Long and short esters

[vanilagorilla]

When I asked the doc about long and short esters he said it basically comes down to how often you want to inject. I didn't want to get into a whole lot of detail with him. Why do we get more bloating with the longer esters? If you don't have a problem with injections why ever use a long ester? The doc said which I new, the ester just determines how quickly your body absorbs the hormone, also the long esters take up more room in the mix, so you actually are getting less hormone per ml. Yet it seems we get different results from the different esters them selves. I know water retention can be good to help with joints, tendons and the uptake of protein, but are the end results ultimately the same. It seems that there are less sides with the short esters.

The pro's and con's of long or short what's your take on it

 

[25homes]

Depends on what type of cycle you are running and for how long....I like long esters like test enathate deca, eq, test cyp but love shorts as well..I like long esters to bulk and short to cut for the most part some exceptions...

 

[vanilagorilla]

Depends on what type of cycle you are running and for how long....I like long esters like test enathate deca, eq, test cyp but love shorts as well..I like long esters to bulk and short to cut for the most part some exceptions...

Why?????

 

[Makavelli]

You will find that if you kept the blood levels of the AAS stable there would be no difference in water retention. Long esters tend to keep stable levels more stable than the short esters. Therefore if your test levels are elevated for a longer period of time there is more of a chance of more test being converted to estrogen. Test is test. It doesn't matter what ester you use your body will treat it the same. I like to use ent. with an AI. I can't use prop due to the swelling.

 

[vanilagorilla]

There are many different esters that are used with anabolic/androgenic steroids, but again, they all do basically the same thing. Esters vary only in their ability to reduce a steroid's water solubility. An ester like propionate for example will slow the release of a steroid for a few days, while the duration will be weeks with a decanoate ester.

Esters have no effect on the tendency for the parent steroid to convert to estrogen or DHT (dihydrotestosterone: a more potent metabolite) nor will it effect the overall muscle-building potency of the compound.

Any differences in results and side effects that may be noted by athletes who have used various esterified versions of the same base steroid are just issues of timing.

Testosterone enanthate causes estrogen related problems more readily than Sustanon, simply because with enanthate testosterone levels will peak and through much sooner (1-2 week release duration as opposed to 3 or 4). Likewise testosterone suspension is the worst in regards to gyno and water bloat because blood hormone levels peak so quickly with this drug. Instead of waiting weeks for testosterone levels to rise to their highest point, here we are at most looking at a couple of days. Given an equal blood level of testosterone, there would be no difference in the rate of aromatization or DHT conversion between different esters. There is simply no mechanism for this to be possible.

There is however one way that we can say an ester does technically effect potency: it is calculated in the steroid weight. The heavier the ester chain, the greater is its percentage of the total weight. In the case of testosterone enanthate for example, 250mg of esterified steroid (testosterone enanthate) is equal to only 180mg of free testosterone. 70mgs out of each 250mg injection is the weight of the ester. If we wanted to be really picky, we could consider enanthate slightly MORE potent than cypionate (I know this goes against popular thinking) as its ester chain contains one less carbon atom (therefore taking up a slightly smaller percentage of total weight). Propionate would of course come out on top of the three, releasing a measurable (but not significant) amount more testosterone per injection than cypionate or enanthate. So I believe if your fine with injections and your good with your timeing short esters are the way to go. More bang for your buck and better, finer control.

 

[anal itch]

I like to use ent. with an AI. I can't use prop due to the swelling.

Can you expand on this? I know I held much more water on test e then on test prop. I did 2x a week injections on test e and ED for prop. I can't imagine levels being that far off for that to be the cause of the water retention.

 

[Makavelli]

Can you expand on this? I know I held much more water on test e then on test prop. I did 2x a week injections on test e and ED for prop. I can't imagine levels being that far off for that to be the cause of the water retention.

That's what it is. With prop levels go up and down more radically than with cyp or ent. The longer the levels are elevated the more water one will tend to hold due to more test being converted to estrogen. Sust is the worse for water retention because it keeps blood levels elevated for about 3 weeks. There is no difference in the effect the test has from ester to ester. That's why I just use ent with an AI.

 

[vanilagorilla]

For short heavy cycles with short esters ed we should be able to maintain a good elavated level. The problem I'm thinking about is how to get that many mgs of prop ed with out the pain. Long esters seem to be less painfull. I'm really leaning towards the short cycle. it seems 4 w on 4 off would work real well, after 4 on a heavy cycle the momentum would seem to carry me right threw to the next cycle even if it ended up being 6 w off. I'm thinking it will have to be two injection sites a day. This could be one major draw back to the heavy short cycle. I still think that over a year the gains will be well worth the extra injects.

 

[southpaw45]

Less Injections w/ longer esters.