Blackouts = Damn you hippies!

[Razorguns]

and the damn liberal media for not pointing the finger where it should be.

Once again, environmetalists. Caring about that poor spotted own.


Let's talk California:

PER CAPITA we use the least amount of electricty in the country due to our wonderful climate. but...PER CAPITA our energy prices are by far the highest.

Why? Because we are NOT allowed to build new energy producing plants in the state. Nuclear? Hell no, efficient, but expensive oil? NO WAY, Coal? Heads would roll. Instead we get to build tiny peaker plants that run off of natural gas and cost a fortune to run. We drive up prices because we steal all available Nucealr and coal power from Nevada, Utah, Arizona, etc. and we suck the hydro power dry from the Northwest. What has happened lately? Energy usage has gone WAY up...but production levels have remained constant because no one can build new efficient plants.

This past weekend energy loads were up 10,000MWs from this same time last year. Last year people were talking about record energy usage around 40GW for California ISO. This past weekend we were reaching above 50GW. That's enough to send Marty McFly back to the future 45 times.

Society is so stupid. Let them suffer then.

 

[juiceddreadlocks]

so people and their overusage and refusal to conserve play no part in this?

 

[Lestat]

so people and their overusage and refusal to conserve play no part in this?

ding ding ding

 

[juiceddreadlocks]

Wonderful climate? You're in semi-arid land, have to ship your water in from 100 miles away, live close to a fault line...

 

[nimbus]

speaking of blackouts i havent seen anybody get blacked out for a while

 

[mrplunkey]

so people and their overusage and refusal to conserve play no part in this?

Right! Those Californians should just break-out the candles and start walking everywhere.

Conservation is a great principle as long as I'm not the one that has to do the conserving.

 

[Gambino]

so people and their overusage and refusal to conserve play no part in this?

your dodge and two stroke watercraft are terrible on fuel economy olo

 

[Razorguns]

so people and their overusage and refusal to conserve play no part in this?

why should we? should we also cut off immigration, cuz more people means more energy consumption?

Why should we stifle progress and prefer instead to live in the 1800's?

We have solutions, but the spotted owl is more important than 81 human lives dying in a city w/o power, and children in the ghetto sleeping in hot rooms.

 

[Lao Tzu]

Right! Those Californians should just break-out the candles and start walking everywhere.

Conservation is a great principle as long as I'm not the one that has to do the conserving.

Conservation is also R&D into technology to make energy efficiency better. Refrigerators use about half the energy they did 30 years ago for example, if not less. The reality is with higher efficiency in building standards and higher efficiency appliance usage energy can be cut by 50% or more with no real noticeable lifestyle changes.

My understanding has always been that deregulation caused the crisis, not environmentalists. As far as cheap energy, wind turbines are cheaper than coal and they are being built en masse in California right now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis#Causes

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/blackout/california/

By the early 1990s, electricity rates in California were on average 50 percent higher than the rest of the U.S. In 1995, the state legislature unanimously passed a bill to open the industry to competition, but now consumers are paying almost twice the rate they did before deregulation, and suffering rolling blackouts. Here's a summary of the events.

 

[mrplunkey]

Conservation is also R&D into technology to make energy efficiency better. Refrigerators use about half the energy they did 30 years ago for example, if not less. The reality is with higher efficiency in building standards and higher efficiency appliance usage energy can be cut by 50% or more with no real noticeable lifestyle changes.

My understanding has always been that deregulation caused the crisis, not environmentalists. As far as cheap energy, wind turbines are cheaper than coal and they are being built en masse in California right now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis#Causes

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/blackout/california/

By the early 1990s, electricity rates in California were on average 50 percent higher than the rest of the U.S. In 1995, the state legislature unanimously passed a bill to open the industry to competition, but now consumers are paying almost twice the rate they did before deregulation, and suffering rolling blackouts. Here's a summary of the events.

Californians decided they were "above" such filthy industries as energy production and didn't ease regulations that encouraged plant construction. In a deregulated environment they decided they'd purchase their power from other states who guess what? Decided to jack-up prices because they could. So what is the key learning here? If you decide you are "above" something, you better be prepared to pay through the nose for it if you need it.

 

[juiceddreadlocks]

your dodge and two stroke watercraft are terrible on fuel economy olo

hey I dont live in an area with a real stressed power grid. I also live in a more temperate climate than the almost desert of most of southern california.

 

[juiceddreadlocks]

This looks like a chicken or the egg type argument. Was there a reason that uber liberal organizations like the California Air Resource Board came online? Or were they just brainchildren of ''environmentalist hippies'' wanting to stifle progress?

 

[Lao Tzu]

Californians decided they were "above" such filthy industries as energy production and didn't ease regulations that encouraged plant construction. In a deregulated environment they decided they'd purchase their power from other states who guess what? Decided to jack-up prices because they could. So what is the key learning here? If you decide you are "above" something, you better be prepared to pay through the nose for it if you need it.

Yeah that did play a big role. I definately don't agree with their stance on nuclear and California may have held itself to environmental standards that were too high for the energy production technology of 1990. Back then many forms of clean energy weren't affordable. But as of 2006 there are numerous methods of making cheap renewable energy including geothermal, stirling engines, wind turbines, biomass, nuclear and more are coming. Their current goal is 33% of energy from renewables by 2020.

http://www.energy.ca.gov/renewables/

 

[mrplunkey]

Yeah that did play a big role. I definately don't agree with their stance on nuclear and California may have held itself to environmental standards that were too high for the energy production technology of 1990. Back then many forms of clean energy weren't affordable. But as of 2006 there are numerous methods of making cheap renewable energy including geothermal, stirling engines, wind turbines, biomass, nuclear and more are coming. Their current goal is 33% of energy from renewables by 2020.

http://www.energy.ca.gov/renewables/

Yes, but public projects that start in 2006 finish in... 2010 or longer if they are lucky.

 

[starfish]

RG....you crack me up.


I've lived in 3 states. Texas, Arizona, and California and my electric bill is much LOWER here than any other place I've lived.


Stop consuming so much