Use a test base with your oral cycles!!

[j_p]

I see soo many noobs posting up cycles laity with only orals and NO testosterone base. This is NOT healthy for your body and will actually ADD side effects over using an oral with a test base! there are many reasons as to why. if your not going to pin teste/cyp with your orals at least use a topical like Transderm! Im sick of seeing people hurt them selves or waste cycles that could have potentially been a decent one. Rant over!

 

[stevesmi]

i disagree.

adding test will increase sides, not decrease.

how could adding more juice to a cycle decrease sides? ya lost me on that

 

[hulkamainia 119]

i disagree.

adding test will increase sides, not decrease.

how could adding more juice to a cycle decrease sides? ya lost me on that

I think he means its better to have a test/dbol cycle then just a dbol cycle. I think? Lol

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[stevesmi]

I think he means its better to have a test/dbol cycle then just a dbol cycle. I think? Lol

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well it is a helluva lot easier to keep gains from a long injectable cycle then a short burst 4 week oral run so that i agree with. but a lot of guys i know aren't big roid heads and just like to run a bottle of beast a couple times a year for 4 weeks each then keep pct and recovery easy without dealing with needles and the countless ancillaries

so in those situations running beastdrol or epi or kata or even dbol for 4 or 6 week runs solo are totally fine.

 

[hulkamainia 119]

well it is a helluva lot easier to keep gains from a long injectable cycle then a short burst 4 week oral run so that i agree with. but a lot of guys i know aren't big roid heads and just like to run a bottle of beast a couple times a year for 4 weeks each then keep pct and recovery easy without dealing with needles and the countless ancillaries

so in those situations running beastdrol or epi or kata or even dbol for 4 or 6 week runs solo are totally fine.

Exactly! There are oral cycles you can do and receive good gainz with pct like epi or katana, that's why I said I think? because i'm alittle lost haha

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[UA_Iron]

Man invented injectable testosterone... so he could be better than the God he invented.

Depends on your goals I guess. Nothing will ever be as complete of a steroid as testosterone.

 

[stevesmi]

Man invented injectable testosterone... so he could be better than the God he invented.

Depends on your goals I guess. Nothing will ever be as complete of a steroid as testosterone.

and then man invented other AAS from testosterone but altered it slightly. all AAS is derived from the male hormone testosterone. the only one i wouldn't run alone is masteron and proviron because they lack the kick and would only harden you up. less so something like primo that really stacks well with something anabolic to give a punch.

all other AAS are fair game to run alone

and parabolan blows away testosterone, its 5X more anabolic and it nutrition partians to the point it actually manipulates your blood sugar, only insulin is more anabolic. so if testosterone is the god of AAS, then parabolan is the navy seal/marine sniper father of god

 

[UA_Iron]

and then man invented other AAS from testosterone but altered it slightly. all AAS is derived from the male hormone testosterone. the only one i wouldn't run alone is masteron and proviron because they lack the kick and would only harden you up. less so something like primo that really stacks well with something anabolic to give a punch.

all other AAS are fair game to run alone

and parabolan blows away testosterone, its 5X more anabolic and it nutrition partians to the point it actually manipulates your blood sugar, only insulin is more anabolic. so if testosterone is the god of AAS, then parabolan is the navy seal/marine sniper father of god

What's your argument here? I'm well aware that there are more anabolic/androgenic steroids than testosterone.

If bodybuilding is your game then test should be the base of all your cycles because of its perfect anabolic:androgenic ratios and all the functions it also serves in the body. Tren just cannot do all this.

If bodybuilding is not your game, hell, do whatever you want. But there's no point in taking tren if you're just getting the "cuts for the sluts" or spring break body.

 

[rustilldown]

and then man invented other AAS from testosterone but altered it slightly. all AAS is derived from the male hormone testosterone. the only one i wouldn't run alone is masteron and proviron because they lack the kick and would only harden you up. less so something like primo that really stacks well with something anabolic to give a punch.

all other AAS are fair game to run alone

and parabolan blows away testosterone, its 5X more anabolic and it nutrition partians to the point it actually manipulates your blood sugar, only insulin is more anabolic. so if testosterone is the god of AAS, then parabolan is the navy seal/marine sniper father of god

Lol that last sentence cracked me up !

 

[stevesmi]

What's your argument here? I'm well aware that there are more anabolic/androgenic steroids than testosterone.

If bodybuilding is your game then test should be the base of all your cycles because of its perfect anabolic:androgenic ratios and all the functions it also serves in the body. Tren just cannot do all this.

If bodybuilding is not your game, hell, do whatever you want. But there's no point in taking tren if you're just getting the "cuts for the sluts" or spring break body.

my arguement is you don't need test as a base

the rest of your post is flat out false, you obviously have never run tren to post such a thing.. tren blows away test when it comes to building mass and strength.. its not even close bro. its not a 'cuts for the sluts' AAS at all. the biggest problem with parabolan is if you run it you will never want to run anything else again, which is why its a bad choice for newbs. kinda like losing your virginity to your wife or a girl you really like. you don't want to have sex for the first time with someone you like, because they are gonna think you are a weirdo.. hence why i urge people to save tren/para for later on.

yes test has the perfect ratio's you are right.. and water has a density of 1 as well.. cause that is what scientists set it as to make it easy as a BASELINE, just like how test is a BASELINE.. again all AAS is derived from testosterone. its like taking a glass of water and adding something to it.. thats all that is going on. people hear the word test and don't get that when they take anything from beastdrol, to tren hex, to primo to var that they are taking male hormones. those all are male hormones just like test. just because test is called test doesn't mean you must run it every cycle

 

[hulkamainia 119]

And boom goes the dynamite.

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[RickRock13]

I personally would choose to run test with every cycle, just for the simple fact of how it makes me feel. Lethargy has never been a factor for me on test, and it keeps my libido sky high also.

So in a sense you can say that test helps lower certain side effects

 

[UA_Iron]

my arguement is you don't need test as a base

well it is a helluva lot easier to keep gains from a long injectable cycle then a short burst 4 week oral run so that i agree with. but a lot of guys i know aren't big roid heads and just like to run a bottle of beast a couple times a year for 4 weeks each then keep pct and recovery easy without dealing with needles and the countless ancillaries

so in those situations running beastdrol or epi or kata or even dbol for 4 or 6 week runs solo are totally fine.

Is your argument really this: "since a lot of the guys I know aren't big roid heads they dont have to use injectables"

Which is fine and I agreed with you in my last post in the last sentence. But this is also an argument against using tren

the rest of your post is flat out false, you obviously have never run tren to post such a thing.. tren blows away test when it comes to building mass and strength..

Don't be silly, I have run tren and have even posted literature surrounding the investigation of its use for HRT in a thread where we had a running discussion.

yes test has the perfect ratio's you are right.. and water has a density of 1 as well..

You forgot units, 1g/cm^3 is what you're thinking. A number without units is beyond useless.

cause that is what scientists set it as to make it easy as a BASELINE, just like how test is a BASELINE.. again all AAS is derived from testosterone. its like taking a glass of water and adding something to it.. thats all that is going on. people hear the word test and don't get that when they take anything from beastdrol, to tren hex, to primo to var that they are taking male hormones. those all are male hormones just like test. just because test is called test doesn't mean you must run it every cycle

7 million years of evolution perfected testosterone into what it is today; it is beyond these 'tools of convenience' like how we define measurement systems. When you run other compounds [alone] you compromise your natural production and restrict your body of the other functions it serves that cannot all be replicated by modified testosterone derivatives.

In any case, I think we're agreeing on some points. Yes I agree tren is the strongest compound around. Tren makes you look like a God, Test makes you feel like a God.

 

[stevesmi]

^^^ i see what you are saying.

i would not recommend tren to be used long term vs. HRT using test. tren can sometimes be a pain in the ass to run and i get sick of it after a while. cant imagine the guys who run it for a year straight they gotta be out of their minds .. in that aspect yes test is far superior, as i wouldn't recommend someone run an oral a year straight either.

however I think we are getting off track with this thread. i think the OP's point that you should always run test with orals just isn't true. like i said above a lot of guys just want to grab a bottle of kata or beastdrol and run the bottle for a month and be done with it and come off .. they don't want to deal with injections and long esters etc.. i know some gym rats who are married with kids who don't want their wives finding syringes laying around and find it much more optimal to pop some pills everyday that are legal .. so there is a place for short oral only cycles

 

[MattJS]

I think everything has its place, personally I love test and wouldn't think of doing anything without it, but thats not to say its a waste of time doing anything without it....

Test to me is like a nice safe dependable base that I can adjust up or down depending on my goal, I would never treat any other AAS like that, I finished my first run of tren two weeks ago and holy fuck it makes test look a bit like spring water... But it also fucks people up, sometimes badly, its a dirty steroid with insane gains that puts stress on your body, I wouldn't feel comfortable running it for a long time OR at a high dose never mind for a long time at a high dose because of the health risk involved in that....

As for oral only cycles, like Steve I can understand why others choose to do that, ie personal trainers, amateur athletes, folk living at home who don't want to deal with the very real negative social stigma attached to injecting, or the legalities associated with steroids vs prohormones....

 

[notjake11]

With respect to the tren v. test point, I'd also point out that you can't really say one is better than the other without taking into account what your goals are. For example, tren may be better at cutting up, but is completely useless (and in fact counterproductive) to anyone that wants/likes cardio or is training for any kind of endurance. You can't say something is "the best" in a void. It may be the best at one thing or for one person, but not for others.

 

[notjake11]

As for oral only cycles, like Steve I can understand why others choose to do that, ie personal trainers, amateur athletes, folk living at home who don't want to deal with the very real negative social stigma attached to injecting, or the legalities associated with steroids vs prohormones....

Or those that have to travel. When I did my first cycle (Anavar/Proviron) in November/December I got a lot of shit from people for not starting my first cycle with Test. But with the holidays comes holiday travel for Thanksgiving and Christmas. It's much easier to get orals back and forth through four airport trips than injectibles/needles/etc.

 

[stevesmi]

With respect to the tren v. test point, I'd also point out that you can't really say one is better than the other without taking into account what your goals are. For example, tren may be better at cutting up, but is completely useless (and in fact counterproductive) to anyone that wants/likes cardio or is training for any kind of endurance. You can't say something is "the best" in a void. It may be the best at one thing or for one person, but not for others.

tren is horrible with cardio. you won't get any arguement from me on that. not only does it wreck your glycogen levels but it also drains the body of taurine and other minerals which gives horrible pumps.

many AAS including test will do the same especially in high doses but tren takes the cake.

 

[Rockwilder]

A lot of good points in this thread, but one that was mentioned that sticks out to me is the legal issue. Some people do have strong moral beliefs and are not cool with breaking the law, which is completely understandable.

And obviously we all know it's different from injecting heroin or something, but some people may feel too much like a 'drug addict' shooting anything.

It really just comes down to personal preference, but I do see the OP is coming from.

 

[j_p]

i disagree.

adding test will increase sides, not decrease.

how could adding more juice to a cycle decrease sides? ya lost me on that

running a cycle with out any testosterone is a bad idea. you body uses it for many functions and when you use oral steroid (and most others) you shut down your natty production of test. thi sis not a good thing and a big cause for feeling tired or depressed on oral only cycles and most ph cycles. Im not saying add 500 or 700mg ew and expect no sides (with an ai its still minimal for me though), even just 150-200mg ew would make for a better cycle with less sides.

 

[j_p]

and then man invented other AAS from testosterone but altered it slightly. all AAS is derived from the male hormone testosterone. the only one i wouldn't run alone is masteron and proviron because they lack the kick and would only harden you up. less so something like primo that really stacks well with something anabolic to give a punch.

all other AAS are fair game to run alone

and parabolan blows away testosterone, its 5X more anabolic and it nutrition partians to the point it actually manipulates your blood sugar, only insulin is more anabolic. so if testosterone is the god of AAS, then parabolan is the navy seal/marine sniper father of god

I dont agree sorry. its better to have a test base then not. if you want to run a couple bottles of aas a year fine, but the poitn is avoiding needles?? then use a topical like Transderm if your not going to pin test... its not just about gains... I care about long term health and also feeling shitty from beign on an oral only cycle. you body wont use all aas the same wath test will be used and its used for many function other then just muscle mass... test free cycles are not optimal in my op for health AND gains...

 

[j_p]

my arguement is you don't need test as a base
and mine is that you should...
the rest of your post is flat out false, you obviously have never run tren to post such a thing.. tren blows away test when it comes to building mass and strength.. its not even close bro. its not a 'cuts for the sluts' AAS at all. the biggest problem with parabolan is if you run it you will never want to run anything else again, which is why its a bad choice for newbs. kinda like losing your virginity to your wife or a girl you really like. you don't want to have sex for the first time with someone you like, because they are gonna think you are a weirdo.. hence why i urge people to save tren/para for later on.

yes test has the perfect ratio's you are right.. and water has a density of 1 as well.. cause that is what scientists set it as to make it easy as a BASELINE, just like how test is a BASELINE.. again all AAS is derived from testosterone. its like taking a glass of water and adding something to it.. thats all that is going on. people hear the word test and don't get that when they take anything from beastdrol, to tren hex, to primo to var that they are taking male hormones. those all are male hormones just like test. just because test is called test doesn't mean you must run it every cycle

 

[j_p]

my arguement is you don't need test as a base

the rest of your post is flat out false, you obviously have never run tren to post such a thing.. tren blows away test when it comes to building mass and strength.. its not even close bro. its not a 'cuts for the sluts' AAS at all. the biggest problem with parabolan is if you run it you will never want to run anything else again, which is why its a bad choice for newbs. kinda like losing your virginity to your wife or a girl you really like. you don't want to have sex for the first time with someone you like, because they are gonna think you are a weirdo.. hence why i urge people to save tren/para for later on.

yes test has the perfect ratio's you are right.. and water has a density of 1 as well.. cause that is what scientists set it as to make it easy as a BASELINE, just like how test is a BASELINE.. again all AAS is derived from testosterone. its like taking a glass of water and adding something to it.. thats all that is going on. people hear the word test and don't get that when they take anything from beastdrol, to tren hex, to primo to var that they are taking male hormones. those all are male hormones just like test. just because test is called test doesn't mean you must run it every cycle

other aas is not natty to the body and not used in the same say and some functions ar emissed or altered... not good.

run beast for 8 weeks and tell me why do you feel like shit? if its alls the same as you like to make it seem or you actually think...

 

[notjake11]

other aas is not natty to the body and not used in the same say and some functions ar emissed or altered... not good.

run beast for 8 weeks and tell me why do you feel like shit? if its alls the same as you like to make it seem or you actually think...

I ran var/prov oral cycle for 8 weeks and felt like a kimg tje whole cycle despite not having a test base. Just sayin.

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