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I will risk asking a serious question here...

pintoca

pintoca

New member
Is there a "rule of thumb" for deciding when it might be a good idea to get a lifting belt?

I'm by no means a hevy lifter, currently doing 250lbs (5x5) in both squats (full squats) and deadlifts...However, my back is bothering me a bit... I'm sure form is in check, so i was wondering if there any "wives tales" rule.

Something along the line of ... "if you deadlift your BW you should be getting one of those belts, before you don't really need it"... or is it only common sense and I should simply go and buy it?
 
A) post this shit in the training forum bro - people on C&C don't train, for the most part

B) personally, it's all about feel for me. At first I only used a belt when DLing heavy (for me), but then started using it all the time and it felt good. Some people will say that by using a belt all the time you are somewhat handicapping yourself, and I somewhat agree, but it's all about what works for you. I think using it for relatively "heavy" sets and up will do just fine.
 
yeah im with Killah, but IMO if youre in the 225# range with squats or DL's- wear a belt...lower back issues are nothing to brag about...plus it holds my MP3.
 
pintoca said:
Is there a "rule of thumb" for deciding when it might be a good idea to get a lifting belt?
Click to expand...
Not sure. I'm DLing & squating over my BW & I seem to be fine. I fuggin hate DL's & I get stiff after, but i gently stretch it out for the next day or 2.
 
hidngod said:
Not sure. I'm DLing & squating over my BW & I seem to be fine. I fuggin hate DL's & I get stiff after, but i gently stretch it out for the next day or 2.
Click to expand...


Hate DL's?? really? I haven't done them in a while cause of an injury and I miss them the most. I could do without squats. But DLs are the greatest thing ever invented.
 
KillahBee said:
A) post this shit in the training forum bro - people on C&C don't train, for the most part

B) personally, it's all about feel for me. At first I only used a belt when DLing heavy (for me), but then started using it all the time and it felt good. Some people will say that by using a belt all the time you are somewhat handicapping yourself, and I somewhat agree, but it's all about what works for you. I think using it for relatively "heavy" sets and up will do just fine.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I copied there as well, but I posted it here as well since I know there are a couple of powerlifters in here.

It makes sense. I will get one
 
If your back is bothering you at 250lbs then your form really needs to be checked. Honestly I'd drop the weights and work on form.

Also, what kind of core work are you doing. Weak core will carry over. You have to strengthen your abs, and your lower back in order to continue to increase in weights on your squat and dl. Reverse hypers, hypers, weighted ab work are all good to add in.
 
Frisky said:
If your back is bothering you at 250lbs then your form really needs to be checked. Honestly I'd drop the weights and work on form.

Also, what kind of core work are you doing. Weak core will carry over. You have to strengthen your abs, and your lower back in order to continue to increase in weights on your squat and dl. Reverse hypers, hypers, weighted ab work are all good to add in.
Click to expand...


and hammy work
 
Frisky said:
If your back is bothering you at 250lbs then your form really needs to be checked. Honestly I'd drop the weights and work on form.

Also, what kind of core work are you doing. Weak core will carry over. You have to strengthen your abs, and your lower back in order to continue to increase in weights on your squat and dl. Reverse hypers, hypers, weighted ab work are all good to add in.
Click to expand...

Currently doing solely, 5x5, which is basically 100% core work... this plan relies somewhat on overtraining before dropping volume (basically the premise of increased overload taken to the max).

I used to DL 250 and squat the same with no issue (again, once a week), so I really think the frequency (squats 3x/week and one day with squats+dl together) is getting to me... luckily is only 4 more weeks and Im done with it...

I will get the belt, I feel I can do more weight, though I'm taking it slowly not to risk an injury by being overly enthusiastic...

man, it sucks to be here were no examples to look at... I'm (so far as I have seen) the only person that DL in my gym... and the only that do full (olympic) squats... the other 2 guys that squat do the "funky-face-2-inch-range-of-movement" squat, while I get my ass to almost touch the floor...

lazy bitches and their machines...
 
pintoca said:
Currently doing solely, 5x5, which is basically 100% core work... this plan relies somewhat on overtraining before dropping volume (basically the premise of increased overload taken to the max).

I used to DL 250 and squat the same with no issue (again, once a week), so I really think the frequency (squats 3x/week and one day with squats+dl together) is getting to me... luckily is only 4 more weeks and Im done with it...

I will get the belt, I feel I can do more weight, though I'm taking it slowly not to risk an injury by being overly enthusiastic...

man, it sucks to be here were no examples to look at... I'm (so far as I have seen) the only person that DL in my gym... and the only that do full (olympic) squats... the other 2 guys that squat do the "funky-face-2-inch-range-of-movement" squat, while I get my ass to almost touch the floor...

lazy bitches and their machines...
Click to expand...

wait, you are doing squats 3x a week?!! man, that makes me cringe. my current disc injury is due to squatting 2x a week.
 
KillahBee said:
wait, you are doing squats 3x a week?!! man, that makes me cringe. my current disc injury is due to squatting 2x a week.
Click to expand...

Ouuuuuu

I agree... Yikes LOL
 
I decided to forego a belt early on this year with the intent of putting more work onto my core but I knew that I would be staying quite a ways off from my one-rep-max (1RM).

I suggest that if you are getting up around 80% of your 1RM you should probably wear a belt or back off the weight until your core and posterior chain firm up.

Incorporate hamstring-stretches after every workout. It removes a lot of stress and tension from the lower back. If you aren't doing abs work, do some at least twice a week and try to hit the whole pelvic girdle. Frisky's suggestions are good along with static bridges, front and side. Mix it up a little and try to work the whole core but don't burn it out.
 
KillahBee said:
wait, you are doing squats 3x a week?!! man, that makes me cringe. my current disc injury is due to squatting 2x a week.
Click to expand...
It's the 5x5. It works as heavy, light, medium. It's not as though he has 3 squat days, rather three days on which he squats. There's a big difference.
 
Blut Wump said:
It's the 5x5. It works as heavy, light, medium. It's not as though he has 3 squat days, rather three days on which he squats. There's a big difference.
Click to expand...

yep, I forgot to mention that...

thanks for the suggestion people. it's a good thing I sometimes remember some of you DO lift
 
pintoca said:
Currently doing solely, 5x5, which is basically 100% core work... this plan relies somewhat on overtraining before dropping volume (basically the premise of increased overload taken to the max).

I used to DL 250 and squat the same with no issue (again, once a week), so I really think the frequency (squats 3x/week and one day with squats+dl together) is getting to me... luckily is only 4 more weeks and Im done with it...

I will get the belt, I feel I can do more weight, though I'm taking it slowly not to risk an injury by being overly enthusiastic...

man, it sucks to be here were no examples to look at... I'm (so far as I have seen) the only person that DL in my gym... and the only that do full (olympic) squats... the other 2 guys that squat do the "funky-face-2-inch-range-of-movement" squat, while I get my ass to almost touch the floor...

lazy bitches and their machines...
Click to expand...
Ask them whether waving the bar 8 inches above their chest counts as a bench press. ;)

I didn't realise you were pressing on with the dual-factor version. The dual-factor version will work for you but it'll give you a lot more grief and fatigue than you need.
 
Have you played with bar placement or stance?
 
Frisky said:
Have you played with bar placement or stance?
Click to expand...

yep, on light days, knees not to wide apart, on heavy days more like Sumo stance... I just make sure no matter the feet angle that my back remains straight as a board during the whole movement.

I honestly think deadlifting is more complicated technique-wise than squatting, since the movement is more complex... I have to constantly keep an eye on the bar not scraping my knees
 
pintoca said:
yep, on light days, knees not to wide apart, on heavy days more like Sumo stance... I just make sure no matter the feet angle that my back remains straight as a board during the whole movement.

I honestly think deadlifting is more complicated technique-wise than squatting, since the movement is more complex... I have to constantly keep an eye on the bar not scraping my knees
Click to expand...

Exactly where is the bar placed on your back?

I have the cutest socks I wear for dl's lol, thick ass soccer socks that come all the way up to my knees, I can't tell you how many times i left the gym with my chucks, my socks and shorts and headed out shopping not realizing that I was looking like a freak. I got the crazy stares. haha.

My deadlift form is alot better than my squat form. It came really natural to me and I've never had to work on it. My squat form took me a little more time to find the perfect bar placement, stance, shoes, etc. I squated with a broom stick for weeks in my living room facing the wall with my toes nearly up against the base board to learn not to allow my knees to go forward and to learn how to sit back into it.

LOL, then my kids thought i was nuts. hee hee
 
A belt will ultimately do you a disservice as it will weaken exactly those muscles that you are feeling pain in. This will lead to injury faster.

I would just stay away from a belt.

My boss is a strength coach (I work in a gym) and he said he tries to discourage use of belts in lifts to the patrons that come in there.
 
Frisky said:
Exactly where is the bar placed on your back?

I have the cutest socks I wear for dl's lol, thick ass soccer socks that come all the way up to my knees, I can't tell you how many times i left the gym with my chucks, my socks and shorts and headed out shopping not realizing that I was looking like a freak. I got the crazy stares. haha.

My deadlift form is alot better than my squat form. It came really natural to me and I've never had to work on it. My squat form took me a little more time to find the perfect bar placement, stance, shoes, etc. I squated with a broom stick for weeks in my living room facing the wall with my toes nearly up against the base board to learn not to allow my knees to go forward and to learn how to sit back into it.

LOL, then my kids thought i was nuts. hee hee
Click to expand...

that is what you are holding in your avi??? a broomstick??
The bar goes below my traps,. not on my shoulders, as I have seen other people do.

The socks are to avoid scraping of the knees with the bar?
 
pintoca said:
that is what you are holding in your avi??? a broomstick??
The bar goes below my traps,. not on my shoulders, as I have seen other people do.

The socks are to avoid scraping of the knees with the bar?
Click to expand...


lol

Its a metal bar actually in my ava.

Thats my bar placement too. :)

The socks are exactly for that. Depends on how hard I hit the shins though, i've been able to escape the scrapes but i sometimes have had some awful bruises.
 
UA_Iron said:
A belt will ultimately do you a disservice as it will weaken exactly those muscles that you are feeling pain in. This will lead to injury faster.

I would just stay away from a belt.

My boss is a strength coach (I work in a gym) and he said he tries to discourage use of belts in lifts to the patrons that come in there.
Click to expand...
I think anyone who at all feels they can do without a belt should do so. Let the body's core do the job it was designed to do.

When you're drifting into max lifts (maybe not a good idea for anyone not competing) then the safety aspects for that lift may outweigh the general benefits of working belt-free.
 
Blut Wump said:
It's the 5x5. It works as heavy, light, medium. It's not as though he has 3 squat days, rather three days on which he squats. There's a big difference.
Click to expand...


I did Bigger Faster Stronger and it had squats 2x a week, heavy and light and I still fucked my back up BAD. Just giving a warning. Different people's bodies can handle different things.
 
Frisky said:
lol

Its a metal bar actually in my ava.

Thats my bar placement too. :)

The socks are exactly for that. Depends on how hard I hit the shins though, i've been able to escape the scrapes but i sometimes have had some awful bruises.
Click to expand...

I think that is indeed a broomstick... you were sweeping and then, suddenly thought, in a Rainaness attack "DAMN; I'm looking hot just now, gotta get me a pic while the hotness last"... so quickly went, grabbed the camera with the tripod and struck a posing routine while the camera was on auto-shooting the whole while.
 
pintoca said:
I think that is indeed a broomstick... you were sweeping and then, suddenly thought, in a Rainaness attack "DAMN; I'm looking hot just now, gotta get me a pic while the hotness last"... so quickly went, grabbed the camera with the tripod and struck a posing routine while the camera was on auto-shooting the whole while.
Click to expand...


LOL

ya got me :verygood:
 
unfortunately, i agree with KB.
a lifting belt is good for a few things- obviously, spinal safety, but it can help with your form (hard to over arch or extend with a 4" belt on), PLUS, keep your back warm.

for me, i wear it whenever i'm doing the heavier lifts, but take it off for most of my ancillary work. your belt should be made of leather/suade, NOT the velcro kind and should not be too narrow in the front
 
stilleto said:
unfortunately, i agree with KB.
a lifting belt is good for a few things- obviously, spinal safety, but it can help with your form (hard to over arch or extend with a 4" belt on), PLUS, keep your back warm.

for me, i wear it whenever i'm doing the heavier lifts, but take it off for most of my ancillary work. your belt should be made of leather/suade, NOT the velcro kind and should not be too narrow in the front
Click to expand...


I have a lever belt ;)
 
stilleto said:
levers are good, just hard to adjust in a pinch, but my next one might be a lever belt.
Click to expand...

Did you see the new one? Its double the price but you don't have to uscrew anything to adjust the size.
 
pintoca said:
Is there a "rule of thumb" for deciding when it might be a good idea to get a lifting belt?

I'm by no means a hevy lifter, currently doing 250lbs (5x5) in both squats (full squats) and deadlifts...However, my back is bothering me a bit... I'm sure form is in check, so i was wondering if there any "wives tales" rule.

Something along the line of ... "if you deadlift your BW you should be getting one of those belts, before you don't really need it"... or is it only common sense and I should simply go and buy it?
Click to expand...


Speaking as a powerlifter, DON'T use a belt unless you are going for a 1RM PR. Your core strength -- abs and spinal erectors -- is very important, and often neglected by lifters. Excessive use of a belt will leave your body reliant upon the extra support to your core.

There's a universal "use it or loose it" law when it comes to muscles... the spinal erectors are no exception. Strengthening these muscles will give your back/spine more support and protection. Also look into strengthening your hamstrings if you have back problems.
 
pintoca said:
I have to constantly keep an eye on the bar not scraping my knees
Click to expand...


Baby powder (not chalk) helps for DL friction.

You can tell a true PLer by the scars on their shins.
 
samoth said:
Baby powder (not chalk) helps for DL friction.

You can tell a true PLer by the scars on their shins.
Click to expand...

lol

My shins were to purty to risk too many scars. I do however have a few.

and Yep, I use baby powder, I like the fresh smell after the pull to... ;)
 
samoth said:
Speaking as a powerlifter, DON'T use a belt unless you are going for a 1RM PR. Your core strength -- abs and spinal erectors -- is very important, and often neglected by lifters. Excessive use of a belt will leave your body reliant upon the extra support to your core.
.
Click to expand...

this is slightly wrong.

core strength IS important, of course, and electromyographic research has found that there are lower levels of muscle activity in abdominal muscles when a belt is worn while lifting. The muscles that would normally keep the abdomen stabilized are inhibited when a belt is used, which could result in weaker abdominal muscles in the long run.

but, weightlifting belts can help support the back by increasing intra-abdominal pressure and preventing back hyperextension. They are most effective when used for maximal or submaximal lifts in which the spinal erector muscles work against heavy resistance.

so to only use it for 1rm lifts is putting yourself at risk for injury.
 
stilleto said:
but, weightlifting belts can help support the back by increasing intra-abdominal pressure and preventing back hyperextension. They are most effective when used for maximal or submaximal lifts in which the spinal erector muscles work against heavy resistance.

so to only use it for 1rm lifts is putting yourself at risk for injury.
Click to expand...


The whole pressure thing can be done by correct breathing and holding your breath, and hyperextention problems eliminated by proper form.

I come from the powerlifting mindset, which I know vastly differs from that of the traditional bodybuilders/weight trainers.

BTW, powerlifting in and of itself is putting yourself at risk for injury, lol.
 
For myself, my attitude is as Samoth advocates but I have the confidence that I have the core strength to hold my innards in place and maintain pressure while I make my lifts.

For anyone else, I give my personal approach and suggest 80% 1RM as the guideline figure for them as a balance between working on their core and staying safe.
 
samoth said:
The whole pressure thing can be done by correct breathing and holding your breath, and hyperextention problems eliminated by proper form.

I come from the powerlifting mindset, which I know vastly differs from that of the traditional bodybuilders/weight trainers.

BTW, powerlifting in and of itself is putting yourself at risk for injury, lol.
Click to expand...

i am a powerlifter.
and yeah, proper form is always what SHOULD be used, but if that were the case, nobody would ever get injured and we all know thats NOT what happens.
I'm not a bodybuilder, or ever have been one, but the use of a belt in the proper form is consistant across the spectrum, nomatter what your purpose of lifting is.
 
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