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Any day traders here???
- Thread starter jb160
- Start date
jb160 said:
I've been trading net profitable for a few years now.
Don't buy into any bullshit you see on T.V. You need a broker who'll charge you commissions, add those to the fees you'll pay to the "Trend Trading" service and you might as well be broke.
If you are serious about going full-time, find a prop shop that will fund your training period (expect to go at least 3 months without getting paid, if at all) and go to town.
If you are just planning on dabbling part-time, SEC rules dictate that you must have 25,000 equity to day-trade. There are many ways around this, however.
If you can become profitable (and I don't mean two hundred bucks a day profitable) then there is no better job.
wnt2bBeast
New member
there are trend traders there are counter trend tradersjb160 said:
arbitrage traders
its almost as dumb as the channeling stocks commercial lol..these people are the ones stealing your money..sure it looks good and you may even have a few winners but bottom line is theyre a rip off lol
hamstershaver
New member
your stock will go nowhere because you dont payback
wnt2bBeast
New member
bran987 said:
saw one today or yesterday lol
Dirk Howat
New member
An earnings momentum investor is not day trading.
What you are refering to is called TA, or technical analysis.
BTW,
I double my cash every year.
.
What you are refering to is called TA, or technical analysis.
BTW,
I double my cash every year.
.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
you do realize earnings momentum can be forged as well dont you?
earnings willnot help you get in and out of a financial product on a daily or hourly basis
Dirk Howat
New member
wnt2bBeast said:
Of course. You look at real earnings which takes away one time exceptions.
Such as:
tax credits
legal breaks
.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
huh????
theoretically what is the price of a stock related to?
Dirk Howat
New member
In the long term, the stock price equates to the companies instrinsic value.
Current price usually equate to the estimate of its future earnings.
Current price usually equate to the estimate of its future earnings.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
not bad..so if jackass analyst uses a messed up disconting rate i can make the stock equal to whatever i want it to be in 6 months..hence henry blodget and the internet bubble..then i get my ass'sitants to come up with a nice little story about the stock that jives with my analysis and ten igive it to my sales force to seel to the dim witted public but first i try to give it to the big hdge funds and institutions
Dirk Howat
New member
Henry Bloget.
He was not an security analyst but rather a salesmen or politican type who went on t.v. to pump and dump a firms stock.
You have to become a security analyst yourself.
He was not an security analyst but rather a salesmen or politican type who went on t.v. to pump and dump a firms stock.
You have to become a security analyst yourself.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
whatever his name was from merril
i traded on the street for 7 years..id never be an analyst..theyre very anal lol
Dirk Howat
New member
Trading is a losers game.
Take away uncertainty.
Takes eductation and due diligance.
Take away uncertainty.
Takes eductation and due diligance.
Dirk Howat said:
Maybe if you are an idiot like you who can only double a $300 account.
I've posted 3000 percent gains on my 40k account (meager, I know - but honest) for three years straight.
Perhaps YOU are a loser's game.
You know that for every dollar I, or Goldman, Lehman, Morgan, NITE, SCHB, etc... makes - chumps like you have to lose.
You must trade an Ameritrade account.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
buy and hold is for suckers and those too afraid to put their foot in the water
rsnoble-im-back
Banned
dio_9944 said:
where/who could I see to learn about this??
Dirk Howat
New member
wnt2bBeast said:buy and hold is for suckers and those too afraid to put their foot in the water
"Suckers"
You should know better.
Institutions must be suckers then.
That is a joke.
Its about making money.
What did you do specifically and why did you get out?
I have read about most of the great investors.
They are buy and hold.
To back up my claim:
Read the books, The Money Masters and the New Money Masters.
The only short term trader I esteem is GerarldLeob. I read his autobio and read his book called "The Battle For Investment Survival" which has some good tips for any investor.
I.e. concentrated portfolio
know the company
follow type II analysis to look for momentum
Get out quick of a bad situation
Let your winners ride
But there alot of great books on investing especially books on Warren Buffett who made 40 billion using the same basic type of technique I use.
What Stock market books do you recommend would be investors?
.
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FreakMonster
New member
Dirk Howat said:
Where are you coming up with this shit? I personally have friends who are daytraders making $1 million a year. It's definitely not a losers game if you know what the fuck your doing.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
first off institutions do get ripped off some are "suckers" how the hell do you think goldman makes money????
second i dont trade stocks..mostly commodities, options and currencies..im involved in arbing and market making
only suckers buy books on how to make money lol
you wanna learn read "Liars Poker" "Riding the Bull" or Victor Niederhoffer's "education of a speculator"
Dirk Howat
New member
FreakMonster said:
What are their names.
Tell me about their investment philosophy.
Think about liquidity.
Dirk Howat
New member
wnt2bBeast said:
Are those books?
Not shit, you learn by practice with real cash.
Bet to test it out, and then when you confident throw 100 percent of your cash in.
Read Loebs book.
Stay out and wait for the opportunity and throw all into it.
I made 50 percent in 2 weeks.
I went through my learning experience for my first 6 months where I broke even, but I want to be wealthy, so I read and read, to master the game.
Now I am confident as hell, and I throw all my cash in.
wnt2bBeast
New member
FreakMonster said:
those are very few and far between..they are the lucky ones..most people will bomb out and lose everything
Dirk Howat
New member
" first off institutions do get ripped off some are "suckers" how the hell do you think goldman makes money???? "
They play the momentum game and some sucker people.
Its a world of survival of the fittest which is why I like it.
No pc shit.
No equality and blaming others.
You are on your own
to make money or lose it.
by your skills
.
They play the momentum game and some sucker people.
Its a world of survival of the fittest which is why I like it.
No pc shit.
No equality and blaming others.
You are on your own
to make money or lose it.
by your skills
.
Dirk Howat
New member
wnt2bBeast said:
The deal:
I read a stat that 70percent of daytraders or more LOSE money.
Its a fact that they try to hide from you.
The more transactions you make, the richer they become.
They used to make money on spreads between bid and ask, this now narrowed, now they focus on trade commisions and IPOs.
Dirk Howat
New member
dio_9944 said:
I have more then $300. Think 6 digits in my account.
The only advantage that institutions have is that they get pre released info before the bell rings.
Their disadvantages are tremendous.
They have to diversify their portfolio to at least 20 stocks. While I can throw it all in one in which I know better then they do. Read Peter Lynch, alot of these guys do not even know the companies they are invested into. They are invested into many stocks because everyone else is. See the tech crash.
Liquidity.
I have greater liquidity.
I can hold longer because I do not have worry about monthly quotas.
wnt2bBeast
New member
Dirk Howat said:
i would think its higher..
most people think its so easy to be a day trader..you have to ask yourself why is it that Goldman's traders all went to Wharton and im gonna walk off the street and out trade them??? just isnt gonna happen
i skipped B'school and got my education on the floor..i would never wal nito a day trade shop and expect them to teach me to trade ..yeah right lol
Dirk Howat
New member
wnt2bBeast said:
Sounds like a stressful job.
Its another fraud propagated by rich people to get more money. Capitalism. Yo. You have to get over your egoism and look objectivily at the situation.
.
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FreakMonster
New member
Well I'm not giving out names but one of them is my brother.Dirk Howat said:
rsnoble-im-back
Banned
u know then again cause i like to sleep till 1pm everday maybe this wouldnt be good 4 me afterall. when i get disability ill prob get a part time job that will pay for another large laon and just buy tons of toys and beers
A
Alright123
Guest
keep this goin yo
rsnoble-im-back
Banned
Sugarplum said:
well if u were refering to me im kinda trashed right now so cut me some levis
Dirk Howat said:
That is confusing.
What does that mean?
And when you say that you throw all your cash into one trade----good for you. If it works, more power, but you will get cleaned out.
As for books, The beast suggested a couple of good ones, also try The Market Wizards series, as well as The Underground Trader by Jea Yu, and Pristine made a good beginner book as well.
Cheapies....ASTM in 20k blocks has been alright, drying up now though. VITX, STEM, TMTA, TASR got real cheap real fast.
hamstershaver
New member
examples pleasebran987 said:
bran987 said:
Yes, it is fairly unreal to imagine that people take advantage of the intraday fluctuations in stock price. Not only that, but that some people do it EVERY day.
jb, I said it in my first post. Join a prop firm, expect to lose cash for at least three months straight. Most new traders suffer from undercapitalization. The beauty of a prop firm is that you can just throw 5g's at it and get 4-10 margin on it, but that leads to huge losses for some traders.
The hurdle for most is mentality. Taking losses is mandatory but humiliating for some. Mark Douglas wrote a book, The Disciplined Trader - a good starting point.
bran987
New member
well let me just point to a post about this from one of these unbelievable daytraders who says they earn HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars per year, making hundreds of percentage point return on their money!hamstershaver said:
He gave me a tip! Here is the link
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4335243&postcount=49
It was at $1.47 when he recommended it. $2.00 by Monday eh? Not only is it not at $2.00 it is down 15% in one week to $1.25
kunta is a nice guy I was just illustrating a point.
The point is daytraders have their ego wrapped up in their jobs, they all want to justify what they do and they all want to pretend to be "Trader Vic" Victor Sperandeo, who I had dinner with he was pretty cool, but the fact of the matter is most of them are full of shit. He's one of the greatest traders ever and he told me how ti goes. If they make a mint one year and lose their ass 5 of the other 6 they'll only mention the one good year. And the best part is now they will all write messages about how I'm not "in the know" and "boy are they glad there are sheep like me out there so they can reap ALL THOSE JUICY PROFITS!"
The only ones that make money trade in firms using a proprietary system and if they break those rules they get in trouble. 95% of those people make enough to make a living and that's it. Maybe 1 in 500 can make money on their own at home consistently, and for them to all be in this thread is just hilarious. and those may be lucky to return 50% per year, 3,000% consistently is just stupid to even say.
Have fun pretending to be Gordon Gecko you guys.
bran987
New member
kunta you are a really nice guy and not a jackass like some of the other people, it's nothing personal.kunta said:lol ok
i bought i @ 1.37 and sold on the rug pull @ 1.43 small profit....
in AANI @ .92 now 1.08 lookking for 1.20
in SPSC @ 1.76 now 1.85 looking for 2
keep doubting people like us while we laugh all the way to the bank
hamstershaver
New member
wouldnt you say that day trading was only good during the nasdaq boom? hammy knows nothing about stocks btw
bran987 said:
Weak, weak point.
You're "illustrating" not a day-trade, those are defined as trades closed by the bell. 4:00 EST.
You seem to have a problem understanding that people can and do make money in various markets. I trade primarliy NASDAQ but also the DAX.
Granted, most people do lose cashish, and plenty flaunt their "jobs" as flashy wall street cocksmokers. But myself, and a group of folks like me in our group not only pull out a living but also a bit of spending cash.
If you want an example of EASY cash, yesterday on Level 2 (if you don't know what that is, then you can't argue with me) NFSC showed 1002 on the ask.
SWIPE.
I pounded for all I could (only 8k) and sold two cents later.
$160 bucks in two seconds.
Not huge cash, but tell me a better pay rate.
Happens all day long.
bran987
New member
I know what nasdaq level 2 is.dio_9944 said:
Maybe after I finish selling out this building and retire I can come play around with you guys, it sounds like a lot of fun.
hope you caught the sarcasm there
p.s. if you could lose a trade in 2 seconds I think you should be watching the screen and not chatting on EF!!!
bran987 said:I know what nasdaq level 2 is.
Maybe after I finish selling out this building and retire I can come play around with you guys, it sounds like a lot of fun.
hope you caught the sarcasm there
p.s. if you could lose a trade in 2 seconds I think you should be watching the screen and not chatting on EF!!!
I, and every trader lose on many trades. Anyone who attests to the opposite is a liar or the greatest trader ever.
p.s. I took today off.
Real estate?
I wish you the best.
Dirk Howat
New member
dio_9944 said:
Liquidity means the ability to get in and out quickly.
I do not know the average $$ amount an institution invests in a stock, but it is probably over a million.
I have only a couple hundred grand. I use a tier system to move in out of smaller companies.
Cheap is only relative to its future earnings power.
Getting cleaned out?
If you mean, I do not have alot of disposable cash, you are probably right. I prefer to make my money growth.
As far as cleaned out as losing money. Very unlikely. Its very mathmatical. Use probablity theory.
Risk is about probability.
If you know 95 percent that you will make money. Invest 100 percent.
If you know 60 percent that you will make money. Invest nothing.
Probability equates to risk.
You just have to be accurate in your assesment of the companies future.
Big mistake traders make (and myself) is holding a losing stock too long. If you can discipline yourself to sell the losers, then you're going in the right direction.
I don't day trade, but buy and sell over the course of a day or two... 7, it does'nt matter, as long as I make money. It's a part time thing. I've made $30k + in one month, only to lose it the next. Wild freaking rides. I come here joking around on Ef while I'm down about $12-$18k for that day. lol
I've backed off a little now because of time contstraints, but it's definately something I would like to do if given the opportunity.
Take a stock like ORCL Oracle. It fluctuates so much and with such volume that you can do anything with it. Just get to know the stock and keep trading that one stock, or two or five... Just know them and you'll soon learn their movements. It;'s not written in stone of course, but you'll have an upperhand on it.
I'm SOOO glad I made money in the tech boom and built my house. That's R-E-A-L Estate. Now it's just spending money I try and make. No other big purchases.
I don't day trade, but buy and sell over the course of a day or two... 7, it does'nt matter, as long as I make money. It's a part time thing. I've made $30k + in one month, only to lose it the next. Wild freaking rides. I come here joking around on Ef while I'm down about $12-$18k for that day. lol
I've backed off a little now because of time contstraints, but it's definately something I would like to do if given the opportunity.
Take a stock like ORCL Oracle. It fluctuates so much and with such volume that you can do anything with it. Just get to know the stock and keep trading that one stock, or two or five... Just know them and you'll soon learn their movements. It;'s not written in stone of course, but you'll have an upperhand on it.
I'm SOOO glad I made money in the tech boom and built my house. That's R-E-A-L Estate. Now it's just spending money I try and make. No other big purchases.
wnt2bBeast
New member
stocks suck 
trade some futures and options..much more fun
trade some futures and options..much more fun
wnt2bBeast
New member
bran987 said:yeah and pokemon cards rock too
i made a lot of money off the little kiddies in my hood with pokemon cards..
dont overlook them
Dirk Howat
New member
dio_9944 said:
This is how I did it in the begining. Tracked the top 50 rated companies and looked the greatest percent decrease then bought expecting it get a nice pop at the end of the day. Worked nice for around 8 trades until, I bought a top rated company which went down 8 percent in a day, I held for the next day, it went down 20 percent that day, the next day another 8 percent. At that point, I started to do more research on the companies I bought and read alot more books.
My record since I developed my investment philosophy is a 60 percent gain in 6 months, around $130,000.
.
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A
Alright123
Guest
Would you be so kind and share with us your investment philosophy in greater detail ?
Dirk Howat
New member
A
Alright123
Guest
The Hamaraz Financial Group's motto is "Superior People obtain Superior Results." This reflects our business philosophy as well as our investment strategy.
LMFAO
LMFAO
Dirk Howat
New member
Sugarplum said:
Yah, I found it today. I rarely check out the chat list.
About superior people etc.......
It true, superior people tend to make more money in business then mediocre people. Look at Bill Gates. Invest in geniuses. One of the key factors to look at when you invest in a company is looking at the quality of management. Are they competent, incompetent, or superior in their ability to maintain and gain market share.
flex229
New member
im a trader, I know and some of you people in this thread are either full of shit or really fucking lucky....dont ever think that just because you made some great gains during a bull market that you are some kind of financial genius.
Here's a quote from Jesse Livermore's "Reminiscences of a Stock Operator" that probably applies to a lot of people in this thread: "A great many smashes by brilliant men can be traced directly to the swelled head- an expensive disease everywhere to everybody, but particularly in Wall Street to a speculator."
It's a great quote....hell, ive committed it to memory...maybe some of you posting in this thread should take note.
Here's a quote from Jesse Livermore's "Reminiscences of a Stock Operator" that probably applies to a lot of people in this thread: "A great many smashes by brilliant men can be traced directly to the swelled head- an expensive disease everywhere to everybody, but particularly in Wall Street to a speculator."
It's a great quote....hell, ive committed it to memory...maybe some of you posting in this thread should take note.
Dirk Howat
New member
flex229 said:
Good quote.
Take out your ego. Ever hear of Evenitis? Its when you buy a stock which you misguide and because you are egotistical and do not look at the situation objectively, you hold on to it expecting it to bounce back but never does.
Like I said, trading is a losers game.
Smart investing is for winners.
