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Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

2Thick

Elite Mentor
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"I don't believe anyone that I know in the administration ever said that Iraq had nuclear weapons."

— Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, at a hearing of the Senate's appropriations subcommittee on defense, May 14.


*** **** ***

"We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons."

— Vice President Dick Cheney on NBC's Meet the Press, March 16.
http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/886068.asp
 
2Thick said:
"I don't believe anyone that I know in the administration ever said that Iraq had nuclear weapons."

— Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, at a hearing of the Senate's appropriations subcommittee on defense, May 14.


*** **** ***

"We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons."

— Vice President Dick Cheney on NBC's Meet the Press, March 16.
http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/886068.asp

I have never liked that weasel.....
 
It looks like he is discussing his nuclear weapons program
 
2Thick said:


LOL....

If you are trying to defend him, then you are not the person that I thought that you were.

No, Im not trying to defend him at all. Not in the least.

I am not living in my own world where politicians dont lie.:) Thats just what it looks like to me, since in the paragraph above he was talking about Saddam's WMD programs. You may very well be right though.
 
The Republican said:


No, Im not trying to defend him at all. Not in the least.

I am not living in my own world where politicians dont lie.:) Thats just what it looks like to me, since in the paragraph above he was talking about Saddam's WMD programs. You may very well be right though.

He says "reconstituted nuclear weapons." It does not get any clearer than that. he may have slipped up, but he still said it.
 
Re: Re: Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

Sundance said:


I have never liked that weasel.....

He actually is a nice guy, and sharp as a tack to boot. Whether you agree with his politics or not is another story. Even I dont admit with a lot of what he does/has done.
 
Maybe he's got the same problem problem that Reagan did. CRS disease.
 
Re: Re: Re: Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

The Republican said:


He actually is a nice guy, and sharp as a tack to boot.

One cannot get to his position without having charisma and being intelligent. That is not the issue. the issue is his outright lies to the American people and to Congress.

He thinks that he is above the law.
 
2Thick said:


He says "reconstituted nuclear weapons." It does not get any clearer than that. he may have slipped up, but he still said it.

Thats true, like I said he very well have meant it.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

2Thick said:


One cannot get to his position without having charisma and being intelligent. That is not the issue. the issue is his outright lies to the American people and to Congress.


Yeah, like I said, pretty much every politician lies. That is basically what they are known for.:)
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

The Republican said:


Yeah, like I said, pretty much every politician lies. That is basically what they are known for.:)

There is a difference between lying about raising/lowering taxes and lies that result in a war where the government goes into a deficit that the US will never recover from.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rumsfeld CAUGHT Lying....!

2Thick said:


There is a difference between lying about raising/lowering taxes and lies that result in a war where the government goes into a deficit that the US will never recover from.

Well if you put it that way, then yes there is a difference. However, this war was not waged solely because our administration presented the opinion (yes, opinion :) ) that Saddam has nuclear weapons. You probably know of all the hoopla about him not complying with resolutions, yada yada yada.

Technically we have been at war with Iraq since 40 days after the 1991 war ended, due to the fact that our cease-fire agreement was based on the notion that Iraq would produce the records of all of its WMDs within 40 days.
 
It is amusing watching some of you criticize the current administration as it continues to protect your ignorant asses day after day in ways that you can't even comprehend.
Actually, it's not amusing, it's fucking pathetic, but what can ya do, ya know?
 
the term "believe" falls under the constitutionally
approved clinton doctrine of semantic buggery...

it is not a lie, depending on what "is" means...

so since chewbacca is a wookie on endor...
 
bwood said:
the term "believe" falls under the constitutionally
approved clinton doctrine of semantic buggery...

it is not a lie, depending on what "is" means...

so since chewbacca is a wookie on endor...

The Chewbacca defense. Priceless.


That said, ...

A politician lied? Will wonders never cease?
 
Let's just hope that their lies are for the nation as a whole's benefit...
 
"Here's what I think of your whining, civvies"

rumsfeld_makes_jerk-off.jpg
 
Mildot said:
It is amusing watching some of you criticize the current administration as it continues to protect your ignorant asses day after day in ways that you can't even comprehend.
Actually, it's not amusing, it's fucking pathetic, but what can ya do, ya know?
hey einstein, IT'S THE FUCKING GOVERNMENTS JOB TO PROTECT OUR IGNORANT ASSES!!!!! That's one of the main functions of government.
 
Sorry guys but this is leftist spin only. This link will explain it.

http://gncurtis.home.texas.net/blogger.html


Sunday, May 25, 2003
( 7:25 PM ) Gary Curtis
Where's the Beef? Timothy Noah's "Whopper of the Week" feature on Slate for Friday consists of the following two quotes:


"'I don't believe anyone that I know in the administration ever said that Iraq had nuclear weapons.'

--Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, at a hearing of the Senate's appropriations subcommittee on defense, May 14


"'We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons.'

--Vice President Dick Cheney on 'NBC's Meet the Press', March 16"




According to Noah's definition, a "whopper" is an unambiguously false statement taken together with its refutation. So, in this case, Rumsfeld's statement is the supposedly false statement refuted by Cheney's earlier statement. To refute Rumsfeld's statement, Cheney must have been saying that Iraq had nuclear weapons. However, Cheney's statement is rather obscure, especially because of the use of the word "reconstituted". What does he mean by claiming that "he"--Saddam Hussein--has "reconstituted" nuclear weapons? Here's the context of Cheney's strange remark, taken from the transcript of the interview:



TIM RUSSERT: "What do you think is the most important rationale for going to war with Iraq?


VICE PRESIDENT CHENEY: "Well, I think I've just given it, Tim, in terms of the combination of his development and use of chemical weapons, his development of biological weapons, his pursuit of nuclear weapons.



RUSSERT: "And even though the International Atomic Energy Agency said he does not have a nuclear program, we disagree?



CHENEY: "I disagree, yes. ... Let's talk about the nuclear proposition for a minute. ... In the late '70s, Saddam Hussein acquired nuclear reactors from the French. 1981, the Israelis took out the Osirak reactor and stopped his nuclear weapons development at the time. Throughout the '80s, he mounted a new effort. I was told when I was defense secretary before the Gulf War that he was eight to 10 years away from a nuclear weapon. And we found out after the Gulf War that he was within one or two years of having a nuclear weapon because he had a massive effort under way that involved four or five different technologies for enriching uranium to produce fissile material. We know that based on intelligence that he has been very, very good at hiding these kinds of efforts. He's had years to get good at it and we know he has been absolutely devoted to trying to acquire nuclear weapons. And we believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons."




It's clear from the context that what Cheney was claiming was that Hussein had "reconstituted" his nuclear weapons program, not that he had in fact acquired such weapons. For one thing, it makes no sense to say that he "reconstituted" nuclear weapons. What could it mean? To "reconstitute" is to constitute again, that is, to create again, which would imply that Hussein had possessed nuclear weapons, lost them somehow, and then rebuilt them. However, it's clear from the short history that Cheney gives--as well as from statements that he makes elsewhere in the same interview--that he is denying that Hussein had previously acquired nuclear weapons.



The transcript of this interview says at the beginning that it is "a rush transcript" and that "accuracy is not guaranteed". I don't have access to a recording of this interview, but I suspect that the transcript was garbled at the sentence in question. Cheney either said, or meant to say, that Hussein had reconstituted his nuclear weapons program, that is, rebuilt it since it was disrupted by the Gulf War and the subsequent UN inspections. (If any reader does have a recording of this interview, please let me know how accurate the transcript appears to be at this point in the interview.)



A further piece of evidence that Noah and Milbank have misleadingly quoted Cheney out of context is provided by the following comment at the end of Milbank's "Verbatim" item, the original source for the two quotes: "aides later said Cheney was referring to Saddam Hussein's nuclear programs, not weapons".



I assume that Noah never bothered to read the complete transcript that he links to, or he would be the one guilty of a "whopper".



Sources:


Timothy Noah, "Whopper of the Week: Donald Rumsfeld", Slate, 5/23/2003



"Transcript for March 16", NBC News' Meet the Press, 3/16/2003



Dana Milbank, "Verbatim", The Washington Post, 5/20/2003



Quoting Out of Context
 
ariolanine said:
Sorry guys but this is leftist spin only. This link will explain it.

http://gncurtis.home.texas.net/blogger.html


Sunday, May 25, 2003
( 7:25 PM ) Gary Curtis
Where's the Beef? Timothy Noah's "Whopper of the Week" feature on Slate for Friday consists of the following two quotes:


"'I don't believe anyone that I know in the administration ever said that Iraq had nuclear weapons.'

--Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, at a hearing of the Senate's appropriations subcommittee on defense, May 14


"'We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons.'

--Vice President Dick Cheney on 'NBC's Meet the Press', March 16"




According to Noah's definition, a "whopper" is an unambiguously false statement taken together with its refutation. So, in this case, Rumsfeld's statement is the supposedly false statement refuted by Cheney's earlier statement. To refute Rumsfeld's statement, Cheney must have been saying that Iraq had nuclear weapons. However, Cheney's statement is rather obscure, especially because of the use of the word "reconstituted". What does he mean by claiming that "he"--Saddam Hussein--has "reconstituted" nuclear weapons? Here's the context of Cheney's strange remark, taken from the transcript of the interview:



TIM RUSSERT: "What do you think is the most important rationale for going to war with Iraq?


VICE PRESIDENT CHENEY: "Well, I think I've just given it, Tim, in terms of the combination of his development and use of chemical weapons, his development of biological weapons, his pursuit of nuclear weapons.



RUSSERT: "And even though the International Atomic Energy Agency said he does not have a nuclear program, we disagree?



CHENEY: "I disagree, yes. ... Let's talk about the nuclear proposition for a minute. ... In the late '70s, Saddam Hussein acquired nuclear reactors from the French. 1981, the Israelis took out the Osirak reactor and stopped his nuclear weapons development at the time. Throughout the '80s, he mounted a new effort. I was told when I was defense secretary before the Gulf War that he was eight to 10 years away from a nuclear weapon. And we found out after the Gulf War that he was within one or two years of having a nuclear weapon because he had a massive effort under way that involved four or five different technologies for enriching uranium to produce fissile material. We know that based on intelligence that he has been very, very good at hiding these kinds of efforts. He's had years to get good at it and we know he has been absolutely devoted to trying to acquire nuclear weapons. And we believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons."




It's clear from the context that what Cheney was claiming was that Hussein had "reconstituted" his nuclear weapons program, not that he had in fact acquired such weapons. For one thing, it makes no sense to say that he "reconstituted" nuclear weapons. What could it mean? To "reconstitute" is to constitute again, that is, to create again, which would imply that Hussein had possessed nuclear weapons, lost them somehow, and then rebuilt them. However, it's clear from the short history that Cheney gives--as well as from statements that he makes elsewhere in the same interview--that he is denying that Hussein had previously acquired nuclear weapons.



The transcript of this interview says at the beginning that it is "a rush transcript" and that "accuracy is not guaranteed". I don't have access to a recording of this interview, but I suspect that the transcript was garbled at the sentence in question. Cheney either said, or meant to say, that Hussein had reconstituted his nuclear weapons program, that is, rebuilt it since it was disrupted by the Gulf War and the subsequent UN inspections. (If any reader does have a recording of this interview, please let me know how accurate the transcript appears to be at this point in the interview.)



A further piece of evidence that Noah and Milbank have misleadingly quoted Cheney out of context is provided by the following comment at the end of Milbank's "Verbatim" item, the original source for the two quotes: "aides later said Cheney was referring to Saddam Hussein's nuclear programs, not weapons".



I assume that Noah never bothered to read the complete transcript that he links to, or he would be the one guilty of a "whopper".



Sources:


Timothy Noah, "Whopper of the Week: Donald Rumsfeld", Slate, 5/23/2003



"Transcript for March 16", NBC News' Meet the Press, 3/16/2003



Dana Milbank, "Verbatim", The Washington Post, 5/20/2003



Quoting Out of Context

Yes, thats what I said on the first page, but unfortunately only Cheney knows what he meant at the time.
 
Frackal said:
Didnt anyone like my Rumsfeld pic

Haha I just noticed that, almost wet myself.:)

I have seen one of Clinton when he was president during the whole Lewinsky scandal, where he is giving a speech and he makes the sex animation with his hands (where he makes a hole with his finger and tumb then moves his other finger inside it.)
 
Sometimes a person has to lie and I find that generally excusable. If they lied for the hell of it without just fucking around, ie, internet bullshit, well then, they should be shot.
 
Jesus christ, are we going to debate this shit forever? Very simple meatheads. 9/11 = excuse for anything. Bush=big business/oil. Iraq=oil galare. Say no more. Bush should be thown in jail. In saudi arabia.
 
Actually I think that pic was taken during today's episode of Bill O'Reilly, that pretentious fuckwart. More on that later
 
Bulldog_10 said:


No...but it gets a little rediculous when no one has anything good to say.

Unless the Sheeple stand up for their Country there will be no country for them to stand up for and it sure as hell won't protect them when shit hits the fan and the original Declaration of Independence and Constitution are buring in their Nuclear Blast Proof Vaults!
 
gettinlarger said:
Canadians sure do post a lot about American politicians.

america is the world hegemon didnt you know?

american politics shape canadian politics.

For instance look at the stunted push to decriminalize marijuana in canada, something i'm all for even though i don't live in canada.
 
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