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Fonz: question about clenbuterol
- Thread starter chaquito
- Start date
chaquito said:
Yes, for a while we thought keto cleans beta receptors. People started using it, it was in many liquid formulas and it didn't do squat.
It turns out clen doesn't really down regulate beta receptors, more likely greatly upregulates Alpha receptors.
T3 on the other hand increases receptors in brown adipose tissue by as much 500% (clen's main effect are on brown adipose tissue) so the combination is simply amazing(VERY strong)
I'd like to hear Fonz's input
TheMuscleMonster
New member
is t3 something to be bought otc
TheMuscleMonster
New member
is t3 something to be bought otc
Judo Tom said:
I would start with clen only first (taurine throughout)
something like this: (assuming you are using T3 at 12.5mcg only)
W1: Clen
W2: Clen T3
W3: Clen T3
W4: Clen T3 Yohimbine
W5: Clen T3 Yohimbine
W6: Clen T3 Yohimbine
W7: T3 L-tyrosine
Something like this
IJ26 said:
There may be somewhat of a rebound, but the "rebound" you are refering to is not a concern with 12.5mcg
It's not really because the dose is low, it's because it is less than what the thyroid produces naturally (ie 20-25mcg ED)...so you are not really replacing T3 levels just upgrading them
IJ26 said:
T3 is not catabolic (here come the flames)
T3 is an extremely strong metabolic enhancer (calorie burning) that does not discriminate between lipids, amino acids and glucose.
12.5mcg helps you add muscle as it stimulates protein synthesis. (Higher dose do not, it breaks down more protein than it synthesis)
So will you need AS? You don't NEED it but it certain helps you keep your LBM whether you are dieting with drug or without.
BigAndy69 said:
Hey bro - I would tend to disagree with you there through personal experience - while I feel that T3 let me pass a plateau while dieting, I most definitely experienced muscle and strength loss that did not occur while using plain old thermogenics like clen. FWIW.
poantrex said:
Well, people tend to mislabel the word catabolic
Cortical Steroids are catabolic. They attack muscle tissue directly
T3 does not effect muscle tissue directly, it just burn an insane amount of calories whether they come from Protein, Carbs or Fat...it doesn't matter it burns it all.
If you ate 1000 calories a day you would lose muscle. Same thing goes with T3
That's why these insane doses 100mcg and up do not do anything more than burn muscle.
so as you increase the dosage you just increase total cals burned correct??
what if you just consistently maintained a high protein intake from whey and caesin. wouldnt your body use the increased protein intake for energy rather than actually breaking down muscle
also how much of a muscle sparring effect can roids combat muscles being burned for energy?
what if you just consistently maintained a high protein intake from whey and caesin. wouldnt your body use the increased protein intake for energy rather than actually breaking down muscle
also how much of a muscle sparring effect can roids combat muscles being burned for energy?
how much of a thyroid increase would u expect from the use of 12.5 mcg a day. Ive read your clen faq an have heard u say the 2 are an excellent combo and im very interested. Also how long would u recommend using the 2 together as u advocate that t3 allows u to use clen for an extended period of time. Im in the process of planning out my spring cutter and this sounds like a good stack
Judo Tom said:
You guys are asking for specific figures I don't really have.
All these 'what if' questions are relative. Everybody is different
I don't think anybody needs more than 50-75mcg
"how much of a thyroid increase would u expect from the use of 12.5 mcg a day."
It will put you in the higher range of Thyroid output. Basically, you end up in the high-normal - slightly high range.
Triple J said:
You take it all at once for the most part since T3 absorption can vary greatly depending on what food you have in your stomach
I suggest you take it all in the morning as soon as you wake up with nothing but water. Do not eat for 30-40mins
Honestly I think only legit pharmaceutical T3 by quality countries like canada, US should be used since the delivery system makes a huge difference
THeMaCHinE
New member
So, if you don't want to run the T3, you can start popping taurine and just stay on the clen instead of 2 on, 2 off?
THeMaCHinE
New member
How long off after 3 weeks on?
I already started, I'm on day 4. I read the clen FAQ -- thought I had it covered... Guess I better get some taurine...
I already started, I'm on day 4. I read the clen FAQ -- thought I had it covered... Guess I better get some taurine...
BigAndy69 said:
No flame...but T3 is proteolytic. Catabolic.
At the dosage you specfied(12.5-25mcg), your T3 levels will only be elevated to the upper-normal range, therfore increasing your overral metabolic effieciency. This is when you're NOT on AAS.
Any more than 25mcgs/day and T3 becomes catabolic to muscle tissue due to the fact it increases protein breakdown rates. As well as fat and carbs. But the main point is, you have to use AAS if you go over 25mcgs/day...in order to off-set T3's increase of your protein breakdown rates.
Fonz
BigAndy and Fonz:
I'm not interested in T3 at all and I'm totally ignorant about it, but I have a question anyway out of curiosity.
If all that T3 does is to burn more calories without discriminating between fat or muscle tissue, then what's the point? Eating less would have the exact same effect right? (Which is why you say that it is catabolic to the same extent as eating 1000 kcal a day).
The way I see it the only really useful drugs would be those that target fat differently.
Maybe it's useful after prolonged dieting has slowed down the metabolism too much?
Thanks.
I'm not interested in T3 at all and I'm totally ignorant about it, but I have a question anyway out of curiosity.
If all that T3 does is to burn more calories without discriminating between fat or muscle tissue, then what's the point? Eating less would have the exact same effect right? (Which is why you say that it is catabolic to the same extent as eating 1000 kcal a day).
The way I see it the only really useful drugs would be those that target fat differently.
Maybe it's useful after prolonged dieting has slowed down the metabolism too much?
Thanks.
J
Juice Authority
Guest
I will never take Clen or T-3 again. The headaches from clen were unbearable. T-rex and GH is fine for me.
ProteinFiend
New member
metabolism and protein synthesis are proportionate.
ProteinFiend
New member
Fonz said:
i guess what i meant was, as metabolism increases so does protein synthesis.
ProteinFiend
New member
BigAndy69 said:
interesting ... just curious.. but wouldnt breaking it down make it easier for the body to absorb? or does it break down into something else.... like waste nitrogen?
bicepts101
New member
good thread
bump for little rage
bump for little rage
BigAndy69 said:
Yes...very correct. BUT AAS off-sets this increase in protein break down.(Or even adds an extra boost)
And then you´re left with increased buring of FATS AND CARBS.
(Remember that T3 increases the burnin of fats, carbs, and proteins)
Thats why you get leaner when combining T3(say 75-100mcg/day). with some good androgens(at least 1000mgs/week).
Fonz
bicepts101
New member
Fonz said:
so what do you think is a better idea?
running it that way or at 12.5 mcgs for 10 weeks?
bicepts101 said:
25mcgs for 10 weeks. The higher dosages are really only needed if you´re getting ready for a show or event and want to go from 5% to 4%. You will not get a rebound from this dosage(25mcg) as long as you use 300mg 7-Keto DHEA 1 week before the cycle ends and then keep going for another 8 weeks. 7-Keto DHEA is fairly cheap btw.
Fonz
bicepts101
New member
Fonz said:
ok educate me on this. my knowledge on this is slim.
7-keto is what? if it not controlled where can i find it? im guessing its some kind of substance that help the natural function of the throid.
bicepts101 said:
Its a supplemment. Not controlled.
You can buy 7-Keto DHEA 100mg capsules from the Vitamin Shoppe. www.vitaminshoppe.com
Buy the Vitamin Shoppe brand, its usually 40% off.
7-Keto DHEA basically naturally raises levels of thyroid hormones(both T3 and T4) By doing this (in theory the de-iodinase enzyme is up-regulated by this time), the higher levels of T4 get enzymatically coverted to free T3, and are then added on to the already circulating free T3, boosting your T3 levels to the normal or upper normal range if they were low after your T3 cycle.
It can be taken indefinately. It has no side-effects to speak off except for the fact its a great immune system booster also. I use it all the time at 200mg/day.
Fonz
bicepts101
New member
Fonz said:
nice bro. i appreciate it. green coming your way
i especially like that it is good for the immune system
Fonz, do you supplement B12, the injectable form?
bicepts101
New member
AAP said:
the 7-keto is for thyroid suppression. so if your just using clen there is no need for it.
after 3 weeks on go 3 weeks off. many users go with using something like T-rex of ephedra on those week off from clen to keep the fat buring going
solidspine
New member
Clen is like any other suppliment, you build a tolerance,
I like it with a mild anabolic, and usually go for 21 days, taking as much as I can tolerate, then 7 days off and start over.
With out Cardio, I think you are wasting your money.
I like it with a mild anabolic, and usually go for 21 days, taking as much as I can tolerate, then 7 days off and start over.
With out Cardio, I think you are wasting your money.
jh1
New member
Fonz said:
That's one expensive habit, that crap ain't cheap.
Looks like you'd be better off going to Kilo Sports and capping your own. VitaminShoppe and other sources are running around $20+ for 3grams total. You can buy 25grams of the raw material at Kilo for 40. You have to spend the money for caps.. but still.
CLOMIDCLOWN
New member
is t3 necessary for an effective clen cycle?
i dont understand how people say that when you use low dose of DNP like 12.5-25mcg your theroid will not be supressed, but elevated to high range levels!!!
i have a friend whho used t3 for 4 weeks at 25mcg and did blood work for 3 weeks every week after he stopped. at first his thyroid was 60% supressed after 3 weeks his thyroid was 30% supressed from 25mcg
i have a friend whho used t3 for 4 weeks at 25mcg and did blood work for 3 weeks every week after he stopped. at first his thyroid was 60% supressed after 3 weeks his thyroid was 30% supressed from 25mcg
x_muscle said:
That's where Armour Thyroid comes in. I have chronicly low thyroid output and use it all the time now.
I am doing:
t3 fairly standard ramp up/down with double time at 75 on both sides followed by one month of Armour at 120 then back down to my maintaince of 60/day.
clen 60, going to 80 maybe....
var 50/day
levorex, 12/day
trex on the clen off weeks at 4/day, one per day with the clen
green tea extract, 45% ecgc, 2.5-3 grams a day
My resting body temp averages over a two week no thermo usage period at about 98 even: last night I was at 99.7 and I am sure higher than that in the middle of the night, I was HOT all over.
v shape
New member
I am going to use clen post cyle when I start my clomid/nolvadex. I already have my taurine, yohimbe hcl and ketotofin. I just wanted to know if 12.5 mcgs of t3 will be catabolic since I am in post cycle mode and not running any AAS.
Also I plan on doing the 2 weeks on/ 2 weeks off method , should I continue the t3 with ephedrine hcl during the off weeks?
Also I plan on doing the 2 weeks on/ 2 weeks off method , should I continue the t3 with ephedrine hcl during the off weeks?
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