Confused with diet. Please help!

[viczeva]

please check this out guys! The more input the better!

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/diet-bodybuilding/beastdrol-diet-plan-ok-740589.html

 

[jmat2407]

please check this out guys! The more input the better!

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/diet-bodybuilding/beastdrol-diet-plan-ok-740589.html

Like I already said and gymjunkie agreed, 16% dietary fat is to low. Up it and up your carbs. Doing that should take you from 3k calories a day to around 3500-3700. Which at 6'1 210 lbs is where you need to be for a nice lean bulk on the beast.

 

[Zyglamail]

Carbs are overratt3d in my opinion and if the GI of them is too high, which is often the case for grains/starches, it can easily cause fat retention even on reduced calories. I easily eat as much fat as I do carbs.

 

[jmat2407]

Carbs are overratt3d in my opinion and if the GI of them is too high, which is often the case for grains/starches, it can easily cause fat retention even on reduced calories. I easily eat as much fat as I do carbs.

That is a complete myth. GI is taken way out of proportion. Please show me one scientific study showing high GI carbs lead to more fat gain than eating low GI carbs.

Not to even mention when you eat a meal it usually has protein or fat with it. Protein, fats, or fiber all reduce the GI of the entire meal.

Here watch a video-

http://leanbodies.co.za/learn_giMyth.html

If you want actual scientific studies I will post those up as well.

edit: Sry if that came off as a little aggressive. Its just diet myths and the "no steroid burns fat only diet and exercise do" myth are two things that really grind my gears.

 

[Zyglamail]

That is a complete myth. GI is taken way out of proportion. Please show me one scientific study showing high GI carbs lead to more fat gain than eating low GI carbs.

Not to even mention when you eat a meal it usually has protein or fat with it. Protein, fats, or fiber all reduce the GI of the entire meal.

Here watch a video-

Low GI Myth

If you want actual scientific studies I will post those up as well.

edit: Sry if that came off as a little aggressive. Its just diet myths and the "no steroid burns fat only diet and exercise do" myth are two things that really grind my gears.

Depends on the state of your system when you eat. No one can argue that carbs cause the body to release more insulin, if your muscles are not depleted of their glycogen stores the insulin triggers storage of glycogen. If muscles/liver are full, where does it go?

Yes proteins and fats do slow down the digestive process of carbs but they still cant overcome an excess of crappy carbs.

As for you high GI myth link, he states you can not store fat without an excess of calories, thats absolutely false. What does he base "excess calories" on? A daily basis, weekly? Monthly? The fact is excess calories at the time of ingestion. As I said above if the liver and muscles are full of glycogen, where is it gonna go? If it were true that only excess calories accounts for fat gain, how come people on starvation diets fail to lose weight? Also his comment doesnt take into account that certain carbs, specifically HFCS, are foreign to our bodies and processed much like alcohol and as such a lot of the "carbs" get converted to fats right in the liver. There is plenty of research on this as well.

Next, if the GI of carbs means nothing we can talk about the epidemic of metabolic syndrome sweeping the globe but ill save that for another time.

 

[viczeva]

Like I already said and gymjunkie agreed, 16% dietary fat is to low. Up it and up your carbs. Doing that should take you from 3k calories a day to around 3500-3700. Which at 6'1 210 lbs is where you need to be for a nice lean bulk on the beast.

Update:

210lbs, 14%bf, 6'1 with a BMR of aprox 3200 (RMR of 2125 X 1.5)

Im consuming:

Protein 43%, Carbs, 34% and Fats 23%

Sugars 100
Carbohydrates 315
Fat 90
Protein 388
Cholesterol 533
Sodium 4398
Dietary Fiber 39

Calories Consumed 3,562
Calories Burned working out 500-700 (an hour or so of free weights)

I added some more fats, from cheese and milk. as well as added carbs from muscle milk and pasta. Does this look better?

Thanks bro.

 

[jmat2407]

Depends on the state of your system when you eat. No one can argue that carbs cause the body to release more insulin, if your muscles are not depleted of their glycogen stores the insulin triggers storage of glycogen. If muscles/liver are full, where does it go?

Yes proteins and fats do slow down the digestive process of carbs but they still cant overcome an excess of crappy carbs.

As for you high GI myth link, he states you can not store fat without an excess of calories, thats absolutely false. What does he base "excess calories" on? A daily basis, weekly? Monthly? The fact is excess calories at the time of ingestion. As I said above if the liver and muscles are full of glycogen, where is it gonna go? If it were true that only excess calories accounts for fat gain, how come people on starvation diets fail to lose weight? Also his comment doesnt take into account that certain carbs, specifically HFCS, are foreign to our bodies and processed much like alcohol and as such a lot of the "carbs" get converted to fats right in the liver. There is plenty of research on this as well.

Next, if the GI of carbs means nothing we can talk about the epidemic of metabolic syndrome sweeping the globe but ill save that for another time.

I never said, nor did he, that GI meens entirely nothing. It does, but not to the extent that most make it sound.

A meal consisting of 1/2 cup white rice and a 12 oz steak is about the same as 1/2 cup brown rice and a 12oz steak as far as GI is concerned after you factor in the protein/fat from the steak. Now is the brown rice a better and more healthy choice? Most of the time yes.

And an excess of anything can be stored as fat, weather it be High GI carbs, low Gi carbs, dietary fats, or even the loved and often overrated proteins.

 

[viczeva]

Re re re bump!

 

[Zyglamail]

Update:

210lbs, 14%bf, 6'1 with a BMR of aprox 3200 (RMR of 2125 X 1.5)

Im consuming:

Protein 43%, Carbs, 34% and Fats 23%

Sugars 100
Carbohydrates 315
Fat 90
Protein 388
Cholesterol 533
Sodium 4398
Dietary Fiber 39

Calories Consumed 3,562
Calories Burned working out 500-700 (an hour or so of free weights)

I added some more fats, from cheese and milk. as well as added carbs from muscle milk and pasta. Does this look better?

Thanks bro.

If your trying to cut some more BF, get rid of simple carbs and processed foods. Think about adding aome short (ie less than 15 minute long) HIIT/tabatta/CF style workout to the mix to cause EPOC additional fat loss.

 

[gymjunkie09]

If your trying to cut some more BF, get rid of simple carbs and processed foods. Think about adding aome short (ie less than 15 minute long) HIIT/tabatta/CF style workout to the mix to cause EPOC additional fat loss.

he's bulking bro..I understand that you can do both at the same time he's already confused at it is......this is the 3rd thread he's posted one the same topic and iv'e replied to all 3, apparantly he doesn't believe me lol

 

[Zyglamail]

he's bulking bro..I understand that you can do both at the same time he's already confused at it is......this is the 3rd thread he's posted one the same topic and iv'e replied to all 3, apparantly he doesn't believe me lol

Well shit, not sure how I missed that, maybe assumed fat loss cause cals are so low. Eat MORE, but id still skip simple carbs and processed foods. Keep the diet clean while eating more to keep fat gains to a minimum. Whole milk is always good while bulking if you dont have any issues with lactose.

 

[Zyglamail]

The way I see it diet is pretty simple regardless of what you want to do. Start by ditching processed foods which includes bread/pasta etc. Next establish baseline caloric needs by tracking workouts and diet, stay consistent with both for a couple weeks and see what your body does, are you adding fat or losing fat? are you adding muscle or losing muscle? Pick a workout to meet your goals, if its to lose fat then do that while trying to find your caloric needs, if its to add mass, then do that while trying to figure your caloric needs. The workouts your doing can have a HUGE impact on caloric needs so if your not doing the workout to meet your current goals then the caloric needs while following that workout are worthless. Once you find your maint level, if you arent super lean, just add a couple hundred clean cals a day. If your say <12% you will probably need to up it a bit more. If on cycle can get by with more than a couple hundred extra a day as well.

Its really not rocket science, but it takes some time to dial everything in.

 

[viczeva]

he's bulking bro..I understand that you can do both at the same time he's already confused at it is......this is the 3rd thread he's posted one the same topic and iv'e replied to all 3, apparantly he doesn't believe me lol

It's not that i dont believe you! i just wanted as much input as possible. There are a lot of different views on this board. Some say that by only going 300 cals over maintanace they get 10lbs on beast, some other say you need to go atleast 1000 cals over maint at minimum. Which explains my confusion.

I've doubled the fat content from my original post (now almost 100g) as well as have added 700 calories to my daily caloric intake. so you see, i do listen, lol.

The sugar comes from yogurt (bout 26g), shakes and sweet potatoes.

im not eatin any complex carbs, except for once a day... which is pasta, that i have to eat because im at work and dont have that many choices. im eating 6- 7 times a day, and im consuming about 2g of protein per lbs.

my carbs come from oats, sweet potato, pasta, cereal (its complex, but i love the taste), cottage cheese and english muffins.

im currently consuming a bit over 3700 calories, with a 44p/34c/22f % spread. Which means im eating over 500 calories over maintenance daily.

For lean gains, is this still not enough?

 

[viczeva]

CURRENT CALORIE INTAKE - IGNORE ALL OTHER!

210lbs, 14%bf, 6'1

Im consuming:

Calories Consumed 3670

Protein 43%, Carbs, 34% and Fats 23%

Sugars 89
Carbohydrates 318
Fat 94
Protein 395
Cholesterol 565
Sodium 4208
Dietary Fiber 38

Calories Burned 500-700 (an hour or so of free weights)

im eating a total of 7 meals a day, 3 of which are Protein shakes (aprox 60 g of Protein each) in order to maintain a high level of Protein. Eating actual food is quite difficult while at work, hence the shakes, which i have in between real meals. Due to the shakes, im also taking GEAR, in order to help out the absorption of protein.

Supps:
N2guard
Gear
Bridge (double dose)
Taurine (3g)

If you guys need me to, i could also post my diet. thank you.

 

[Zyglamail]

It's not that i dont believe you! i just wanted as much input as possible. There are a lot of different views on this board. Some say that by only going 300 cals over maintanace they get 10lbs on beast, some other say you need to go atleast 1000 cals over maint at minimum. Which explains my confusion.

I think the two main issues people face is for starters they dont know what their maintenance caloric intake is. They go on cycle and change their workout so what was maint before isnt maint any more.

The next issue is how much excess fat are you willing to put on to gain muscle? A lb is only ~3500 cals. 500 extra cals a day will basically feed an additional lbs of bodyweight BUT if your body has excess fat, it can be tapped into for energy as well so with only 200-400 extra cals a day you still can conceivably gain more than a lbs of muscle a week while losing fat but the scale wont accurately reflect mass gains. because you are trading out some fat for muscle.

If your not concerned with adding a bit of extra fat while bulking then by all means eat 1k cals more than you are now just keep in mind that often times cutting cals to lose fat means you lose some hard earned muscle. Personally I prefer the slow and steady approach where I gain mass and lose a tad of fat at the same time or at least dont gain much fat. But Im old so dont get ride of fat as easy as I used to.

my carbs come from oats, sweet potato, pasta, cereal (its complex, but i love the taste), cottage cheese and english muffins.

Aside from the cottage cheese, my personal opinion is these are all poor carb choices but if your bulking its not a big deal.


Unfortunately there is no one size fits all plan, your going to have to experiment a bit and see what works for you.

 

[lartinos]

I agree with Zyg for sure.

 

[viczeva]

I think the two main issues people face is for starters they dont know what their maintenance caloric intake is. They go on cycle and change their workout so what was maint before isnt maint any more.

The next issue is how much excess fat are you willing to put on to gain muscle? A lb is only ~3500 cals. 500 extra cals a day will basically feed an additional lbs of bodyweight BUT if your body has excess fat, it can be tapped into for energy as well so with only 200-400 extra cals a day you still can conceivably gain more than a lbs of muscle a week while losing fat but the scale wont accurately reflect mass gains. because you are trading out some fat for muscle.

If your not concerned with adding a bit of extra fat while bulking then by all means eat 1k cals more than you are now just keep in mind that often times cutting cals to lose fat means you lose some hard earned muscle. Personally I prefer the slow and steady approach where I gain mass and lose a tad of fat at the same time or at least dont gain much fat. But Im old so dont get ride of fat as easy as I used to.

Aside from the cottage cheese, my personal opinion is these are all poor carb choices but if your bulking its not a big deal.

Unfortunately there is no one size fits all plan, your going to have to experiment a bit and see what works for you.

i definetly have some extra fat since im at 14-15% bf. My goal for this cycle is to gain the least amount of fat as possible, while gaining the largest amount of lean muscle. if i can lose some fat, then thats a bonus.

i just wanna make sure im getting enough calories to get the benfit of beastdrol. i dont need to gain 20 lbs, but i dont wanna gain less than 10 either...

Gaining lean muscle is key for me on this cycle.

Thanks bro.

 

[gymjunkie09]

Ur gonna get a lot if different opinions on diet because everyone is different.....you have to find what works for YOU.....which is trial and error... bottom line if u wanna put mass on u have to eat alot...if ur concerned about fat then eat clean and keep ur carb intake at 30%