41yo: HRT question regarding HCG & Anti-estrogen

[cmn]

I am 41. Recent blood work showed 440 total test level (270-1070 range), 10.5 free test (don't know the range).

Doctor prescribed 100mg test cyp a week.

He did not prescribe HCG or arimidex/nolvadex. I asked...he said they wouldn't be necessary
at 100mg/week.

I am 5' 11", 225lb, 15%bf. Been in the gym for 25 years...started getting fat recently.

My goal is to get my total range back up to about 1000...ideally gain a little strength and
drop back closer to 10%bf.

Can I run 100mg/wk of test cyp without HCG and anti estrogens without ill effects?

It would seem that if I'm just taking my levels back to the high end of normal, estrogen
wouldn't be a problem. But I don't know.

I am more concerned about no HCG but also plan to be on test for the long haul and wonder
about adding HCG forever.

I've been sitting on this bottle of test for a week because I'm not sure I should start it without
HCG.

Also, I plan to inject myself in the outer quad...are there any landmarks/nerves to be avoided?


Any advice appreciated.

 

[Zyglamail]

Ive your test level is 440 on 100mg/wk of test then you dont really need any anti-e. Generally the anti-e comes into play when your test levels are >1000 AND you have a naturally high E level to begin with, which many people with low test also suffer from, often due to obesity.

HCG is a whole different animal all together. Adding HCG to your treatment will serve 2 purposes. First it should trigger the testes into releasing test and likely one reason many docs dont like to prescribe it. They prefer to have a single source of Test to worry about and monitor (ie injected test). The other benefit from HCG is simply that after some time on HRT your testicles will shrink because they wont be producing test. HCG will plump them back up. Its by and large a vanity/cosmetic thing but heck who wants a pair of marbles hanging?

I would give it some time and wait to see if you notice some sever shrinkage and if you do bring it up to your doc and ask what can be done. If he says "nothing" once again ask him about HCG and let him know your own research indicates many HRT docs will prescribe HCG if for no other reason that to restore the size of your testes.

 

[Headholio]

You are in the normal range for test! (the way I read it, 440 is your natural production before the prescription, right?).
Do you have symptoms? I'd think long and hard about committing to weekly injections for the next 40 years. Work out more and eat better and get re-tested in a few months, would be my suggestion.

 

[cmn]

Zyglamail -- It was 440 prior to the first injection. And thank you for your response.

Headholio -- I did think about it a great deal. In the end, being at the lower end of the total range at only 41 yo
and the low free test number tilted the scales. A weekly injection or three (test and hcg) seems like a very low
price to pay to feel stronger and healthier. My libido has always been healthy but I was putting on fat in the
mid section and losing some strength despite a clean diet in the summer and a good diet the rest of the year.
Historically, I'd stay <10%bf in the summer, 12% the rest of the year...in the last 18 months, I slid to 14-15%bf
and have had trouble dropping without calorie restriction sufficient to effect strength.

I think test therapy will be/is a very good thing for many; however, I think that if the protocol is undertaken
too late, it will be like polishing crap. It might look a little better, but it's still crap.

In the end, I am/was getting old. If, in a year, I don't feel like the test therapy has made a worthwhile difference,
I'll run the best pct that I can afford and go back to natural.

cmn

 

[Headholio]

Zyglamail -- It was 440 prior to the first injection. And thank you for your response.

Headholio -- I did think about it a great deal. In the end, being at the lower end of the total range at only 41 yo
and the low free test number tilted the scales. A weekly injection or three (test and hcg) seems like a very low
price to pay to feel stronger and healthier. My libido has always been healthy but I was putting on fat in the
mid section and losing some strength despite a clean diet in the summer and a good diet the rest of the year.
Historically, I'd stay <10%bf in the summer, 12% the rest of the year...in the last 18 months, I slid to 14-15%bf
and have had trouble dropping without calorie restriction sufficient to effect strength.

I think test therapy will be/is a very good thing for many; however, I think that if the protocol is undertaken
too late, it will be like polishing crap. It might look a little better, but it's still crap.

In the end, I am/was getting old. If, in a year, I don't feel like the test therapy has made a worthwhile difference,
I'll run the best pct that I can afford and go back to natural.

cmn

I hear you man. I mean, its tempting. What do you want, more test or less? More of course! But, just to put it into perspective, I benched 395 weighing 190 age 45 with test level a little less than yours being clean over 20 years. I didn't worry about my number because I felt ok.

If I started on HRT at that time I might have been stronger and felt better. But I'm glad I didn't. That was 6 years ago. I'm still not on HRT, but still thinking about it.

 

[cmn]

Just curious, Head.

Have you noticed much strength dip in the last six years?

What about your t level? Has it fallen much?

What's your plan?

cmn

 

[Headholio]

Just curious, Head.

Have you noticed much strength dip in the last six years?

What about your t level? Has it fallen much?

What's your plan?

cmn

Yes it has dropped. In fact, I found this site when researching HRT. I'm still benching about 275x6 but that's not what it used to be, and overall, I have less energy in the gym. Sex drive and erection quality has also decreased a bit, but I'm still hopping on my wife most every day of the week, so I guess its all relative. A few years ago, my wife had just about had enough of my never ending desire.


I started using natural T boosters from what I learned here. I'm always skeptical about natural supps, but I have found they work.
I think eventually I am destined for HRT, but I'm in no hurry.