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Friend had laser pointer confiscated at airport, WTF!!
- Thread starter PoyeBoy
- Start date
HappyScrappy
New member
do you think your friend can continue to live his life?
I know that if such a thing ever happened to me, I'd wish a swift death upon myself pretty much immediately.
I know that if such a thing ever happened to me, I'd wish a swift death upon myself pretty much immediately.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
PoyeBoy said:
Whether you like it or not laser pointers can be used to cause eye damage even from a distance. Given the 911 tragedy I think it is right to confiscate such things.
You might think it is over-reacting but if somebody had thought to misuse one on a plane everybody would have been complaining about it getting onto the plane in the first place.
Re: Re: Friend had laser pointer confiscated at airport, WTF!!
From my understanding, you have not had to go through the security in the US where common sense has been thrown out of the window. Why then would you support such frivolous abuse of power by the rent-a-cops?
Imnotdutch said:
From my understanding, you have not had to go through the security in the US where common sense has been thrown out of the window. Why then would you support such frivolous abuse of power by the rent-a-cops?
T
t3c
Guest
PoyeBoy said:
shut up man, i'd rather have tight security than lose security and so would you...and everyone else here
so stop the bitching, go to this ebay auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2051244207
buy 100 of them, so every time your asshole friend is dumb enough to take a laser pointer with him and have it confiscated, when EVERYONE knows damn well that they'll take away anything even remotely dangerous...you have another one as backup.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
Re: Re: Re: Friend had laser pointer confiscated at airport, WTF!!
You are right I havent been through US customs............it just seems to me that right now is not the time to ask for leniant customs (almost the 911 anniversary).
2Thick said:
You are right I havent been through US customs............it just seems to me that right now is not the time to ask for leniant customs (almost the 911 anniversary).
T
t3c
Guest
What the fuck, these guys are doing their job. They are the only thing that comes between a safe trip to your vacation home, and a one way ticket into a fucking building...don't you understand that?
T
t3c
Guest
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Friend had laser pointer confiscated at airport, WTF!!
On sept. 11 people bitched about horrible security blah blah blah, post sept. 11 people like bitch about hardcore security...some people just have to bitch about something
On sept. 11 people bitched about horrible security blah blah blah, post sept. 11 people like bitch about hardcore security...some people just have to bitch about something
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
2Thick said:
Sheep??!!! Fuck off. Just because we can see the sense in a particular line of action doens't make us sheep. Bottom line is no matter what, people would find something to whine about and that supposedly infringes their rights.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
PoyeBoy said:
A false sense of security? So it is not effective at all?
You know, it is the type of attitude that you are exhibiting that made the 911 tragedy possible in the first place. Some people never learn.
F
Frackal
Guest
Hey he could have shined it into the pilots eyes from the pilots rearview mirror and just the right moment and make it veer into DisneyLand or something
Imnotdutch said:
I thought you were above personal insults. In any case, he said that these people were the difference between a safe trip and a crash into a building. That line of thought is as about as sheepish as you can get. Realx and have a pint. It is just a discussion.
Imnotdutch said:
No, it is not very effective. The metal detectors filter out the real weapons and the ones that do get past will get past through other means so having some rude, hard-ass person seizing everything you own will only give a false sense of security.
The attitude that allowed for 911 rests squarely on US foreign policy and the CIA's actions (or inaction).
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
2Thick said:
If you were addressing what he said then you should have directed your insult at him. Sheep wouldnt sit and argue their point.........and I have had enough arguments on here for people to know better.
As for personal insults.........what I said was hardly personal. But calling somebody a sheep (and calling into question their personality) is just about as personal as it gets..........
PoyeBoy
New member
haha rearview mirror
and dutchguy, dont get so mad at me, America was built on a false sense of security, our people have always had the idea in their head that nothing will ever happen to us. I used to be that way at one time also, but i was very naive and young.
If someone wants something bad enough, they will find a way.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
2Thick said:
Ah f*ck.........misread a thread again. I'm sorry........
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
Well Poye, I'm not mad at you. And I agree with your comment about the idea the USA was built on. However, I still dont see the point in making it easy for anybody wanting to cause trouble.....
PoyeBoy said:
2Thick is right on. It is sheepish to think this is the answer.
Anyone who knows a fucking thing about security knows that a decent security system should never [/b have a single point of failure. That means computer networks, airport security, event security, etc.
Baggage screening is a single point of failure. Get past that and the show is over. This has already been proven.
Now, look at El Al. In addition to a thorough package search, they have reinforced cockpit doors that don't let the bad guys in.
So there are 2 points of failure.
Anotehr fundamental of security is that when a system is compriomised, it should bend or sag, but not break. One of El Al's rules is that no matter what, the pilots never come out.
Never.
El Al uses good security:
1. Check bags
2. Bad guys can't get in the cockpit.
3. Bend but don't break. Pilots never come out.
The worst case scenario: Someone gets a weapon on board and murders all the passengers. Tragic, but not the kind if catastrophe that happened 9/11/01.
And, the pilots land the plane safely, leaving teh hijackers to either kill themselves or face justice on the ground.
What we do here in teh US is just asinine. But it makes sheeple - I mean people...sleep well.
Anyone who knows a fucking thing about security knows that a decent security system should never [/b have a single point of failure. That means computer networks, airport security, event security, etc.
Baggage screening is a single point of failure. Get past that and the show is over. This has already been proven.
Now, look at El Al. In addition to a thorough package search, they have reinforced cockpit doors that don't let the bad guys in.
So there are 2 points of failure.
Anotehr fundamental of security is that when a system is compriomised, it should bend or sag, but not break. One of El Al's rules is that no matter what, the pilots never come out.
Never.
El Al uses good security:
1. Check bags
2. Bad guys can't get in the cockpit.
3. Bend but don't break. Pilots never come out.
The worst case scenario: Someone gets a weapon on board and murders all the passengers. Tragic, but not the kind if catastrophe that happened 9/11/01.
And, the pilots land the plane safely, leaving teh hijackers to either kill themselves or face justice on the ground.
What we do here in teh US is just asinine. But it makes sheeple - I mean people...sleep well.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
I am having difficulty in seeing why you think supporting strong checks prior to boarding makes people who support this sheep. Sutrely you need to strengthen each security point? Nobody said anything about not wanting other changes in the security of the whole system.
MattTheSkywalker said:
Fast Twitch Fiber
New member
The sad thing is that they have been doing tests of security at major airports and have found that REAL weapons are routinely being missed by security.
They say that the baggage checkers frequently don't open compartments inside of bags or don't dig deep enough to find well hidden weapons.
With the number of airports we have in this country I don't think it is possible to have good security. Airlines in Israel don't have the volume of flights that we have.
FACE IT WE'RE ALL GOING TO BE KILLED BY TERRORISTS!
They say that the baggage checkers frequently don't open compartments inside of bags or don't dig deep enough to find well hidden weapons.
With the number of airports we have in this country I don't think it is possible to have good security. Airlines in Israel don't have the volume of flights that we have.
FACE IT WE'RE ALL GOING TO BE KILLED BY TERRORISTS!
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
I used to work at a University with a guy who had to travel alot. He has personally seen guns get found and then let through........the reason? The baggage belonged to a good looking woman who flirted alot with the security guy. How pathetic is that? Of course this was prior to 911.............
Fast Twitch Fiber said:
Weapons still fly
at airports
News boards 14 jets with contraband despite security push
By MAKI BECKER and GREG GITTRICH
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS
An American Airlines passenger opens luggage for security personnel at checkpoint in Boston's Logan Airport.
Daily News reporter puts razor knife into his carry-on luggage. No secret compartments were used to hide contraband.
Carry-on bags concealing potentially deadly weapons. Six major airlines. Eleven airports. Fourteen flights. And not once did anyone catch on.
To test the supposedly more stringent security imposed at the nation's airports after the Sept. 11 attacks, Daily News reporters boarded flights over the Labor Day weekend carrying contraband - including box cutters, razor knives and pepper spray.
Not a single airport security checkpoint spotted or confiscated any of the dangerous items, all of which have been banned from airports and planes by federal authorities.
The four airports where the Sept. 11 terrorists boarded planes - Newark International, Boston's Logan Airport, Washington's Dulles International and Portland International Jetport in Maine - were all breached during The News' undercover investigation.
Kennedy and LaGuardia airports also failed, as did major international hubs in Los Angeles, Chicago and Las Vegas.
Smaller commuter depots weren't immune either, with Fort Lauderdale and Santa Barbara, Calif., flunking.
"That is really disturbing. It's actually beyond disturbing," said Harvey Kushner, an expert in terrorism and airport security and chairman of the department of criminal justice at Long Island University.
"It scares the hell out of me," said Kushner, who runs the security company Safer America and was waiting for a flight yesterday at Kennedy. "But it is not surprising. It underlines the massive problem that we have at our airports."
Same old slipups
The News' findings were almost identical to the results of a probe the paper conducted less than a month after the terrorist attacks, during which reporters got past checkpoints with dangerous items at 10 airports.
This time, The News found that the airports had implemented a range of security procedures since the attacks last year.
Guards consistently checked photo identification, sent luggage through souped-up X-ray machines, examined carry-on bags, wanded passengers with hand-held metal detectors and made many remove their shoes.
But it amounted to nothing more than a big show.
The new measures failed to spot the contraband items in The News' bags because of technological and human errors. Some of the most glaring:
A security agent at Newark insisted on passing our bag through an X-ray machine twice after spotting a tape recorder, cell phone, two-way pager and radio inside. She remarked: "You're pretty loaded up." It was 5 a.m. Few others were on line. But she never opened our bag - and had no idea she missed a rubber-handled razor knife and box cutter.
At Portland, two guards painstakingly picked through a reporter's laptop computer case and purse as other passengers filed onto a jet scheduled to depart for Boston at 1:50 p.m.
When one of the guards came across a matchbook in one of the bags, he said we had to carry it in a jacket pocket.
Neither of them found our rubber-handled razor knife.
At Santa Barbara, a ticketing agent escorted us to a security checkpoint around 4:40 a.m. We had been randomly selected to have our check-in and carry-on luggage searched. On the way, the agent joked: "You haven't taken any flying lessons recently, have you?"
The utility knife in our carry-on would not be discovered - despite X-ray and hand searches.
None of the instruments The News carried are illegal to possess outside airports.
However, most of the items are similar to those used by the Sept. 11 terrorists - and the Transportation Security Administration has banned them from secure areas of the airports and flights.
'Lot of work to do'
Federal officials - when told of The News findings - said they had inherited a broken system that they're busy fixing.
"We have a lot of work to do," said Leonardo Alcivar, a spokesman for Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta, who oversees the agency.
He insisted security has improved, pointing out that on any given day, the aviation system securely processes 5 million passengers.
The nation's airports are working to meet a Nov. 19 deadline for federally training security screeners.
The airports tested by The News relied on a combination of federal screeners, private companies and local and state police. In Los Angeles, a bicycle cop was peddling through the terminal.
On eight of the trips, News reporters were flagged as security risks - apparently because we had bought one-way tickets days before departing.
The designation typically meant the luggage we checked in was X-rayed or hand-searched and our carry-on bags were examined by hand at the gate.
But none of the agents who searched the luggage found the dangerous items.
Slapdash searches
During these random bag checks, agents typically peeked inside the bags, not bothering to unzip every pocket or remove all the items.
"All righty, you can get on the plane," a guard in Chicago told us after he finished a search that lasted little more than a minute. He missed a box cutter and a rubber-handled razor knife.
The airports and airlines tested by The News did not return calls or referred questions to federal authorities.
United Airlines also delivered a warning through spokeswoman Chris Nardella: "That is a violation of federal law that you guys knowingly took those items on an airline. You can be arrested." hahahahahah
George Naccara, federal security director at Logan International Airport, where The News slipped by checkpoints with a rubber-handled razor knife and corkscrew, said: "What you told me is troubling. Absolutely."
Naccara said razors are generally "very difficult to detect." But he added none of the items carried by The News would be considered "deadly or dangerous."
He said the two areas at Logan breached by The News are still staffed by nonfederal employees.
The security at Boston, Washington and Portland appeared to be more diligent than at the other airports, although they did no better in spotting the contraband.
Trying harder
At those three airports, guards X-rayed and unpacked most of our bags. But they still overlooked rubber-handled razor knives, a box cutter and a corkscrew.
Also, the random bag checks did not appear all that random on many of the flights. Before boarding, guards at several airports chose to search at least one passenger who appeared to be of Middle Eastern or South Asian descent.
The News also discovered that security employees appeared less diligent when searching our carry-on bags if we were cooperative and friendly - or demonstrated a familiarity with their routine.
At Los Angeles, a guard stopped his search a few moments after we pulled a two-way pager from our carry-on and showed him that it actually worked.
"You're used to this," the guard said. He wanded us with a hand-held metal detector and then added: "Have a good flight."
at airports
News boards 14 jets with contraband despite security push
By MAKI BECKER and GREG GITTRICH
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS
An American Airlines passenger opens luggage for security personnel at checkpoint in Boston's Logan Airport.
Daily News reporter puts razor knife into his carry-on luggage. No secret compartments were used to hide contraband.
Carry-on bags concealing potentially deadly weapons. Six major airlines. Eleven airports. Fourteen flights. And not once did anyone catch on.
To test the supposedly more stringent security imposed at the nation's airports after the Sept. 11 attacks, Daily News reporters boarded flights over the Labor Day weekend carrying contraband - including box cutters, razor knives and pepper spray.
Not a single airport security checkpoint spotted or confiscated any of the dangerous items, all of which have been banned from airports and planes by federal authorities.
The four airports where the Sept. 11 terrorists boarded planes - Newark International, Boston's Logan Airport, Washington's Dulles International and Portland International Jetport in Maine - were all breached during The News' undercover investigation.
Kennedy and LaGuardia airports also failed, as did major international hubs in Los Angeles, Chicago and Las Vegas.
Smaller commuter depots weren't immune either, with Fort Lauderdale and Santa Barbara, Calif., flunking.
"That is really disturbing. It's actually beyond disturbing," said Harvey Kushner, an expert in terrorism and airport security and chairman of the department of criminal justice at Long Island University.
"It scares the hell out of me," said Kushner, who runs the security company Safer America and was waiting for a flight yesterday at Kennedy. "But it is not surprising. It underlines the massive problem that we have at our airports."
Same old slipups
The News' findings were almost identical to the results of a probe the paper conducted less than a month after the terrorist attacks, during which reporters got past checkpoints with dangerous items at 10 airports.
This time, The News found that the airports had implemented a range of security procedures since the attacks last year.
Guards consistently checked photo identification, sent luggage through souped-up X-ray machines, examined carry-on bags, wanded passengers with hand-held metal detectors and made many remove their shoes.
But it amounted to nothing more than a big show.
The new measures failed to spot the contraband items in The News' bags because of technological and human errors. Some of the most glaring:
A security agent at Newark insisted on passing our bag through an X-ray machine twice after spotting a tape recorder, cell phone, two-way pager and radio inside. She remarked: "You're pretty loaded up." It was 5 a.m. Few others were on line. But she never opened our bag - and had no idea she missed a rubber-handled razor knife and box cutter.
At Portland, two guards painstakingly picked through a reporter's laptop computer case and purse as other passengers filed onto a jet scheduled to depart for Boston at 1:50 p.m.
When one of the guards came across a matchbook in one of the bags, he said we had to carry it in a jacket pocket.
Neither of them found our rubber-handled razor knife.
At Santa Barbara, a ticketing agent escorted us to a security checkpoint around 4:40 a.m. We had been randomly selected to have our check-in and carry-on luggage searched. On the way, the agent joked: "You haven't taken any flying lessons recently, have you?"
The utility knife in our carry-on would not be discovered - despite X-ray and hand searches.
None of the instruments The News carried are illegal to possess outside airports.
However, most of the items are similar to those used by the Sept. 11 terrorists - and the Transportation Security Administration has banned them from secure areas of the airports and flights.
'Lot of work to do'
Federal officials - when told of The News findings - said they had inherited a broken system that they're busy fixing.
"We have a lot of work to do," said Leonardo Alcivar, a spokesman for Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta, who oversees the agency.
He insisted security has improved, pointing out that on any given day, the aviation system securely processes 5 million passengers.
The nation's airports are working to meet a Nov. 19 deadline for federally training security screeners.
The airports tested by The News relied on a combination of federal screeners, private companies and local and state police. In Los Angeles, a bicycle cop was peddling through the terminal.
On eight of the trips, News reporters were flagged as security risks - apparently because we had bought one-way tickets days before departing.
The designation typically meant the luggage we checked in was X-rayed or hand-searched and our carry-on bags were examined by hand at the gate.
But none of the agents who searched the luggage found the dangerous items.
Slapdash searches
During these random bag checks, agents typically peeked inside the bags, not bothering to unzip every pocket or remove all the items.
"All righty, you can get on the plane," a guard in Chicago told us after he finished a search that lasted little more than a minute. He missed a box cutter and a rubber-handled razor knife.
The airports and airlines tested by The News did not return calls or referred questions to federal authorities.
United Airlines also delivered a warning through spokeswoman Chris Nardella: "That is a violation of federal law that you guys knowingly took those items on an airline. You can be arrested." hahahahahah
George Naccara, federal security director at Logan International Airport, where The News slipped by checkpoints with a rubber-handled razor knife and corkscrew, said: "What you told me is troubling. Absolutely."
Naccara said razors are generally "very difficult to detect." But he added none of the items carried by The News would be considered "deadly or dangerous."
He said the two areas at Logan breached by The News are still staffed by nonfederal employees.
The security at Boston, Washington and Portland appeared to be more diligent than at the other airports, although they did no better in spotting the contraband.
Trying harder
At those three airports, guards X-rayed and unpacked most of our bags. But they still overlooked rubber-handled razor knives, a box cutter and a corkscrew.
Also, the random bag checks did not appear all that random on many of the flights. Before boarding, guards at several airports chose to search at least one passenger who appeared to be of Middle Eastern or South Asian descent.
The News also discovered that security employees appeared less diligent when searching our carry-on bags if we were cooperative and friendly - or demonstrated a familiarity with their routine.
At Los Angeles, a guard stopped his search a few moments after we pulled a two-way pager from our carry-on and showed him that it actually worked.
"You're used to this," the guard said. He wanded us with a hand-held metal detector and then added: "Have a good flight."
Fast Twitch Fiber
New member
If they had hot chicks performing strip searches I would fly more often
Imnotdutch said:
first, teh single point of failure aspect of the system is in violation of every security fundamanetal there is.
Were thse checks incorporated into a strong plan, no one would bitch.
two, federalizing the operation of searching was used to pacify peole, and a ahell of a lot of Americans are not concerned about this issue. To them I say BAAHHHH. If teh shoes fits where it brother.
All that was done was raise the taxes and add surcharges on tickets.
Airport security has not improved.
Imnotdutch
butler monkey
Federalising the op was used to pacify alot of people?.......I would imagine that would be a good thing if a terrorist tried to get on a plane. Maybe we should unpacify the whole thing and let people carry whatever they want on a plane........yeah thats a bright idea. It doesn't make you a sheep to agree with this.......just smart enough to see whats necessary.
Oh and I agree with you on the problems on using only one point of control......I dont see anybody arguing with that.
One of these days I will actually figure americans out......
Oh and I agree with you on the problems on using only one point of control......I dont see anybody arguing with that.
One of these days I will actually figure americans out......
MattTheSkywalker said:
You know, I grew up in former Soviet Union, and this blind unquestioning following, which people tend to demonstrate here, in the USA, reminds me a lot of older communist generation. For a self proclaimed bastion of freedom this country has way to many rules. Enforced rules for that matter.... from criminal to social spheres. But I guess there is always a trade of between freedom and safety...and USA is very safe country.
PS:Yeah, they took my clippers but let my mach 3 thru, so I am happy
PS:Yeah, they took my clippers but let my mach 3 thru, so I am happy
gettinlarger
New member
PoyeBoy said:
Are you kidding me? It can resemble the laser from a firearm ...
Imnotdutch said:
Federalizing does not mean that crack FBI / Secret Service agents are going to be inspecting bags. The inspectors are the same lower socio-economic class they were before, except now the taxpayers are paying for it. It also means it will be harder to terminate sub standard workers.
While there are some standards in place to get qualified as a screener, I remain unimpressed.
My main problem is that the concept behind the system remains unchanged. That concept is inherently flawed.
thebabydoc
New member
Great point.Kodesh said:
This is a country founded on Freedoms and for those of you on this thread who haven't yet figured it out-- what we are seeing all over the US, not just in airports, is the loss of our personal freedoms. FACE IT, THE TERRORISTS HAVE ALREADY WON. They have used our political system (where everyone has to introduce a bill or a law so that the sheep will follow and vote for them) against us.
We have all had one thing confiscated at thye airport only to pass another through. For me it was a pair of forceps while the 6 surgical scalpel blades in the same dop kit passed though without a second look. The false sense of security that the sheep feel is laughable. We are in far greater danger now than ever before 9/11. Wake up for crying out loud!
The problem is that people keep carrying their shit on planes. This is the reason that we're waiting hours at the security check points: hey morons- try carrying NOTHING, loose the anger, and save the wait for the baggage carousel.
A few simple suggestions to preserve our "freedoms"
1. NO CARRY-ON BAGS LARGER THAN A LAPTOP or PURSE
2. ARMOR AND SEAL COCKPIT DOORS.
3. STUN GUNS IN COMPARTMENT OF SEAT IN FRONT OF EVERYONE.
