honestly.....there science is legit behind it......the price is a little high, but what do you expect....they produce there stuff at Phoenix Labs....and research out of there. So that of course is gonna cost alot. THere T2 and Md6 was wicked man...they got pulled off the shelf, just like the trans 4ad stuff ( some of it). I mean that AE-7 stuff is a lil new but the AE-5 is high quality stuff and the advance up from coleus( which i have been seeling to ppl in place of ephedra for a year) is sick. I lost 12 lbs on Forslean and held 5% BF for 2 month while on it. So in my book give it a month o 2 and then judge it.