day, before and after workout with a carb source like gatorade, and then again on your off days as well.

As far as supplements, creatine and protein are basics and I would leave it there. Use whole food as your number one supplement. With a build like yours you just need to eat eat eat. 200+ g of protein per day, I would do 3500 rather than 3000 calories , and split them 40 40 20 protein carbs fats

As far as your monster thingee burger.....let me just say.....HELLL NO, SWEET JESUS! That's like 5 cheat meals for some of us in one! 96g of fat that is probably ALL saturated and transfat, low grade protein, and simple carbs. I can think of very few things that are worse for you. Go for whole grains, rice, sweet potatoes etc. Look for fairly lean cuts of chicken beef and pork. Then take those clean foods and eat them 6-8 times a day, I never put on more muscle and less fat than when I started eating 8+ times a day.

I almost forgot about your protein powder, I would use it twice a day Pre-workout and PWO. Get some complex carbs (like oats), and add milk in the pre-workout shake, then mix ONLY water in the post workout shake, followed an hour later by a full meal.

Feel free to shoot out any other questions you may ahve, and good luck getting huge!

 

[philipusmcr]

Everything is good or ok in moderation, too much of ANYTHING will kill you. The thing about those burgers is that it will make your body work so hard to break down that fat (specifically your liver) Your liver makes the enzyme that breaks fats down. Although some fat is good for you, this much 96 g times 2= 192 grams! This means OVER half your calorie intake is from fat (per gram : carbs:4 calories, protein:4 cal, alcohol:7 cal, and fat :9 cal!) You will mess your liver up pretty dang bad, and you will quickly develope problems similar to an alcoholic. If you see super size me( which I have not yet) They probably explain a lot of it in there. I know I love the Good Times Guacamole bacon burger, but due to health reasons and the thing costs 3 bucks, I only get them 1-2 times a week.

Some things that are high in carbs you want are:
Fruit, Veggies, Bread, and Noodles. (yeah, you have heard this probably plenty)

Then for protein:
Chicken(Tyson has some good chicken strips), and pretty much all other meats.
Peanut butter is full of protein too. Either kind ( Natural or jiffy ). Natural is pretty good tasting, I make peanut butter sandwhiches with some milk to drink(another good protein source).
Remember to gain weight you don't eat like crap. Eat a lot, in moderation, and at least somewhat healthy. Eventually you will gain weight.
Next: when eating a lot, remember if you take what it takes to keep your weight stable(your old diet), add 500 calories a day and thats an extra pound a week (3500 cals.) 3000 is a rule of thumb because the "normal" person eats 2500, but if your metabolism is fast, you need more than 3000. I put down 3500 to 4000 per day.




More on fat:
Saturated fat: all carbons are saturated with hydrogen atoms (Not GOOD)
Unsaturated fat: At least one set of carbons share more than one electron making it impossible to be fully saturated. Less saturation
Polyunsaturated fat: more than set of carbons share more than one electron... same as above, more electrons shared.
Trans FAT: Don't eat this crap, it is worse for you than anything. It is a type of fat made so the carbons are super saturated and your body has no idea what it is (I consider it "super saturated fat"). It is found in crap like twinkies. Food and Drug admin is soon making it required that all things with trans fat in it is labeled.

 

[RuckstaR]

Another problem with that burger....You are pulling in half of your daily calories, but not even a quarter of your daily protein, a terrible ratio,

 

[gunsdiesel]

yeah, that's what i figured, lol, my liver doesn't need to work any harder with the way i've been living for the last couple of years....(4 nights of drinkig a week + chain smoker)
It's time to start cleaning up the diet as well as the drinking and smoking...

A question about drinking though...
What's the maximum amount I can get away with drinking each week...
I'm probably not gonna get the answer I want to hear, so go ahead and shoot me down.

 

[pong21]

Eat big, you'll get big.

 

[LeonK]

Everything is good or ok in moderation, too much of ANYTHING will kill you. The thing about those burgers is that it will make your body work so hard to break down that fat (specifically your liver) Your liver makes the enzyme that breaks fats down. Although some fat is good for you, this much 96 g times 2= 192 grams! This means OVER half your calorie intake is from fat (per gram : carbs:4 calories, protein:4 cal, alcohol:7 cal, and fat :9 cal!) You will mess your liver up pretty dang bad, and you will quickly develope problems similar to an alcoholic. If you see super size me( which I have not yet) They probably explain a lot of it in there. I know I love the Good Times Guacamole bacon burger, but due to health reasons and the thing costs 3 bucks, I only get them 1-2 times a week.

Some things that are high in carbs you want are:
Fruit, Veggies, Bread, and Noodles. (yeah, you have heard this probably plenty)

Then for protein:
Chicken(Tyson has some good chicken strips), and pretty much all other meats.
Peanut butter is full of protein too. Either kind ( Natural or jiffy ). Natural is pretty good tasting, I make peanut butter sandwhiches with some milk to drink(another good protein source).
Remember to gain weight you don't eat like crap. Eat a lot, in moderation, and at least somewhat healthy. Eventually you will gain weight.
Next: when eating a lot, remember if you take what it takes to keep your weight stable(your old diet), add 500 calories a day and thats an extra pound a week (3500 cals.) 3000 is a rule of thumb because the "normal" person eats 2500, but if your metabolism is fast, you need more than 3000. I put down 3500 to 4000 per day.




More on fat:
Saturated fat: all carbons are saturated with hydrogen atoms (Not GOOD)
Unsaturated fat: At least one set of carbons share more than one electron making it impossible to be fully saturated. Less saturation
Polyunsaturated fat: more than set of carbons share more than one electron... same as above, more electrons shared.
Trans FAT: Don't eat this crap, it is worse for you than anything. It is a type of fat made so the carbons are super saturated and your body has no idea what it is (I consider it "super saturated fat"). It is found in crap like twinkies. Food and Drug admin is soon making it required that all things with trans fat in it is labeled.

What the hell do you know about nutrition making out your the expert, dont listen to these mis guided gym rats.

 

[philipusmcr]

What the hell do you know about nutrition making out your the expert, dont listen to these mis guided gym rats.

What the hell do I know? What I stated above is almost all factual and some opinion to help the kid out. I can't believe somebody actually had to stupidity to question what I said. Did you even read what I wrote? What "gym Rat" knows the molecular structure of fat? It's no wonder your karma is in the negatives, you are a pompus retard.

 

[LeonK]

What the hell do I know? What I stated above is almost all factual and some opinion to help the kid out. I can't believe somebody actually had to stupidity to question what I said. Did you even read what I wrote? What "gym Rat" knows the molecular structure of fat? It's no wonder your karma is in the negatives, you are a pompus retard.

Yes because you never wrote it, just got it from another website and paste it down. YOUR THE CLASSIC "ALL TALK NO ACTION KIND"

 

[RuckstaR]

I take pride im having helped get his karma down there....leonk, I dunno wtf your malfunction is but you might as welll just f*ck off and never come back. Giventhe venue and context of this coversation is is absolutely imposible for you to make the comments you are with any credibility, and as far as accusations of cut a paste, 1, there is nothing wrong with cut and paste if it helps someone out, and 2, if you could actually read, and perhaps understand what you are reading, there is a smattering of personal opinion in between almost all of his scientific info, so that would result in like 25 seperate cut and pastes.....I don't think so. So......even if phil was wrong (which he isn't) you have no place here, go back to your ladies fitness gym and talk your bullshit to them.

Diesel, you can count on philip's advice completely, it IS factual and I agree with it 100%, dont worry about schmucks like leon!

 

[philipusmcr]

Yes because you never wrote it, just got it from another website and paste it down. YOUR THE CLASSIC "ALL TALK NO ACTION KIND"

Actually, Yes I did type all of that. Don't you think an article would try to sound more scientific or not so specific on his situation? Seeing the fact I am also a frigin U.S. Marine shows I am not all talk no action. You are completely retarded, and I am done responding to your incoherent comments.

 

[LeonK]

Actually, Yes I did type all of that. Don't you think an article would try to sound more scientific or not so specific on his situation? Seeing the fact I am also a frigin U.S. Marine shows I am not all talk no action. You are completely retarded, and I am done responding to your incoherent comments.

US Marine yer, so what.... big tough guy now

 

[RuckstaR]

 

[gunsdiesel]

Aside from LeonK, would any of you guys recommend some other supplements I should be taking and what they're for? I've seen people using flax seed oil and other things in their stacks, but I'm not sure if I need them. Thanks in advance, you guys are a HUGE help

 

[RuckstaR]

Here are what I view as essentials. Protein powder, good quality multivitamin, good fat supplement (omega 3 and 6's), some kind of sugar (dextrose) for after your workout with shake, and sometimes creatine. Most importantly of all, FOOD. With these few things, dedication, and plenty of sleep, you can make incredible gains, without spending and arm and a leg.

 

[MaytagmanUSN]

Hey leonk. Being a U.S. Marine is a big deal, and yes, that does make him big tough guy. It also makes him noble and selfless along with a grocery list of other outstanding human qualities. You have no right badmouthing a U.S. Marine. He puts his life on the line so other people can have freedom, even people like you. What have you done to make the quality of life better for other people? Keep your snide remarks to yourself...especially about any member of mine and philip military. I realize that you will probably just add an assonine comment in response to this, just remember...whatever you say has no credibility as you have to credentials warranting it. If you must reply, you're only accomplishing one thing...increasing your chances of carpal tunnel.

Philip, there are people out there that really do appreciate what you do...ive met them as I'm sure you have. Keep doing what you do.

-James
U.S. Navy

 

[gjohnson5]

Everything is good or ok in moderation, too much of ANYTHING will kill you. The thing about those burgers is that it will make your body work so hard to break down that fat (specifically your liver) Your liver makes the enzyme that breaks fats down. Although some fat is good for you, this much 96 g times 2= 192 grams! This means OVER half your calorie intake is from fat (per gram : carbs:4 calories, protein:4 cal, alcohol:7 cal, and fat :9 cal!) You will mess your liver up pretty dang bad, and you will quickly develope problems similar to an alcoholic. If you see super size me( which I have not yet) They probably explain a lot of it in there. I know I love the Good Times Guacamole bacon burger, but due to health reasons and the thing costs 3 bucks, I only get them 1-2 times a week.

Some things that are high in carbs you want are:
Fruit, Veggies, Bread, and Noodles. (yeah, you have heard this probably plenty)

Then for protein:
Chicken(Tyson has some good chicken strips), and pretty much all other meats.
Peanut butter is full of protein too. Either kind ( Natural or jiffy ). Natural is pretty good tasting, I make peanut butter sandwhiches with some milk to drink(another good protein source).
Remember to gain weight you don't eat like crap. Eat a lot, in moderation, and at least somewhat healthy. Eventually you will gain weight.
Next: when eating a lot, remember if you take what it takes to keep your weight stable(your old diet), add 500 calories a day and thats an extra pound a week (3500 cals.) 3000 is a rule of thumb because the "normal" person eats 2500, but if your metabolism is fast, you need more than 3000. I put down 3500 to 4000 per day.




More on fat:
Saturated fat: all carbons are saturated with hydrogen atoms (Not GOOD)
Unsaturated fat: At least one set of carbons share more than one electron making it impossible to be fully saturated. Less saturation
Polyunsaturated fat: more than set of carbons share more than one electron... same as above, more electrons shared.
Trans FAT: Don't eat this crap, it is worse for you than anything. It is a type of fat made so the carbons are super saturated and your body has no idea what it is (I consider it "super saturated fat"). It is found in crap like twinkies. Food and Drug admin is soon making it required that all things with trans fat in it is labeled.

Long time no see phillip , what's up?

You advice is mostly good from my perspective

 

[DaPit26]

HMB, Flax seed oil, Creatine, Whey protein, Weight gainer, Daily vitamin, and then there's the other route.....

 

[DaPit26]

If money is not a problem I would go out and get some Flaxseed oil and take that 3 times a day. You definately need a good mulit vitamin such as "Mega Men". I like to take calcium and vitamin c tabs in the morning with my food. Vitamin C is an awesome aborbable acid. Maybe even buy some weight gainer for cals. Eat tons of carbs like pastas, breads (whole wheat, ryes etc..) and make sure you drink tons of water. I drink between a gallon to gallon and a half a day. Maybe even try some HMB with your meals. It's fairly cheap and you can by it at Wally world. You said you had creatine in your closet for awhile. A lot of creatine goes bad after so long. It will clump up a little. You'll just end up pissing most of it out. I take a teaspoon in the morning about a half an hour before I lift and then a teaspoon immediately after I lift. Same with the protein shakes. Morning, right after you lift and before you go to bed (important because your muscles are repairing) Just eat like a fuckin slob but make sure you're getting enough protein (1 gram for every pound of body weight- your case 160 grams a day) so basically 3 shakes a day and a can of tuna and maybe at lunch some grilled chicken, you'd be set on the protein. I would take between 3,500 - 4,500 calories a day. How you want to do that is up to you.

 

[cwc2k1]

You guys are great...I'm also a noob who is completely ignorant in the way of building, I don't even know how to eat somewhat healthy other than stay away from fast food but I can't cook so I end up eating less than the average most of the time. I eat subway as much as I can possibly stand to. I'm 20½ yrs old, like 6ft even and only 130lbs. I could eat twinkys and double whoppers every day for a year and never gain a lb. I've been the same weight for probably 4 or 5 years now. I'm trying to find a healthy diet and add some weight and much needed muscle. I have some GNC Mega Whey (I just found this site and discovered its the worst place to buy anything, so don't flame me too much for it) but its berry extraordinary and tastes horrible. Anyways, any help that is different from the first guy's that you can throw this way is greatly appreciated. Thanks

Cliff

 

[KIAN]

Hey gunsdiesel.

As you are 'getting back into lifting', you might as well start right from the beginning. First thing you want to do is throw out your supplements. The reason is because they are old and that you said you didn't know when or how much to take. Over the next week, eat as your normally would and write down everything you consume in terms of the caloric value, protein, carbs, and fat content. Don't alter your diet during this period as you want an honest representation of your nutritional intake. At the end of the week you will then be able to see, probably for the first time, where you diet is letting you down. Also during this week, start reading up on nutrition, especially protein. Find out what is right for you, the best sources, the amounts, and the optimum absorption times. You are going to need all this for week TWO.

Use the following equation to calculate your Basic Metabolic Rate (BMR). This will let you know how many calories you will need to consume on a daily basis. NOTE: The figure is for an individual involved in no physical activity, so keep that in mind as you will need to increase this figure, as you exercise, to add mass.

Adult Male:

BMR = 66 + (6.3 x body weight in lbs.) + (12.9 x height in inches) - (6.8 x age in years)


From the reading you did in week ONE about protein (don't make me keep you after class, lol) you will now know that you need one gram of protein for each pound of lean body mass and that one gram of protein equals four calories. This is the start of your new diet. An increase of 500 calories per day over the course of one week will add one pound of mass to your body. The key is to make sure this mass is in the form of muscle and not fat. So that brings me onto the next point. Just because you are thin does not mean that you can eat anything and everything. If you are going to do this right then you have to eat healthily. This also means no smoking and drinking. If you are committed, you can do it. Try to keep your fat intake to under 40 grams per day and limit your intake of saturated fats. Avoid hydrogenated and trans fats altogether. The remainder of your diet will be from carbs.

As to your workout program, you will want to group the various muscle groups to days which you will be comfortable training. An example might be:

Day 1: chest / shoulders / arms
Day 2: rest
Day 3: Back / legs / abs
Day 4: rest
Day 5: repeat

After the first month, you will be able to change your routine to a 3 days on, 1 day off split and incorporate more exercises into your routine. Your caloric intake by this time should be more than sufficient to warrant this level of intensity. If you find that you are putting on too much weight, cut back on the carbs and/or increase the intensity of your training. Once you achieve a weight you are comfortable with, start to introduce more cardio into your workouts. Keep track of your nutritional intake as you did in week one so that you know what your results are going to be instead of just guessing.

As to supplements, WATER and PROTEIN are all you need to achieve a healthy physique. If you wish to go beyond this then you can look at other supplements. Just be aware that most of them contain the word 'MAY' on the packaging. (May promote gains in lean mass ... May reduce body fat ... May reduce the size of your wallet ... etc.) So use the knowledge of the people on this forum as well as your own judgement.

Take your time to do this right and ask lots of questions along the way.

Best of luck.