Low dosages of ANADROL??

[drl]

This is a learning process and i'm no pro so the only way to learn is by doing and keeping track of the outcomes and dosages. Back then if i'd listened to everyone that posted " I wouldn't do less then 600mg test, and blah blah blah " I would have never known that a nice low dose worked for me.

good post- wish someone had told me the same things- 200-300mg/test per week and 1 aromasin a day plus paying close attention to sleep/training do wonders- gained more off this than 1000-2000 mg/wk of test

 

[Mr.X]

Fina bad for the liver?
I always read it only was harsh on the kidneys.

Fina is harsh on everything my friend....

 

[idcbp]

Fina is harsh on everything my friend....

Agreed, but you were saying that anadrol, quite correctly is the only one conclusively linked to liver damage. Then you mentioned fina. I took it as if fina had also been conclusively linked to liver damage (I believe liver canacer for drol). I have always known it was harsh on the whole system, but so is alot of gear. I was still under the impression that a-bombs were the only ones conclusively linked to liver damage and in some cases cancer in studies.

 

[Madcow2]

Okay, every 17aa is an issue for the liver - enzymes will rise and if you take enough of it for long enough you will have a problem (as to what the limits are they very from person to person for several reasons). I have yet to see a non oral linked to significant liver issues. There are tons of injectibles in a variety of forms out there and not one has been proven under normal dosages (everything hits the liver in some form or another). Fina was rumored to be toxic and that got spread by Dan Duchaine's bible but there is no proof and I see no compelling reason that it should be. He also thought parabolan was a better answer than finajet (MM2000 article) and let's face it the only difference is an ester and ester weight. The trenbolone molecule is the same and the ester is not toxic. If you tweak the dosages enough and compensate for ester weight, you wind up with the same amount of trenbolone either way.

My conclusion on all the toxitity stuff (and I'm not alone), it is the 17aa bond that is toxic. That bond is common to all orals to allow enough of the compound to make it into the blood stream and not be destroyed in the first pass through the liver like the same substance without it would be. So liver resiliency comes with a price, and that price is toxitity (it is able to outfight your liver for a while - liver will win but nevertheless takes a beating, common sense). For measuring liver toxitity, the best proxy is going to be the number of molecules (each containing a 17aa alkyl group) that you are sending through. If you use mg or mg, it's close but thrown off a bit by molecular weight of each compound. Take that into account and you have a very good proxy for the toxitity. Yeah, this means I don't buy that anavar is not toxic. The alkyl group at 17aa is toxic, maybe the base is not but each of these groups takes its toll and there is no way around that.

A50 is specifically linked to liver damage because one of it's uses it to treat a specific kind of anemia and the required dosages are very high. If I remember correctly we are talking in the neighborhood of 100-200mg for extended periods and I have heard of patients needing significantly more specifically in the early stages of treatment - the numbers I once saw (I can't quote a source and I don't know validity) were 300+ mg daily for many months. I read this a long time ago but cyst formation was one of the issues. I believe after cessation they went away. I am unsure whether they were malignant but I don't believe so - blood filled cysts from what I recall. I'm sure someone can find the info if they want to.

Anyway, one of the issues with A50 is the very low receptor affinity. This causes two issues.

1) You need to take more of it compared to dianabol for example (assume for a moment that molecular weight is equivalent and not a factor).

2) This is my opinion but I believe it to be logical and well supported, your own genetics will play a large part in the efficasy of A50. The more receptors you have the better you will be able to utilize a given dosage (same with everything but I belive the importance is exagerated with A50). This is further supported by the wide range of dosages people need to see effects. Even looking at this thread, one guy says 25mg worked great for him, someone else needed 100-150mg.

So A50 has a few problems for new users - first, you don't know how much you need and there is a huge margin relative to other compounds. Another issue is that the response variability is equally as wide. Some people go totally to bloat and moon face. Others don't hold much water at all and find it a great cutting drug.

I happen to be someone who has used 25mg doses and even a bit less on occasion very successfully. Recovery is phenomenal enabling huge workloads (it wasn't called the work capacity drug for nothing). I also hold virtually no water, and I find it very easy to stay lean and get leaner without watching my calories closely. Do I believe you will get my results? It's a matter of odds and I'd venture that I have significantly better results than most, so I'd bet against it.

 

[Mr.X]

Agreed, but you were saying that anadrol, quite correctly is the only one conclusively linked to liver damage. Then you mentioned fina. I took it as if fina had also been conclusively linked to liver damage (I believe liver canacer for drol). I have always known it was harsh on the whole system, but so is alot of gear. I was still under the impression that a-bombs were the only ones conclusively linked to liver damage and in some cases cancer in studies.

I'll restate, fiina hasn't been directly linked to liver damage on the level that A50s have - you're 100% correct, BUT fina does cause liver problems if used long-term. I remember about 8 months ago, a guy on this board got cancer from fina abuse....

Mr.X

 

[Madcow2]

I'll restate, fiina hasn't been directly linked to liver damage on the level that A50s have - you're 100% correct, BUT fina does cause liver problems if used long-term. I remember about 8 months ago, a guy on this board got cancer from fina abuse....

Mr.X

Everything will hit the liver to some degree. One question though, how do we know it was fina that caused it? There's some people using pretty decent dosages that have gotten blood work done and enzyme levels were normal - as a matter of fact I've never heard of severely elevated levels from using fina alone in a blood test without the presence of orals. Is it possible that he had liver issues anyway and fina exacerbated it? Any history of orals? Even with alcohol and hardcore drinkers their livers don't subcumb for a very long time. I feel really bad for the guy - liver cancer is generally terminal. My father and I are planning on visiting a friend who is dealing with that right now (late 50's long time heavy drinker). I just envision his specialist or GP telling him that it was the fina because they know that some steroids are toxic. That's not really a qualified opinion on the matter since they are experts in treatment and not causality esecially when the steroid used is a vet drug. Lyle Alzedo put it out there for the public that steroids cause his brain tumor yet there wasn't a qualified expert that would back the statement up (shit - the politicians anti doping would have been thrilled).

Like I said before, everything going into the body hits the liver. Put enough junk through you and you will overtax it. That said, I've never once seen trenbolone linked to liver or kidney any more than any other injectible outside of major speculation. If I see or am presented something different my opinion will change immediately and accordingly.

EDIT: Let me just add for anyone reading this, that I'm not saying fina is open season here. This is my opinion - albeit I think the foundation is valid and what I've said here and before is totally logical, much more so than a lot of the speculation out there. You know what? It's your body so find a lab to get some blood work done and see if it's causing issues. Don't take my opinion where your heath is concerned. Having a small body is better than having no body at all.

 

[hrt39]

I did 25 mg day for 4 weeks. Didn't notice much more than 1-2 lbs., but did notice my hair falling out. Stick with test.

 

[TheAssholeFomerlyKnownAsDBBT]

How do you know then what gains you would have made if you did a first cycle of just 25mg a day? Everybody is different and reacts different. My first cycle was a-bombs and test cyp. Plus I split it a little different. I took one a-bomb mon-fri, splitting the tablet in half and taking a half in the morning and a half an hour before my workout, then I ran only 200mg test cyp. a week. I was on the anadrol for 4 weeks and the test for 10 weeks. Gains were out of this world, bench went up 80lbs, unreal.
My thinking by only going Mon thru Fri with the anadrol and taking the weekends off was to give my liver a break. This is a learning process and i'm no pro so the only way to learn is by doing and keeping track of the outcomes and dosages. Back then if i'd listened to everyone that posted " I wouldn't do less then 600mg test, and blah blah blah " I would have never known that a nice low dose worked for me.
P.S.- Great to be back, had to re-register, and good to see some of the old names still here.
"Quote the Raven, nevermore"

Dildo read my post again, I took 100mg ONLY ed, no cyp no nothing. I know what results 100mg ONLY got me.

 

[roidpuple]

Well yes of course it would work when you're taking Xmg of Test, Xmg of Winny and IGF....he never said what he was running with it, or if he was doing it alone. 25-50-75mg of Anadrol ONLY per day is a waste of your $. You'll need 100mg ed and even might go up to 150 late in the short cycle

so 1st cycle was anadrol only. What were your results?
How much weight did you gain? how much did you keep after you lost the water or did you have much water weight....
you 100mg a day ?? for how long 6weeks 4 weeks ....
is not the liver problem .... was is all in all good to you?

My question really anadrol only.... because i always read about the bad sides.... but they seem to be the same sides of using most of the other steroids are the same when over used ...... so i was wondering about the results of just 25mg a day of dbol.... has anyone got a story about keeping some mass from anadrol ...???

 

[roidpuple]

I have 100 tabs of anadrol... everyone says they are bad. then some say take at lease 100mg a day.. I dont want to push the sides.... I thought maybe you could take a lower dose.. to menimize the sides...... I am afraid of growing titties...
I was looking for somone who has tried this idea of low dose ... to see how it worked
why do you have to take at least 50mg a day?...