The RYANH post Answer needed from Ryan himself

[MattTheSkywalker]

Ryan,

I read the post about "10 things I hate about democrats" and how you didn';t bother to respond, except to say "Great, he can count to 10". The list was just as stupid as the list from the "Conservatives Blow" post you started. Both threads play on party stereotypes. Yet anyone who follows the process can see that the true party ideologies are:


Pro-Life Corporate Party (Repub)

AND

Pro-Choice Corporate Party (Dems)

The thing that kills me about you and your "arguments" is that you never consider rational criticism or acknowledge the flaws of your own position.

One can safely conclude that not only have you not researched many of your arguments, but that you also are a follower to an ideology other than your own. Further evidence of this was when you attributed to me a statement about Colin Powell that I clearly did not make. I provided evidence of your mis-quote but you simply avoided response. Yet clearly you erred. Rather than admit this you shrank from it.

Someone who believes in their position can take criticism without the shenanigans or avoidance you display. (For example 2Thick, who posts and rationally defends his unpopular views often. He even admits the credibility of some opposing arguments. I miss him around here).

At the end of the day, one needs no psychology training to see that the opinions you promote on here are simply a backlash against your well to do conservative upbringing, rather than something you have formulated of your own accord.

The thoughts you post here are not your own. An independent thinker will acknowledge all sides of an argument, including the flaws in their own side.

Such blind allegiance to a set of principles you do not fully understand or seek to understand is as harmful to our country as the apathy that pervades our generation. Until you start thinking for yourself you are part of the problem, not the solution.

Can we get a decent and well thought out (by you) response?

Have a nice day.

 

[needleboy]

That's because he's a self-righteous, self absorbed ass!!!

 

[Drizzt]

of course he won't win

RyanH never wins a arguement. Isn't it funny how when he posts another moronic thing about democrats or racism that nobody agrees with. When the heat starts coming down and people are roastin on him its odd how he NEVER shows back up in the topic. He will stop defending himself by avoiding the situation. His arguements are worthless and totally media influenced. I honestly think this punk has never done anything in his life but sit at his house and watch tv and read the ny times. Its obvious he has no real world experience with the subjects he so valiantly fights for because if he had any "real world" experience with them he obviously wouldn't be fighting for them. Ryan you need 2 actually get out in the world one of these days and actually see what goes on and quit relying on the local jackass at 11pm on the news 2 tell you whats going on in the world.

Drizz

 

[Weapon X]

Let's not muddy the waters of this thread with our own musings. I want to see RyanH actually address the issues in Matt's post.

 

[MP5]

I honestly think Ryanh may be someone fucking with us for fun and agreeing with these crazy democratic view points right down the line is him being sarcastic. He always agrees with the most extreme viewpoints ofthe democratic party that I always assumed no one believed in. I think he is a conservative being cynical.

 

[Fonz]

This is why I stay away of most political
discussions. They're beneath contempt.
Still, RyanH, you've been called out so speak:

Godspeed

 

[HumorMe]

Hey Matt......

Great post. Very well stated. Now let's see what happens! I'm on your side because he never acknowledges my statements. Of course when I cussed him out for editing my posts he probably put me on ignore! I'm so heartbroken!

 

[gymnpoppa]

 

[Zebo]

I've thought this for a while. I think MP5 is right.

Its obvious RyanH gets his jollies egging you guys on.....

Guarantee he's fucking with you guys. Probably sitting there with a Confederate flag on his wall, laughing his ass off everytime one of you goes ballistic on one of his many jabs.

Long live Hillary? LOL
Clinton served with honor? LOL
A little too liberal if you ask me....Clinton would read this shit, and say " doooooo what?????? Copy and paste.........

Cynical conservative fucking with you, and you guys fall for it hook, line and sinker.

That is some funny shit.........the absolute best...........

 

[Ferrus]

well said Matt

I think the truth lies somewhere between your take and MP5's take....Ryan is a half-educated rich kid wannabe hardcore liberal...but, I don't think he believes a lot of the crap he espouses...I think he throws out a lot of topics just to be controversial

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

I'm not insulting him or belittling his stances or their origin. I, too, was raised in a conservative and comfortable home, and I make no apologies for it.

Just curious Ryan. No flame whatsoever.

 

[dballer]

weak mind, weak ideals.... disgusting morals. I would like to see the response to this as well. I am sure it will be an insult of the light-hearted kind.

 

[Jae]

Where's Ryan?

 

[RyanH]

I'm here.

Give me a brief amount of time while I write my response.

Ryan.

 

[RyanH]

I read the post about "10 things I hate about democrats" and how you didn';t bother to respond, except to say "Great, he can count to 10". The list was just as stupid as the list from the "Conservatives Blow" post you started. Both threads play on party stereotypes. Yet anyone who follows the process can see that the true party ideologies are.

There is a distinguishing characteristic between both lists. While both lists obviously engage in hyperbole; nothing written on the Democratic list can be proven with any real certainty. Whereas on the Republican list, a few things can, without a doubt, be proven. For instance, at the extreme fringes of the Repulican Party is the Ku Klux Klan, lying in wait, ready to lynch anyone of a different color or ethnicity than they are. You can spice it up and say it isn't true. But it simply is. How many Klan members have a Bush sticker on the back of their trucks. I bet more than we can imagine. Thus, I still stand by what I said earlier----the list written by that board member in regards to the Democratic party tells us nothing, except that he or she can count to ten.

One can safely conclude that not only have you not researched many of your arguments, but that you also are a follower to an ideology other than your own. Further evidence of this was when you attributed to me a statement about Colin Powell that I clearly did not make. I provided evidence of your mis-quote but you simply avoided response. Yet clearly you erred. Rather than admit this you shrank from it.

Now Matt, you have a big habit of brandishing users (as I discovered from the archives), as having ideas derived from the media or from some illegitimate source. Your habit simply fails to work on me. My ideology is my own. While education is not the hallmark of intelligence, it certainly offers you alot of extraordinary opportunities you can either seize or pass-by. I've been fortunate enough to seize many of those opportunities. I'm well read, I read the papers everyday, I read novels, I've read about the world, and I've read more constitutional law cases that I actually prefer to have read. But more important, as Hendrix once sang, "Are you experienced?"

To argue that my argument is not grounded in experience is an extreme exaggeration. I've attempted to get down into the trenches and see what life is like on the other side. I've worked at Legal Aid. I've dealt with the poor who had no place to go, I've seen a poor mother worried about whether or not she'll get her next paycheck. Also, I have written on the abuses of predatorial lending, and have seen that consumer abuses are not just a media creation, they are reality. I spent my second year in law school researching the price-gouging tactics lenders use to prey on the poor. The result was a 50 page research paper. Further, while I'm not at liberty to say where I'm currently working; I'm presently in a position where I'm seeing the racial disparity of the death penalty... I'm seeing, first hand, why so many people break the law. As a result, my dedication to my principles are reaffirmed everyday of my life.

Colin Powell: Matt, on December 16, 2000 you wrote of Colin Powell..."He will be an excellent Secretary of State." That same day, you praised him for the diversity he would add to the Bush cabinet. Now you argue that you're aren't all that fond of him, afterall. Granted, you never referred to him as your hero, but you spoke very favorably of him at one point. You've recently contradicted your earlier view. Which view is it? You can't have it both ways. Is he worthy of "excellence"---of heroism---or is he just plain mediocre. I'm anxiously awaiting your response.

At the end of the day, one needs no psychology training to see that the opinions you promote on here are simply a backlash against your well to do conservative upbringing, rather than something you have formulated of your own accord.

There you go again, attributing my beliefs to my background. Attempting to paint me as some rebellious kid, fighting against the past. Well, quite simply, I would never fight against the past. Because lurking in the past lies truth. My past has shown me that truth. For instance, my parents are wealthy Republicans, as are many of their friends. I've heard their friends talk of politics and life, and a reoccuring theme always emerges its ugly head: Money is their #1 priority. Additonally, this has also been my experience with many, many other Republicans. i.e. their constant agonizing need for a tax cut for everyone but themselves....since the wealthiest really benefitted from the recent tax cut. On the other hand, most of the Democrats I know have some sort of sensibility, they care about the human condition, they care about the heart. Moreover, they care about someone else besides themselves.

The thoughts you post here are not your own. An independent thinker will acknowledge all sides of an argument, including the flaws in their own side.

I don't need a tutorial on how to craft an argument. My law school grades and forthcoming career speak for itself. Of course, I know that there are two sides to every argument, and many times there isn't a "right" or a "wrong" answer, but by the same token, Republicans and Democrats can generally have their priorities summed up in the following two ways: Republicans think with their pocketbooks, while Democrats think with their hearts. Thus, the choice comes down to "Compassion" vs. "Money." I'll take compassion any day of the week. Republicans love to dance around their homophobia or their dislike of gays, the poor, or women. But, of course, action speaks louder than words. Do your friends look like America, or do they look like your cul-de-sac? Proof always lies in the deeds we do, and those we surround ourselves with.

As much as I would like to say, I have some regrets....I simply do not.....maybe some will be forthcoming in the future, but for now.....I am without a doubt......CONTENTED......

Ryan.

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Re: Re: The RYANH post Answer needed from Ryan himself

While both lists obviously engage in hyperbole; nothing written on the Democratic list can be proven with any real certainty. Whereas on the Republican list, a few things can, without a doubt, be proven. For instance, at the extreme fringes of the Repulican Party is the Ku Klux Klan, lying in wait, ready to lynch anyone of a different color or ethnicity than they are. You can spice it up and say it isn't true. But it simply is. How many Klan members have a Bush sticker on the back of their trucks. I bet more than we can imagine. Thus, I still stand by what I said earlier----the list written by that board member in regards to the Democratic party tells us nothing, except that he or she can count to ten.

Using the Klan as an example is not addressing the issue. They are not at the extreme fringes of the Republican party. The party does not actively court them or support their activities. Using extremist views to say that something "can, without a doubt, be proven" is erroneous. The post was about "conservatives" not "closed-minded bigots". To attribute the behavior of a few to the masses is inapproprioate. You do a disservice to reasoned discussion when you try to associate the fringes with the mainstream conservatives.

Now Matt, you have a big habit of brandishing users (as I discovered from the archives), as having ideas derived from the media or from some illegitimate source. Your habit simply fails to work on me. My ideology is my own. While education is not the hallmark of intelligence, it certainly offers you alot of extraordinary opportunities you can either seize or pass-by. I've been fortunate enough to seize many of those opportunities. I'm well read, I read the papers everyday, I read novels, I've read about the world, and I've read more constitutional law cases that I actually prefer to have read. But more important, as Hendrix once sang, "Are you experienced?"

I have a dirty habit of encouraging people to think for themselves. I encourage you to seek more education any way you want. I know you have lived in different places and seen different things. Thus I am surprised by your singlemindedness. But if you say your ideology is your own, then I take you at your word.

To argue that my argument is not grounded in experience is an extreme exaggeration. I've attempted to get down into the trenches and see what life is like on the other side. I've worked at Legal Aid. I've dealt with the poor who had no place to go, I've seen a poor mother worried about whether or not she'll get her next paycheck. Also, I have written on the abuses of predatorial lending, and have seen that consumer abuses are not just a media creation, they are reality. I spent my second year in law school researching the price-gouging tactics lenders use to prey on the poor. The result was a 50 page research paper. Further, while I'm not at liberty to say where I'm currently working; I'm presently in a position where I'm seeing the racial disparity of the death penalty... I'm seeing, first hand, why so many people break the law. As a result, my dedication to my principles are reaffirmed everyday of my life.

Go back and re-read my post. I never said that your arguments weren;t grounded in experience. I said that you were following an ideology other than your own. Your above experiences are diverse and I respect them. There are a lot of shady tactics employed against the poor because they cannot easily fight back. I applaud your efforts to learn more.

My experiences are diverse as well. I've lived in many places, traveled to 40 different states, served in the miltary, attended one of the nation's most elite private prep schools, etc. My friends include wealthy businessmen and single Moms from the deep south. I've seen a lot of shit.

Colin Powell: Matt, on December 16, 2000 you wrote of Colin Powell..."He will be an excellent Secretary of State." That same day, you praised him for the diversity he would add to the Bush cabinet. Now you argue that you're aren't all that fond of him, afterall. Granted, you never referred to him as your hero, but you spoke very favorably of him at one point. You've recently contradicted your earlier view. Which view is it? You can't have it both ways. Is he worthy of "excellence"---of heroism---or is he just plain mediocre. I'm anxiously awaiting your response.

He will be - he is - an excellent secretary of state. It is a good administrative position and that is where he excels. (This is why I said he would be a good Senator). From other things I have read about him, he is not a "take-charge, follow-me" kind of heroic leader. I encourage you to read COL Hackworth;s books "About Face" and "Hazardous Duty", to better understand my perspective.

There you go again, attributing my beliefs to my background. Attempting to paint me as some rebellious kid, fighting against the past. Well, quite simply, I would never fight against the past. Because lurking in the past lies truth. My past has shown me that truth. For instance, my parents are wealthy Republicans, as are many of their friends. I've heard their friends talk of politics and life, and a reoccuring theme always emerges its ugly head: Money is their #1 priority. Additonally, this has also been my experience with many, many other Republicans. i.e. their constant agonizing need for a tax cut for everyone but themselves....since the wealthiest really benefitted from the recent tax cut. On the other hand, most of the Democrats I know have some sort of sensibility, they care about the human condition, they care about the heart. Moreover, they care about someone else besides themselves.

You know your past better than I do. You;ve already discussed the origin of your beliefs, so I will leave it at that.

I don't need a tutorial on how to craft an argument. My law school grades and forthcoming career speak for itself. Of course, I know that there are two sides to every argument, and many times there isn't a "right" or a "wrong" answer, but by the same token, Republicans and Democrats can generally have their priorities summed up in the following two ways: Republicans think with their pocketbooks, while Democrats think with their hearts. Thus, the choice comes down to "Compassion" vs. "Money." I'll take compassion any day of the week. Republicans love to dance around their homophobia or their dislike of gays, the poor, or women. But, of course, action speaks louder than words. Do your friends look like America, or do they look like your cul-de-sac? Proof always lies in the deeds we do, and those we surround ourselves with.

My friends do look very much like America, as I mentioned above.

However, I deeply deeply disagree with the statement that most Democrats think with their hearts as opposed to their pocket books. Proof is forthcoming.

Thanks for your time. Have a good weekend.

Matt

 

[Frackal]

I doubt most democrat politicians really care about the minorities much more than their republican counterparts. Not a big fan of republicans either, but, this thought occurred to me the other day:

The laws of nature and evolution are contradictory to the feel-good type laws of the far left...equal opportunity and fairness for everyone, etc..

Progress and growth occurs when their is a reason to change, and when their is competition, when you have to fight to survive.

In theory, communism and such LOOKS good, but it seldom if ever works in practice...reason is because their is no real competition, no real drive to succeed.

Point being; I agree with a lot of democratic views, protecting the enviroment, caring for those besides yourself, but I detest the constant pandering...

I still think Libertarianism has some really superb ideas...I hope one day to see a Libertarian president.

 

[r00+]

Frackal

Frackal it it on the head, dems don't care any more or less than anyone else.

Like ryan, they've pulling the Party Line for so long that they really cannot fathom anything different. A lot of republicans are guilty of this as well.

The fact of the matter is this: in the political arena ANY extreme is a product of Party-Line Brainwashing.

Ryan, like other politicians have an interesting nack for not actually answering questions, as in his tiresome yet thorough reply. He doesn't address the simplicity of the topic. He attacks the validity of the topic, but he's on such weak ground there that he has to tread lightly (See his #1 reason why republicans blow post). And like all politicians he dances and flitters about in a dazzling display of verbal dexterity without ever really saying anything.

Please do not be confused, I'm not suggesting ryanh is (could/would/will) be a politician. Hopefully by the time he hits 35 he will have learned that he can't tow the party line and be considered any more than above average.

 

[chesty]

I find the statements put forth by RyanH to be well rehearsed. Just as any good lawyer will do. But the substance of all of his remarks are inflamatory, defamatory, and derrogatory. He sensationalizes all of his comments with emotionalism and tripe to get on the nerves of those who believe differently, and to rally those who think the same way as he does.

I find that he throws out situations without any substantiation and then tells us that it is true, it is true.

 

[thebabydoc]

But the substance of all of his remarks are inflamatory, defamatory, and derrogatory. He
sensationalizes all of his comments with emotionalism and tripe to get on the nerves of those
who believe differently, and to rally those who think the same way as he does.

I find that he throws out situations without any substantiation and then tells us that it is true, it
is true.

In other words, chesty, like a lawyer?

 

[Fonz]

Matt, 40 states= well travelled??????

Come on.........that is hilarious.

Go to Albania/yugoslavia then come talk to me.
In fact I've been to 31 countries. THAT is what
is referred to as WELL-TRAVELLED.
Travelling 40 states is like taking a weekend trek,
as there is ALMOST NO DIFFERENCE IN THE QUALITY
OF LIFE.

Going from a Developed country(US) to a third-world country
(Albania/Kosovo/ yugoslavia) WILL OPEN YOUR EYES.

And I too attended probably the most exclusive school in
England. That makes ZERO difference in your ability to
adapt to different countries.

Don't take this as a flame, but you reallly need to get out of
the US and start exploring other countries ASAP.
The world IS NOT LIKE THE US.

Godspeed

 

[Laserdude]

The post I put up for the 10 reasons to dis the democrats, was in all fairness, a joke.

Glad you saw it as a ruse to RyanH's idiotic post. I am glad he took the bait

The truth is it no more accurate than his own was, his post was full of of political crap just as mine was.

I stated that I am a libertarian and as such I support neither the jackasses or the elephants. Both parties are full of it, crap is crap any way you smell it.

Get it RyanH? I doubt it.

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

Fonz,

Honestly, I am impressed by your sense of self-importance. It rivals mine when I was a child.

Since the topic was about the major political parties in the US, I did not feel the need to talk about my experience traveling outside the US. I've done it - and if you want to email me, we can have chats about the virtues of third world Asia compared to war torn Kosovo against a backdrop of African poverty. Seen it all brother.

That would be fun, and you know what? IT WOULDN'T HAVE A FUCKIN' THING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC AT HAND.

The topic here is American government, specifically the political parties. Feel free to start your own thread about being well-traveled anytime. I would have a lot to say.

Now, as to the rest of your buffoonery:

40 states is extensive travel within the US.

If you think there is no difference in quality of life in various parts of the US, then your elite English prep schools didn't teach much about America after 1783. There is a big fucking difference. In fact, I invite you to check it out. Here's a good one for you: Check out Wall Street at 6:00 PM, with all the investment bankers getting to their provate cars to go home to their multi-million dollar houses. Then, drive down to West Virginia and speak to the locals. I can go on and on. Ever seen rural Louisiana? How about San Francisco? Did those look the same?


And why do you comment about the role of one's education on the ability to adapt to other countries? This has nothing to do with the thread. You might as well have given me your predictions for World Cup 2002.

have a nice day.

 

[Fonz]

Fonz,

Honestly, I am impressed by your sense of self-importance. It rivals mine when I was a child.

Since the topic was about the major political parties in the US, I did not feel the need to talk about my experience traveling outside the US. I've done it - and if you want to email me, we can have chats about the virtues of third world Asia compared to war torn Kosovo against a backdrop of African poverty. Seen it all brother.

That would be fun, and you know what? IT WOULDN'T HAVE A FUCKIN' THING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC AT HAND.

The topic here is American government, specifically the political parties. Feel free to start your own thread about being well-traveled anytime. I would have a lot to say.

Now, as to the rest of your buffoonery:

40 states is extensive travel within the US.

If you think there is no difference in quality of life in various parts of the US, then your elite English prep schools didn't teach much about America after 1783. There is a big fucking difference. In fact, I invite you to check it out. Here's a good one for you: Check out Wall Street at 6:00 PM, with all the investment bankers getting to their provate cars to go home to their multi-million dollar houses. Then, drive down to West Virginia and speak to the locals. I can go on and on. Ever seen rural Louisiana? How about San Francisco? Did those look the same?


And why do you comment about the role of one's educ


"Buffoonery".....NOW there is a word I have not heard in a
long time.
Actually, MATT, I went to prep school in OTTAWA, CANADA
THEN DID the IB IN OXFORD.

Your verbal soliloquys have NO EFFECT WHATSOEVER ON
ME, so don't even try.

Unlike others, I have the lexicon to thoroughly embarass
you.

And me Self-important???? HA-Ha, thats a funny one.
I think you're confusing my cofidence in my abilities(which
are many) w/ an ego-centric raison d'etre.

I am more generous than any person I know apart from
my mother.

Having said that, I hold no grudge against you, I am just
defending my personality.

Godspeed

 

[Laserdude]

My great uncle started the Rhodes scholarship, so my uncle was a
one world government kind of guy.

HE WAS WRONG.

2000 years of western civilization has proven that this is not going to happen. People are bound and determined to destroy civilization as we know it. It is in our DNA, flawed as it may be.

Get use to it. It is coming regardless of what people say, do, and believe.

Just wait and see, I know people will laugh it off, but reality is one cruel joke and the joke is on us.