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 Elite Fitness Bodybuilding, Anabolics, Diet, Life Extension, Wellness, Supplements, and Training Boards
 Diet Discussion Board
 Ketosis
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| Author | Topic: Ketosis | ||
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Cool Novice 
Posts: 23 |
Hi im currently on a ketogenic (maybe 100 g fat, 140 g prot. 5-10 carb..) diet.. no carbs on weekdays.. and loading on weekends.. u know the rest.. soo.. gots a a few questions.. 1)when i started i felt much less hmm... like my muscles shrunk.. less filled.. is that because there are almost no carbs in them or have HAVE actually shrunken? 2)hehe im eating peanutbutter.. just curious.. thanks..    | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 16 |
Ripped - 1) Don't know for sure, but I've heard just what you said: Low carbs = softer muscles. 2) 2 tablespoons PB has around 6 grams carbs. 3) I've done the ketogenic diet twice. The 2nd time around I definitely got into ketosis. Loaded up on carbs on Sat and Sun, then about 10 grams carbs during the week. Hit ketosis on Wed. I was doing around 75-80% fat, and the rest protein.  | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
Hey thanks for the quick reply Scotty! just one more question..  how did u know u went in ketosis on wed?? thanks, . | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
BUMP How would i know exactly when (and if) im in ketosis?? thanks! =) | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder 
Posts: 207 |
Ripped- Yes, YOUR MUSCLES HAVE SHRUNK......kidding, it is just what you said, no blood glucose in the muscles. On the weekends when you carb up you should start to become full and the monday and tuesday morning workouts should bring a good pump.....this is what I experienced. As for length it takes to get into ketosis......It took me until tuesday afternoon which is rather fast. I was using Alpha Lipoic Acid @ 500mg/day until ketosis was reached. I used Ketostix to see when and if I was in ketosis. They are made by Bayer (makers of aspirin), you can get them at the local pharmacy......if you can't find them look for diastix....they measure blood glucose and ketones.....diabetics use them. lomaximo | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder 
Posts: 306 |
1.) The softer/flatter muscles that you are experiencing are due to the loss of muscle glycogen, water, and hopefully as much fat as possible. This is normal for any person that is in ketosis. The loss of muscle glycogen (as well a liver) is what you're trying to accomplish while establishing ketosis. Just think of a balloon full of water, Cherry Kool-aid, and oil. You empty it out are varying conditions, and it will seem flatter/not as full. The point of the carb-up is to re-glycogenate your muscles to repair any damage that was inflicted upon them while being in ketosis from the previous week. There are other benefits of the carb-up, but you get the point right? 2.) Peanut butter is fine for some, and not fine for others. I personally do not react well with peanut butter, and I also find that once I get 1 tablespoon in my mouth, it is hard to stop at that. Just keep track of the total carb intake for the day, and if you are knocked out of ketosis, then you can make adjustments. Me, I don't like to fool around too much, especially on a CKD, which only gives you 3-5 days to be inb ketosis. I just hold-off until the weekend. 3.) Uh...I forgot the Q for #3. Hang-on. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 306 |
#3. The rate at which you will enter ketosis depends on a few things. 1. How glycogenated the muscles, and mainly, the liver get throught the carb-up. 2. Cardio and weight training will help deplete glycogen, thus quickening your descent into ketosis. 3. What types of carbs you ate while carbing-up (ie fructose 4. When you stop your last carb meal. 5. Whether or not glucose disposal agents are being used. Ex's: Insulin, glucophage, ALA, Chromium, Magnesium, etc.... 6. How much protein is contributing to gluconeogenesis. Due to too much protein on the weekdays, To an extent, maybe, and I mean maybe, how insuligenic the protein is that you are eating. But I find this to be negligible since the fats you are eating also slow down the absorption rate of these proteins too. I have never had a problem with whey because I always eat it with some kind of fat. But, it may be different if you just mix it with water. 7. And of course, how many carbs you are digesting each weekday. *There are other possibilities that I can name, but they are still up in debate, therefore i will not mention them. Hope this has helped. If you have any more questions fell free to ask. Good luck man. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 306 |
As I pressed the "submit" button, I thought of one other thing. 8. How many fats you ingest over the weekend will effect this, as will your last couple of meals before ending the carb-up. | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
1) hehe ok *smile* get the point.. i my muscle still looks big as before.. when i flex them.. but with much more deffenition.. so i guess havent lost *to much* 2) 3.)
5) no glucose disposal agents.. only using ripped fuel.. swedish version.. only contains guarana i think.. no efedrin or anything..
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 87 |
CKD= Cyclic Ketogenic Diet or what you're doing right now. You're diet sounds good but you need to increase the fat intake. At least 1 gram of fat per 1 gram of protein consumed. Alpha Lipoic Acid would be better than Vanadyl Sulfate as a glucose disposal supplement. ------------------
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 87 |
CKD= Cyclic Ketogenic Diet or what you're doing right now. You're diet sounds good but you need to increase the fat intake. At least 1 gram of fat per 1 gram of protein consumed. Alpha Lipoic Acid (200mg, 3 times a day with meals) would be better than Vanadyl Sulfate as a glucose disposal supplement. ------------------
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
Hey thanks Theking =) ahh ok got it.. CKD oh yea... have changed a bit since ive read up a bit.. doing 1/1 g now approx.. as good as i can anyways.. =) dont think i can get a hold of ALA, think its regulated over here (sweden).. hmmm.. maybe not.. maybe ill try the vanadyl... thanks =) Ripp3dMeat. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 306 |
#2. Olive oil? Yes, olive oil is alright to use. #3. Regarding which carbs to use. Try this site to see if it answers your questions regarding the GI ratings. www.mendosa.com/gilists.htm **Vanadyl Sulfate? Lyle McDonald has written in the past that this supplement may keep the liver from releasing its glycogen. I do not really have a final verdict on it yet, but it may be something to think about if you are not able to enter ketosis. If you decide to use it, then let me know if it effects your decent into ketosis. By the way, I do not know if Lyle still considers this to be the case, but I have not heard anything different. | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
Hey MR.BMJ! ok.. but still.. a tablespoon of oliveoil down your throat i still disgusting =p lol ahh great.. good to have that site in bookmarks thanks =) oh.. thought vanadyl was *supposed* to bring your glykogen from your blood/liver and push it into your muscles... anyway.. didnt start taking them.. dont thinki prolly will either.. trying to see if i can find a pharmacy near where i live.. (recently moved) gonna ask if we have diabestix (right?) here in sweden.. and i dont feel tired anymore.. Ripp3dMeat. | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
hey sorry for posting so much.. but hey.. it turned out i could get the Diastix from my pharmacy down the street.. went home and made a test.. 30 secs.. didnt change color at all.. so i guess it was Cyan.. light.. and from scale it said "negative".. umm | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 87 |
I think it's suppose to change colors if you are in ketosis but those sticks are not the most accurate. The most accurate way of measuring ketones is through a blood test. You could be in ketosis but your body is utilizing the ketones and as a result very few ketones are being released as waste through your urine. I believe ketones are released through the urine as waste only when you are producing an excessive amount that can not be utilized by the body. You could try reducing your carb and protein intake a bit and see if you go into deeper ketosis to produce a better reading on the sticks. ------------------
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
Hi theking if u scroll up u can see that im using Diastix.. not ketostix.. (which measueres ketones in urine).. Diastix measuers glucose in urine.. it turned out i had "negative" or none.. so anyone.. help? | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 87 |
Sorry, I missed that. ------------------
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
 Ok Theking thanks anyway =)So ketostix will only work masuring if im in ketosis? not diastix? anyway.. weekend now.. | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
quote: diastix is OK, only difference is diastix measure bloodsugar as well. Try a product called Keto-Diastix - those are the least expensive in sweden, i think. To be sure about your ketone-values only use your stix in the morning. Using 'em after workout wouldn't honestly show if you have ketones rushing in your blood. | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
thanks ilpsoas! =) | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 23 |
thanks ilpsoas! =) |
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posted November 29, 2000 12:26 PM
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