2nd Cycle (with questions)

[Ampsycho]

Greetings. Just started my 2nd cycle and I'm hoping you guys can give me some feed back about this.

First stats:
Age:39 Height: 5'10.5" Weight: 175lbs Body Fat: 8.2%
Training: Since 16

12 week Cycle:
Test Cyp: 500mg per week
Boldenone Undecylenate: 400mg per week
Anti-estrogen:
Anastrozole: 0.5mg every other day
Other: HCG 50 IU per week (To keep test production going)

Diet is generally pretty clean about 300g Carbs (plus or minus) from oatmeal, whole grain rice and bread and some pasta. 200g Protein (plus or minus) from mostly ground turkey, some chicken breast and good ole' fashioned protein powder. Averaging about 2700-3200 calories a day depending o the day.

Training : Mon: Shoulders, Tues: Hams, Wed: Bi's & Tri's, Thurs: Back Fri: Chest, Sat: Rest, Sunday: Quads
Alternate days Abs/Obliques. Calves: Daily

OK, so I started my first cycle at 175lbs with 12% BF, went down to 165 and put on 10lbs of solid muscle. I'm about 3 weeks into my second cycle and felling generally good but the gains are still REALLY slow. Is this just due to the way BU works or am I simply not eating enough. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Ftsk]

Greetings. Just started my 2nd cycle and I'm hoping you guys can give me some feed back about this.

First stats:
Age:39 Height: 5'10.5" Weight: 175lbs Body Fat: 8.2%
Training: Since 16

Cycle:
Test Cyp: 500mg per week
Boldenone Undecylenate: 400mg per week
Anti-estrogen:
Anastrozole: 0.5mg every other day
Other: HCG 50 IU per week (To keep test production going)

OK, so I started my first cycle at 175lbs with 12% BF, went down to 165 and put on 10lbs of solid muscle. I'm about 3 weeks into my second cycle and felling generally good but the gains are still REALLY slow. Is this just due to the way BU works or am I simply not eating enough. Averaging about 2700-3200 calories a day depending o the day. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

How long is this cycle, can't just write wat ur taking and not specify weeks man come on!

 

[Ampsycho]

Sorry chief, noob mistake.
Both first and this one are 12 weeks.

 

[Texas Monster]

Post your diet. And training. Then we can access the situation.

In general the gains from test cyp and eq are slow so you are right on track. For test cyp it takes about 5-6 weeks to start to feel it kick in. Eq takes around 6. I would of kick started the cycle with some tbol, or some abombs.

 

[Ampsycho]

Post your diet. And training. Then we can access the situation.

In general the gains from test cyp and eq are slow so you are right on track. For test cyp it takes about 5-6 weeks to start to feel it kick in. Eq takes around 6. I would of kick started the cycle with some tbol, or some abombs.

Post updated. Thanks!

 

[MattJS]

You gotta be patient bro 3 weeks is nothing, agree with texas if you want quicker results better to use an oral to kick-start the cycle eg dbol for first 5 weeks, but you live and learn so you can do this on your third cycle....wouldn't expect much for another few weeks yet... Also those calories are very low... I'd try for 3.5-4k minimum and see how that treats you.

 

[Ampsycho]

You gotta be patient bro 3 weeks is nothing, agree with texas if you want quicker results better to use an oral to kick-start the cycle eg dbol for first 5 weeks, but you live and learn so you can do this on your third cycle....wouldn't expect much for another few weeks yet... Also those calories are very low... I'd try for 3.5-4k minimum and see how that treats you.

Thanks chief!
Am I overly concerned with eating clean?
Just asking because it's hard for me to eat that many calories without straying a little to the dark side.

 

[dylangemelli]

you can definitely eat that amount of calories and do it clean...

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/d...n-gemellis-diet-you-asked-so-here-879663.html

 

[Texas Monster]

Diet looks pretty good. If you would like to see better gains though you will have to increase your protein significantly. I would recommend having your protein intake around 350-400g as well as adding in some good fats.

Now for Training: If you are looking to make some really descent gains you will have to realize the hardest part of training is resting and recovery. I can allready tell that you are not able to fully recover just by your split. You only have 1 day between your back and leg split. That is not enough time for your back to recover before doing your leg workout. If this is enough time for you to feel recovered for you leg workout then you are definitely sandbagging during the hopefully included "squat" portion of your workout. Your back and legs need the most time to recover and recquire the most amount of focus and intensity in your workout. I think we have found the problem in your "gains".

1. Not enough rest time in your split
2. Lack of training intensity and not enough weight.

Try adding in at least 3 rest days in your split, and do not focus on training your abs so much. They will definitely get stronger if you are lifting correctly ie: maintaining a strong core during any of your bar lifts. You do need to work and train your abs but at most 2x a week and you train them with the same mentality as any other muscle group such as using increased resistance to failure. Thats it!!!!!!!!! Same thing for the calves there is no need to train them everyday. 2 times a week is plenty considering how much you use them in all of your standing lifts such as squat, bent over row etc etc.

I would like to see you on a split more like this.
Monday Shoulders and Triceps
Tuesday Back Calves
Wednesday off
Thursday Chest Bis
Friday Quads, Hammis
Sat Off
Sun Off

Now I will give you an example of my workout to give you an idea of the level of intensity that I must train at.

Sample Back Work Out

Dead lift: With power resistance bands
2 warm up sets : 225:275
4 working sets at 6 reps each: 315:405:495:585

Bent over Row: No need to warm up you should be pumped allready
6 working sets
3x10 overhand
3x10 underhand

overhand sets : 275:315:365
Underhand sets : 275:315:365

Tbar Row
3 working sets x 8: 5 plates, 6 plates, 7 plates.

Lat Pull down
4x 12

Hyper With Resistance Band
3x 10

Sample Leg Workout

Squats
2 warm up sets: 275:315
4 working sets x 6reps: 405:495:585:675

Leg Press
4x 20
Weight( Usually dont calc just count plates) + 50 for the sled
Sets: 1 770 total : 16 plates plus sled
2 950 total: 20 plates plus sled
3 1130 total: 24 plates plus sled
4 1220 total: 26 plates plus sled

Good Mornings
4x10 at 225

Ham string curls
4x12

Now there is no way that after doing either one of these workouts would I ever dream of taking only one day off between them.

I do not mean to post this to try to brag or boste. I post this so that you can get inside information on how a pro trains.

Take this into consideration when thinking about how you are training and ask yourself a few questions.

1. Am I really training at maximum intensity and giving past my effort to move this heavy ass bar.
2. Is my diet consistent with my training and goals. Ie if you want to gain weight you need to have protein and lots lots lots of it. 2g per pound at least ( your on gear which means increased protein synthesis so yeah we want that in our system)
3. Am I really fully recovered from the previous workout to keep training. A good way to know is taking notes on your training itself. For me I can tell that I am fully recovered just on the amount of pump I get. When I am fully recovered when I lift it feel like I can not move some of my body parts without fear of them popping off my bone and this pump lasts a few hours afterwards. When I start to hit over training I will still have a pump but it will quickly reside shortly after the workout and my mental focus will start to fade.

I hope this was some of the advice that you were looking for.

 

[Ftsk]

Diet looks pretty good. If you would like to see better gains though you will have to increase your protein significantly. I would recommend having your protein intake around 350-400g as well as adding in some good fats.

Now for Training: If you are looking to make some really descent gains you will have to realize the hardest part of training is resting and recovery. I can allready tell that you are not able to fully recover just by your split. You only have 1 day between your back and leg split. That is not enough time for your back to recover before doing your leg workout. If this is enough time for you to feel recovered for you leg workout then you are definitely sandbagging during the hopefully included "squat" portion of your workout. Your back and legs need the most time to recover and recquire the most amount of focus and intensity in your workout. I think we have found the problem in your "gains".

1. Not enough rest time in your split
2. Lack of training intensity and not enough weight.

Try adding in at least 3 rest days in your split, and do not focus on training your abs so much. They will definitely get stronger if you are lifting correctly ie: maintaining a strong core during any of your bar lifts. You do need to work and train your abs but at most 2x a week and you train them with the same mentality as any other muscle group such as using increased resistance to failure. Thats it!!!!!!!!! Same thing for the calves there is no need to train them everyday. 2 times a week is plenty considering how much you use them in all of your standing lifts such as squat, bent over row etc etc.

I would like to see you on a split more like this.
Monday Shoulders and Triceps
Tuesday Back Calves
Wednesday off
Thursday Chest Bis
Friday Quads, Hammis
Sat Off
Sun Off

Now I will give you an example of my workout to give you an idea of the level of intensity that I must train at.

Sample Back Work Out

Dead lift: With power resistance bands
2 warm up sets : 225:275
4 working sets at 6 reps each: 315:405:495:585

Bent over Row: No need to warm up you should be pumped allready
6 working sets
3x10 overhand
3x10 underhand

overhand sets : 275:315:365
Underhand sets : 275:315:365

Tbar Row
3 working sets x 8: 5 plates, 6 plates, 7 plates.

Lat Pull down
4x 12

Hyper With Resistance Band
3x 10

Sample Leg Workout

Squats
2 warm up sets: 275:315
4 working sets x 6reps: 405:495:585:675

Leg Press
4x 20
Weight( Usually dont calc just count plates) + 50 for the sled
Sets: 1 770 total : 16 plates plus sled
2 950 total: 20 plates plus sled
3 1130 total: 24 plates plus sled
4 1220 total: 26 plates plus sled

Good Mornings
4x10 at 225

Ham string curls
4x12

Now there is no way that after doing either one of these workouts would I ever dream of taking only one day off between them.

I do not mean to post this to try to brag or boste. I post this so that you can get inside information on how a pro trains.

Take this into consideration when thinking about how you are training and ask yourself a few questions.

1. Am I really training at maximum intensity and giving past my effort to move this heavy ass bar.
2. Is my diet consistent with my training and goals. Ie if you want to gain weight you need to have protein and lots lots lots of it. 2g per pound at least ( your on gear which means increased protein synthesis so yeah we want that in our system)
3. Am I really fully recovered from the previous workout to keep training. A good way to know is taking notes on your training itself. For me I can tell that I am fully recovered just on the amount of pump I get. When I am fully recovered when I lift it feel like I can not move some of my body parts without fear of them popping off my bone and this pump lasts a few hours afterwards. When I start to hit over training I will still have a pump but it will quickly reside shortly after the workout and my mental focus will start to fade.

I hope this was some of the advice that you were looking for.

How's about priority training instead? During a cycle is the best time to being up lagging body parts

 

[Ampsycho]

Diet looks pretty good. If you would like to see better gains though you will have to increase your protein significantly. I would recommend having your protein intake around 350-400g as well as adding in some good fats.

Now for Training: If you are looking to make some really descent gains...

This was exactly what I was looking for thank you all!
I'll start updating this week and check back with my progress in a few.

Thanks again, you guys are awesome!

 

[Texas Monster]

How's about priority training instead? During a cycle is the best time to being up lagging body parts

You bring up lagging body parts based on how hard you train them and place them in your split accordingly. However you still need to be working each muscle group in order to bring up the lagging body parts.

Example say that my back was lagging behind my shoulders and chest. Now in order for your back to grow you still have to incorporate using your shoulders during these workouts so it is still smart to keep training your shoulders.

The only difference is that you would place your lagging body parts in the split where they will get the most time to rest and have had the most time to recover from your previous workout.

 

[Ftsk]

You bring up lagging body parts based on how hard you train them and place them in your split accordingly. However you still need to be working each muscle group in order to bring up the lagging body parts.

Example say that my back was lagging behind my shoulders and chest. Now in order for your back to grow you still have to incorporate using your shoulders during these workouts so it is still smart to keep training your shoulders.

The only difference is that you would place your lagging body parts in the split where they will get the most time to rest and have had the most time to recover from your previous workout.

U are confusing urself. Speaking from personal experience, I had a weak back but everything else was where it needed to be, obviously u should only priority train during a bulk or aas cycle or else doin it in a cut or defecit (not on aas) will yield no gains and be counter productive.
Mon- back
Tues- shoulders/bi's
Weds-rest
Thurs- chest/tri's
Fri- back
Sat-legs
Sun- rest
Did this split for 16weeks and was more than happy with the results.

By wat u said in 2nd paragraph, u seemed to think that bringing up laggin body parts meant paying less attention to others which we all know is retarded right?
And also interpreting wat u said in paragraph 3 about rest and recovery u seem to think that a lagging body part should be trained less in order for it to recover and therefore improve?

Finally if u are on aas and have lagging body parts u should hit them hard atleast twice a week with 2-3 days rest in between. U don't have to follow set muscle groups for set days wen I cycle I train one body part every 3 days and wen I'm off I train a 2 on 1off split (depending on my goals)