59 and 190, looking for 225

[Sixgunsix]

Hi all, first post. Yes i have read the stickies. This is more a question for the older crowd (>40) on the forum. First, a little background-
59 yrs, 5'10", 190 lbs, 15-16% BF. 36-3800 cal/day 5 day split
About a year ago I started on this "get lean" kick all the while doing gymnastics/bodyweight type movements. Well i took it a bit to far, got down to 142 @ 5% BF-yea I looked like shit! after the serious ass chewing from family and friends,i got back in the gym to move the iron around again. I do an annual physical (job req) and the endo noticed my T super low, so he recommended a HRT protocol. After a bit of thought, i started once a week Sus 250, not as a cycle, but a round the calendar therapy. after 3 mos, endo work again-T is up, I am gaining weight (read LBM) but T still fairly low relative to bodybuilding standards. So-he has upped me with 500mg Test Cyp/200mg Deca /weekly. Weight is up to a fairly lean 190----
But--
Heres my question--i am stuck at 190-for 6 weeks stuck. Have you been there, and what have you done to bust this plateau? I know everyone's requirements are different based on age, body type, etc.
Oh BTW-i am looking to get to 225 by Jun 2015, so a slow methodical increase-first masters over 60 BB contest.
Thanks for your insight-
BD

 

[Zyglamail]

after 3 mos, endo work again-T is up, I am gaining weight (read LBM) but T still fairly low relative to bodybuilding standards. So-he has upped me with 500mg Test Cyp/200mg Deca /weekly. Weight is up to a fairly lean 190----
But--
Heres my question--i am stuck at 190-for 6 weeks stuck. Have you been there, and what have you done to bust this plateau? I know everyone's requirements are different based on age, body type, etc.
Oh BTW-i am looking to get to 225 by Jun 2015, so a slow methodical increase-first masters over 60 BB contest.
Thanks for your insight-
BD

Something isnt right here. your doc said you have T low compared to bodybuilding standards? Seriously, cycling at your age is just plain silly if you ask me. Unless you make your living from your strength/looks then your just asking for trouble.

If you cant make slow steady LBM gains being 5'10" 190lbs on high normal test levels (say 700-900) then thats a clear sign you have other problems that I almost guarantee are nutritionally related. Taking 500test/200 deca a week is not going to fix these problems, it may get you a little mass but you likely wont be able to keep it.

 

[jester72]

I'm with Zyg here, something doesn't sound right. I have to admit, I've never heard of a doctor prescribing 500mg/week of test and 200mg/week Deca-Durabolin as HRT protocol. That seems excessively high to me, and should shoot your test levels WAY above "normal" range for someone your age.
I'm really curious though, what ancillaries does he have you on? Any Adex, Caber, HCG, etc. ?

 

[Sixgunsix]

No, Doc didn't say low for BB stnds, that's me saying that. And why do you think cycling is silly at my age---have you any anecdotal info for that age?
i can tell you i will ALWAYS be on at least some small TRT for as long as i live. i like the way i feel, among other niceties..
Figured id give BB a shot-
BTW-last blood showed I'm in pretty good shape, a little high on Cholesterol, but no worries. I have Arimidex and Nolvadex if i need it--Estradiol levels normal so far.

 

[Zyglamail]

And why do you think cycling is silly at my age---have you any anecdotal info for that age?

Im not saying TRT is a bad idea, I am saying cycling is a bad idea. Its simply added stress on our aging bodies that is not needed.

As we age, everything is less efficient. recovery is slower, we are more likely to have nutritional deficiencies and more likely to have intestinal pathogens, toxic buildup as well as a whole slew of other issues that can affect nutrient absorption.

So, with the above in mind, a nice TRT dose to put your Test levels at 700-900 should allow you to add 25lbs over the next year IF your healthy enough.

The fact your on a good sized cycle and havent gained weight in 6 weeks tells me you either got bunk gear OR your not healthy enough to be cycling.

Hell, I wish I could lose some weight but I just keep getting heavier (while dropping BF). I gained 15lbs in the last 6 months if you take into account increase scale reading combined with fat loss and my TRT test levels are around 750 AND I was significantly heavier than you are now at the same height.

 

[Sixgunsix]

i here what your saying, maybe you missed the part where i gained 45 lbs pretty quick. i know everyone plateaus along the way. when i lifted hard when I was younger i always changed it up every 10-12 weeks or so. but i am patient. could be i am hitting it toooo hard?? (the iron). i am in great shape (mentally/physically/biologically) for any age, retired military, spec ops, easy day.
BTW-gear from pharmacy-Alpha Pharma--legit.

 

[Zyglamail]

i here what your saying, maybe you missed the part where i gained 45 lbs pretty quick. i know everyone plateaus along the way. when i lifted hard when I was younger i always changed it up every 10-12 weeks or so. but i am patient. could be i am hitting it toooo hard?? (the iron). yes i am in great shape for any age, retired military, spec ops, easy day.

No, I did not miss the part where you went from 145lbs to 190lbs but that should almost be expected. At 5'10" 145lbs for an athletic individual with a long athletic history is a scary low weight and a weight where you body will naturally add mass if allowed to. I dont really consider that gain anything special and should have been easy to do without AAS at all, even at your age if you have the athletic history you say you do.

Now that you are at a decent weight for you size you will find adding mass from 190 is a bit more difficult, even more so if the nutritional foundation is not in place.

Of course we all hit plateaus here and there but not gaining anything on 500mg wk test and deca tells me there is something wrong as I mentioned above.

How much training one needs is a very personal thing and hinges heavily on many factors. First and foremost is if your body has the nutrients its needs to not only fuel the workouts but fuel the recovery. You dont make gains in the gym, you make gains while you are resting. Most people who fail to make progress suffer from nutritional deficiencies that prevent their body from compensatory repair of damage caused by a workout. The body has just enough time and resources to repair enough to maintain but not enough to prepare the body to meet additional demands required by adding strength/endurance.

Sometimes you can alter training so you expose your system to a smaller load but work the same schedule so your body has less repairing to do and can in turn meet the repair demands. Other times you can keep the same workout but fill in the nutritional gaps so the body has the building blocks it needs. Other times you need to do both.

At the end of the day, if your gear is legit, simply taking AAS is not going to get you to your goals because no amount of AAS can account for over training and under nutrition. Furthermore as I have already said IF your training and nutrition is dialed in then you should have no problem making slow and steady progress on trt doses of test alone. You dont need the added health risks of more test and deca.

 

[Sixgunsix]

i am in total agreement with what your saying. the issue is always-
am i nailing my macros/cals for what i need?? i don't think its an overtraining issue. i am guessing my food intake is a bit low. my body seems to crave food now, lots of it. most of my macros are Protein about a 50/30/20 split between carbs and good fats. i know i am insulin sensitive too.

 

[Zyglamail]

i am in total agreement with what your saying. the issue is always-
am i nailing my macros/cals for what i need?? i don't think its an overtraining issue. i am guessing my food intake is a bit low. my body seems to crave food now, lots of it. most of my macros are Protein about a 50/30/20 split between carbs and good fats. i know i am insulin sensitive too.

Im not talking about macros' im talking about micro nutrients. There are a ton of nutritional factors that go into proper body function and the biggest mistake I see people make is that they assume they can get all their nutrients from food alone.

Im not saying you cant but its a LOT harder than most people think. As just one example, 99% of the people I have talked to via e-mail/pm's this forum and many other dont even get the FDA recommended amount of potassium every day. Most of us will also admit the FDA's recommendations are often quite low and are based on the needs of the average couch potato, not an athletic individual subjecting themselves to heavy exercise loads.

 

[Sixgunsix]

I am with you on that. i am very careful or anal if you will about nutrient(s) needed for me as i age. mainly cause i don't want to get old-well, its inevitable so i do that part right.