R-ALA and CLA interactions READ THIS

[bebaumax]

I'm cross-posting this to the Anabolic Board / Supplements board. I've tried to read most of what's posted on these boards, but I could only find ONE abstract that came out and said R-ALA is better than ALA. And nothing seemed to make me want to spend 3-5 times as much money on it. Check out (most importantly) the findings here on R-ALA, and then consider the addition of CLA.

Please, if anyone has some understandable scientific data (other than the single abstract "Differential effects of lipoic acid stereoisomers on glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant skeletal muscle. Am J Physiol, 25(4):E185-91 1997 Jul" that I seem to find everyone quoting, please post it.


http://www.blc.arizona.edu/UBRP/conference02/abstracts/79.html

Abstract pasted here:


Interactions of Conjugated-Linoleic Acid and Alpha-Lipoic Acid on Insulin Action in the Insulin-resistant Obese Zucker Rat.
Taylor ZC, Teachey MK, Saengsirisuwan V, O’Keefe MP, and Henriksen EJ, Muscle Metabolism Laboratory, Department of Physiology, University of Arizona College of Medicine, Tucson, AZ

The essential fatty acid conjugated-linoleic acid (CLA) and the antioxidant R-alpha-lipoic acid (R-ALA) individually have been shown to enhance glucose tolerance and insulin action on skeletal muscle glucose transport in insulin-resistant states. However, to date, no study has assessed the potential interactions between these two interventions in treating insulin resistance. Therefore, the purpose of this study was to assess the interactions of low doses of CLA and R-ALA on whole-body insulin sensitivity and insulin-stimulated glucose transport in skeletal muscle of the insulin-resistant obese Zucker (fa/fa) rat. Female obese Zucker rats (~7-8 wk old) were treated with either vehicle or submaximal doses of CLA (0.3 g/kg body wt) or R-ALA (10 mg/kg), individually and in combination, for 21 days. The glucose-insulin index, an indirect indicator of whole-body insulin sensitivity derived from an oral glucose tolerance test, was not altered by this dose of R-ALA compared to the vehicle-treated control group. However, CLA alone caused a 17% decrease (p<0.05) in this variable, indicating an enhancement of insulin sensitivity. The greatest improvement in whole-body insulin sensitivity was associated with the combination treatment, as the largest decrease (21%) in the glucose-insulin index was observed. Insulin-mediated (5 mU/ml) glucose transport activity (as assessed by in vitro 2-deoxyglucose uptake) in both the type I soleus and the type IIb epitrochlearis was not altered by treatment with R-ALA. CLA induced a 37% increase in insulin-mediated glucose transport in the epitrochlearis only. Most importantly, the combination of R-ALA and CLA induced the greatest improvements in insulin-mediated glucose transport in both the epitrochlearis (77%) and the soleus (54%) muscles. These results suggest that R-ALA and CLA treatment in combination improves whole-body insulin sensitivity and insulin-stimulated glucose transport activity in skeletal muscle of the insulin-resistant obese Zucker rat to a greater degree than either intervention individually. (Supported by BASF AG, Ludwigshafen, Germany (EJH) and the University of Arizona Undergraduate Biology Research Program (ZCT).)

-B

 

[bebaumax]

I HATE wasting money:

Be sure to read the Negative Results and Limitations section. Are any of you Insulin-Resistant? I didn't think so... Any of you over 45 or 50? Again...

I just realized something. I'm quoting from a lot of the same sources that people are using to show how great RLA is. I'm noticing there is evidence in both directions, but there is NO CLEAR ANSWER. These folks just decided not to include the RLA-negative and/or SLA-positive findings, or the limitations. I have only copy/pasted most of what is SLA/RLA equal or SLA-supportive. Some of what I have here supports RLA.

Why not post the links to where you're getting this information???

Let us read ALL OF IT, and decided for ourselves. If you look at this link, there are 15 SLA limitations listed that, if read alone, would have you avoiding regular old ALA like the PLAGUE!!! If you read the whole thing, I mean EVERYTHING, you'll probably come to the conclusion that 900-1000mg/day of ALA is sufficient, less-expensive, and good enough. Until there is further research on Young, healthy, insulin-sensitive, good body-skeletal mass individuals, how can we come to ANY conclusion that RLA is better? All of the data is based on OLD, insulin-resistant, obese rats!!!

If you're an old rat (no, not gym-rat), I HIGHLY recommend you get ahold of CLA, RLA AND SLA, and get started, you're gonna need it! If not, then read everything, and make a decision for yourself. Don't read posts (which are part of everything), and make a decision off what I am beginning to consider hype-freaks.


http://morelife.org/supplements/RLA.html

17 ""In diabetic rats, after 6 weeks of diabetes, 2 weeks of racLPA treatment corrected 20% sciatic motor and 14% saphenous sensory NCV deficits. The ED50 for motor nerve conduction velocity (NCV) restoration was approximately 38 mg kg(-1) day(-1). aLA also corrected a 49% diabetic deficit in sciatic endoneurial blood flow. R and S-LA enantiomers were equipotent in correcting NCV and blood flow deficits. Treatment of diabetic rats with low doses (20 mg kg(-1) day(-1)) of aLA and gamma linolenic acid (GLA), while having modest effects on their own, showed evidence of marked synergistic action in joint treatment, completely correcting motor NCV and blood flow deficits.""

7 "When cultured rat L6 muscle cells were exposed to glucose oxidase and glucose to generate H2O2 and cause oxidative stress, there was a marked decrease in insulin-stimulated glucose transport. Pretreatment with LA over the concentration range of 10-1,000 pmol/l protected the insulin effect from inhibition by H2O2. Both the R and S isomers of LA were equally effective. In addition, oxidative stress caused a significant decrease (approximately 50%) in reduced glutathione concentration, along with the rapid activation of the stress-sensitive p38 mitogen-activated protein kinase. Pretreatment with LA prevented both of these events, coincident with protecting insulin action. These studies indicate that in muscle, the major site of insulin-stimulated glucose disposal, one important effect of LA on the insulin-signaling cascade is to protect cells from oxidative stress-induced insulin resistance."

Negative Results and Limitations
1 "Insulin action was not improved by R-ALA alone, and ET-associated improvements in these variables were not further enhanced with combined ET and R-ALA. Although ET and R-ALA caused reductions in soleus protein carbonyls (an index of oxidative stress), these alterations were not significantly correlated with insulin-mediated soleus glucose transport. These results indicate that the beneficial interactive effects of ET and R-ALA on skeletal muscle insulin action observed previously in insulin-resistant obese Zucker rats are not apparent in insulin-sensitive lean Zucker rats.""

2 "we only observed a beneficial effect of [RLA] only in old and not in young animals."

6 "An intact organ, the isolated perfused rat heart, reduced R-lipoate six to eight times more rapidly than S-lipoate ... On the other hand, erythrocytes, which lack mitochondria, somewhat more actively reduced S- than R-lipoate ... Thus, mechanisms of reduction of alpha-lipoate are highly tissue-specific and effects of exogenously supplied alpha-lipoate are determined by tissue glutathione reductase and dihydrolipoamide dehydrogenase activity"

14 "The reduction of exogenous alpha-lipoic acid to dihydrolipoate by mammalian cells and tissues confers additional antioxidant protection to the cell. Both (R+) and (S-) isomers of alpha-lipoic acid were analyzed as substrates with glutathione reductase from several sources and with mammalian lipoamide dehydrogenase. Mammalian glutathione reductase catalyzed faster reduction of (S)-lipoic acid (1.4-2.4-fold greater activity) than of (R)-lipoic acid, whereas lipoamide dehydrogenase had a very marked preference for (R)-lipoic acid (18-fold greater activity) over (S)-lipoic acid"

Conclusions

4 "RLA is likely to be less harmful and more beneficial than the racemate generally used. "

-B