Estrogen and fat

[wilson6]

After reading the papers that MS cited on the tamoxifen thread, it makes sense that tamoxifen is likely to have no effect or increase body fat vs a positive effect on fat reduction. So then I started thinking, perhaps an aromatase inhibitor a few weeks before a show might be the answer. Then I went back and looked at the tranny lit and put that together with the lit MS cited and decided that some E is necessary to maintain lower body fat levels and that the answer is not reducing E, but increasing T.

In the tranny lit, when F to M trannys are given testosterone, their E levels do not change. Only their T levels increase, but over time the % of regional fat in the abdomen, thigh and hip decrease by 17%, 26% and 23%, respectively. In addition, their leptin to fat mass ratio decreases. So perhaps the answer is not in trying to reduce E levels below early follicular phase levels, but to increase T levels to the upper end of the normal range?

Thoughts MS.

W6

 

[MS]

I absolutely agree, especially given estrogen's potent ability to reduce appetite as well. I think anti-E's may be even less useful to women in the last stages of a contest diet since most anti-Es only inhibit peripheral estrogen production, but this should be close to NIL anyway if you're very lean.

Although it was certainly misleading, I should have pointed out in the tamoxifen thread that tamoxifen may well be working through the same mechanism as estrogen. In other words, estrogen is an even MORE potent stimulator of leptin than tamoxifen, which is prolly why it decreases appetite. Maybe the answer is to supplement estrogen AND testosterone??? Wouldn't THAT be ironic??

 

[The Shadow]

Maybe the answer is to supplement estrogen AND testosterone??? Wouldn't THAT be ironic??

Estratest for ex?

 

[MS]

"Estratest for ex?"

I dunno. If you read the other thread here at the moment (ESTROGEN(premarin) and Test in a female??Help?), you'll see some other stuff that suggests that women may benefit from having normal or near normal estrogen levels to maintain a 'lean' body. Of course, these are not bodybuilding women and I can't guess how this might apply to very low %bf women with presumably very low estrogen levels, but adding in some test may boost both test AND estrogen without adding in extra estrogen into the mix. I just don't know. The research on estrogen and leaness also may be confounded by women with PCOS since that study found an inverse correlation between androgen levels and leaness. Since high insulin levels are known to increase test, I suspect the insulin rather than elevated test is the real cause of this correlation.

 

[wilson6]

T-gel or any ester would be my choice over Methyl-T, and the peripheral aromatization of T should provide enough E to maintain the physiologic effects of E even in a lean female. Don't think it is necessary to add E, just T.

W6

 

[spatts]

up

 

[gotmilk]

But wasn't tamoxifen made to reduce the increased estrogen levels that develop in areas around cysts, lesions, and tumors? I thought it was meant to be "spot specific" and not an overall estrogen reducer?

it makes sense that tamoxifen is likely to have no effect or increase body fat vs a positive effect on fat reduction.

 

[OXANDRIN]

interesting.........estrogen supresses hunger through increased leptin production ..... Maybe thats why i was so hungry on my 3 month femara experiment?

but also i lost weight and bodyfat during those 3 months so just the weight loss and fat loss should lower leptin and increase my hunger